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After Netflix crackdown on border-hopping, Canadians ready to return to piracy

207 points by nkurz 11y ago

xufi 11y ago
Atleast you can download : for personal use in Canada last I read.
- err4nt 11y ago
  It was ten years ago. I believe this has changed since then…
  - lisivka 11y ago
    It cannot be changed. You can download (watch) any proprietary content (if you can), but you cannot redistribute it to others.
    - msbarnett 11y ago
      Canada signed the TPP, which tadically changes things
      - bluehazed 11y ago
        Signed, not ratified, nor codified anything in law.
- upofadown 11y ago
  I think that you could argue that as long as you download to a medium that has had the copy levy applied then it is OK. That would only work for audio downloaded to things like audio CD-Rs and the like. Interestingly up to a few years ago it was pretty much legal to put stuff up on the internet and let others download it. The Canadian government had to pass a law to specifically address that. The funny thing was that during the period before the law there was an internet legend that downloading was OK and uploading was illegal when in fact it was the opposite. * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_sharing_in_Canada https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_sharing_in_Canada
Geojim 11y ago
Puts pressure back on regional rights holders to sign on with Netflix - join the dominant market player and make a few bucks, or see your content pirated and get nothing
- distances 11y ago
  The whole deal system is a problem here. In Germany even the latest season of House of Cards isn't available, and that's their own production.
  - danmaz74 11y ago
    Production that, I'm pretty sure, they sold to some German network for more than it would bring in on Netflix itself... gotta love economics!
    - slowmotiony 11y ago
      Yup, sold to Sky.
mrmondo 11y ago
The same is happening here in Australia talking to people.
- cylinder 11y ago
  How does that blocking even work? How does nflx know I'm using a VPN?
  - superuser2 11y ago
    Many users on the same IP, IP is registered to a cloud hosting company, etc. They'll never have perfect detection but you can do pretty well without much effort.
    - cylinder 11y ago
      are there VPN out there where you can purchase a static IP of your own for it?
      - superuser2 11y ago
        You can run your own VPN server on a VPS, but Netflix is (rumored to be) blocking the IP address ranges of DigitalOcean, Linode, AWS, etc.
        obrit 11y ago
        I tried running OpenVPN on DigitalOcean and AWS and had no luck with Netflix on either host.
        etatoby 11y ago
        I tried proxying through a server in Germany (in a big, well known hosting provider) and I got the same message, both with ssh -D and pptpd. So they're either reading signatures left on the packets by various VPN / proxy technologies (fragmentation and other obscure metrics), or they're blocking the IP ranges of major hosting providers, or both.
leonatan 11y ago
Good. This is the only way to make the publishers change something.
user10001 11y ago
Hollywood movies are such shit these days, I wouldn't even watch most of them for free.
- Ralfp 11y ago
  Nobody is forcing you to. Plenty of folk have Netflix for access to favorite classics or TV series when they have time to. New titles are only added value for them.
  - omegant 11y ago
    In Spain Netflix has a VERY limited classic (or contemporary for that matter) catalog. Is only worth paying it for series IMHO.
    - rtkwe 11y ago
      That's going to vary wildly from country to country depending on what deals they're able to actually get for content. In the US it's pretty good for watching old shows.
- OSButler 11y ago
  US Netflix has a decent collection of Korean movies for example, where new movies have been added on a regular basis for the past year or so. It's just that the Hollywood content is most prominently displayed on the home page, but if you know what you're looking for, then there may be a few worthwhile sub-categories available for you on Netflix.
wjoe 11y ago
Regional rights agreements are really slowing down the move of TV to online. Publishers say "well, we already signed these agreements with these TV companies, so we can't let this shows be streamed online in those countries". TV companies say "well, we only got the rights to broadcast on TV, so we can't stream the show online in this country". Hopefully as the popularity of online streaming increases, new contracts will take online streaming into account more. There's no real reason to have regional restrictions online, but I'm sure they'll continue as long as the companies want to get more money
- richmarr 11y ago
  > There's no real reason to have regional restrictions online... While I broadly agree with you I don't buy this one point. By restricting availability by region, publishers can (a) spread out their promotion costs & reduce risk exposure, and (b) charge more. Wearing my techno-utopian hat, the first reason is bullshit that nees solving and the second reason is greed. Wearing my realist hat, both reasons are the way the world works and neither seems like it's going to change in short order as publishers hold a monopoly over content. Does anyone know if Netflix delay release of their own content by region?
  - Gmo 11y ago
    They kind of do. At least in France, until about a month ago, you could not watch House of Cards on Netflix because the show was sold to a local network ! It's been "fixed" now though.
- abricot 11y ago
  > Hopefully as the popularity of online streaming increases, new contracts will take online streaming into account more. There's no real reason to have regional restrictions online, but I'm sure they'll continue as long as the companies want to get more money ...and hopefully Netflix will survive until that time.
  - rtkwe 11y ago
    Just a note the spaces in front of your quote completely breaks it on mobile which sees: > Hopefully as the popularity of onli And can't scroll to see the rest.
zamalek 11y ago
The same effect is occurring in South Africa. People I know are switching back to piracy because our Netflix catalog is probably in the region of 10% of America (for the same reasons, as well as others). After years of not being able to legally access some copyrighted content, with no discussion and no change, I honestly don't see the copyright holders backing down - strange considering that they are the only ones actually losing out. Nobody deserves to have their hard work stolen, but I can't lie and deny that I don't perceive some form of justice happening here.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
  - zamalek 11y ago
    * Unshaped and uncapped copper is also available. I'm paying about USD100/mo for this at 10Mbps. Hellkom is "balancing" my line to 6Mbps, but that somehow still caters for two concurrent Netflix streams. * Soft-capped (or uncapped shaped) copper is now available for much lower prices, even at 10Mbps. * Copper bandwidth limits are much higher. For example, 200GB for something like USD15/mo. * Fiber is being rolled out. Slightly more expensive than ADSL and very difficult to get hold of as you need to acquire a specific amount of business in your area. * Mobile data remains a pathetic joke. I wouldn't risk using it for streaming: out-of-bundle it would cost over USD1000 to stream a single HD movie on MTN. It's still not acceptable (even Zimbabwe is far cheaper) but has drastically improved. Most people I know have an account with one of the streaming services.
    - diyorgasms 11y ago
      Wow thanks for the reply. It seems like things are really improving. Here in the USA, we seem to be moving almost backward, with the telecom companies just now implementing caps on previously uncapped connections, and fighting against the deployment of next generation infrastructure.
- instakill 11y ago
  I use getflix and it still works. The ZA selection is a joke.
tech-no-logical 11y ago
I must say I've been considering the same thing (I'm in the netherlands). for now, there's still ways to watch the US version of netflix, but should that too be blocked, I will probably revert to piracy, even though I've been against it for a long time...
sgift 11y ago
The only reason I subscribed to Netflix was that it was the best way to get Warehouse 13, which I really wanted to see at the time. For now Netflix still has enough content to satisfy me, but the idea that the library is so much smaller here in Germany than in the U.S. was never to my liking .. Greedy companies force Netflix to block customers, customers pirate content instead, all loose. One would think Hollywood learned their lesson, just as the music industry did, but it doesn't look that way. Maybe one day they'll find out that the correct solution if you ran against a wall is not do it again and hope that the wall falls, but to go around it.
- themartorana 11y ago
  It's never been well explained to me how this is a profitable model, especially considering the ease with which popular shows are pirated - in full HD and digital sound I might add. What do studios really stand to gain by keeping Germany et al from so much content?
  - sgift 11y ago
    They sell it over different channels (Amazon Prime, DVD, etc.) and somehow seem to think that people will use more than one to get all content they want. They probably do this to get better rates from Netflix, e.g. "You know, if you don't pay us x we can always give our content someone else". To me this sounds like madness, I would never use multiple streaming services, but I'm not an Hollywood exec, so maybe there is some method to the madness that I'm not able to see.
    - joshuacc 11y ago
      FWIW, I regularly use Netflix, Amazon Prime, and YouTube. In the past I would also use iTunes.
  - rhino369 11y ago
    Why is everyone assuming that greedy German companies aren't willing to sell? Is it also possible that Netflix isn't willing to pay the going rate or hasn't bothered to negotiate for the rights. Netflix launched globally without taking the time to negotiate content for most countries on earth. I'm not sure you can assume that Netflix is being diligent in trying to acquire content. Especially since even in the USA netlix appears to be pivoting into being a content creator instead of a content aggregator.
secoif 11y ago
Same issue in Singapore. The Netflix library available here doesn't even contain the latest season of House of Cards – and it's a bloody Netflix production. I would love to pay someone for timely content, but now that Netflix is blocking vpn access there is literally nobody to pay. It's complete madness.
- dogma1138 11y ago
  Netflix doesn't own house of cards actually, it exclusive rights to it in some countries in others it doesn't.
  - maze-le 11y ago
    Since it is a production of them, is seems utterly moronic to remove one of the main reasons people would join their services in the first place. Many non-us customers joined, just to cancel the account right after they realized that they had no access to the good content. In some cases this is not the fault of netflix, but that of 19th century copyright laws. I cannot blame them, when other services had the rights prior to them... But 'House of Cards' is a Netflix production, and this doesn't apply here. They would have done themselfs a favour by not selling the rights to this content to the highest bidder. Especially since their ads suggest access to 'House of Cards'.
    - drspacemonkey 11y ago
      The problem comes from the original BBC House of Cards. Netflix doesn't actually own the rights, they're licensed from a company called Media Rights Capital.
      - bryanlarsen 11y ago
        Netflix funded production, so would have had strong leverage over MRC's relicensing. We can't see the contracts, but I'm fairly confident that Netflix would have had at least right of first refusal for rights for any region.
thrusong 11y ago
We're in Canada and have been cable cutters for almost five years now. We've gotten by on Netflix US and YouTube with the occasional pirated streaming site, but we're barely ever using Netflix anymore. We've turned to Kodi. We don't want to pirate, but it's hard to make a compelling argument against it when you get everything you want even easier than torrents. Add to that the abusive monopolies of Shaw and Bell, who each now have their own streaming subscriptions, services like Hulu and HBO Now either being blocked here or controlled by Shaw or Bell, and the Netlix subscription increasing by 50% in May for a lacklustre catalogue. With all of that, the three movies I go to the cinema to see each month, and my Netflix subscription, it's hard not to feel like I pay my share for content. Not a popular opinion, I'm sure, but I'm not getting a dozen streaming services subscriptions.
- kejaed 11y ago
  What's wrong with Bell/Saw/Rogers having their own streaming services? I've found Bell's Crave TV to be pretty good, Shomi not as much.
  - Cuuugi 11y ago
    Crave TV has great content, but they have been very frustrating for me technically. Random drops in the stream, session cookies getting corrupted (they only recently allow password changes from their site).
    - kejaed 11y ago
      Agree with that 100%. Any time I've had to use web/iOS apps for Crave, I've wondered what is up with Bell Media's software people. The TSN app is just as poor, especially compared to what Rogers' Sportsnet app is doing on iOS.
  - pmelendez 11y ago
    May I ask what you don't like about Shomi? Is it the content?
planetjones 11y ago
I am an English person living in Switzerland. Netflix Switzerland is useless to me (no House of Cards, not enough focus on UK and USA content, etc.). Therefore I had a Netflix USA account, which I accessed via unblock-us. The clampdown by Netflix has been "successful" and I now can't access Netflix USA using unblock-us. This happened halfway through watching House of Cards. So my choice was either stop watching or download the remaining episodes... I am tired of companies talking about borderless trade, global economy, etc. when the distribution of movies and tv shows is stuck in the sad world of geo-restrictions. I also legally get access to UK TV channels through my cable subscription, but I don't get access to iPlayer as that's only for UK residents... so again the only option to catch-up on TV that I forgot to record, is to use an unblocker.
- kennywinker 11y ago
  This blows my mind. How on earth does Netflix not have the rights to show their own show in Switzerland? I understand their hands are sometimes tied in getting content from the studios, but they own House of Cards... I'm so confused how they could end up in that situation...
  - detaro 11y ago
    Simple: They sold exclusive rights in quite a few countries to TV networks before they expanded there.
    - michaelbuckbee 11y ago
      Not disagreeing, but it still seems odd as the Netflix Original Content is the big carrot to get people hooked into their ecosystem.
      - detaro 11y ago
        I can only assume they didn't plan to expand this quickly and would have lost a lot of money by adding "in case we are in this market by then" clauses to the contracts. But yes, it certainly leaves a strange impression.
thinkMOAR 11y ago
Wonder when the first person stands up and claim this is blatant racism/ discrimination. Because it literally is. 'oh you come from this country and you have netflix? -- oops then you cannot see because you are canadian/european/ whoever' Media copyrightrights per country, its 2016 its insane release your media globally or don't release it at all.
- dogma1138 11y ago
  Don't blame Netflix blame those countries because they are the ones which prevent titles from being released as they have local companies that bought the distribution rights.
  - thinkMOAR 11y ago
    The topic of this thread is Netflix, and i have personal experience with these limits of netflix, hence i referred to them. Though it applies to all such parties. And netflix being the biggest could certainly 'make a fist' and get some stuff done. And since Netflix is such a big party, they have blame too.
- CosmicShadow 11y ago
  It sure is how it feels. Facebook trending: look at this awesome SNL clip the world is laughing and talking about! Click on it, oh sorry, you can't watch this in Canada, but hey, the rest of the world that matters can(read: the US), so yeah, good bye. Any content provider that blocks you out based on your location makes you feel discriminated against and it sucks! I like how Netflix says that we are very vocal, but minor and 'inconsequential'. Well yeah, fuck you too!
  - rchaud 11y ago
    I don't agree that that's the case. To me, region-restrictions for US content (the most popular worldwide) present a massive opportunity for content creators not based in the US to make something that is in fact truly globally available. While it's true that US TV and movies have been globally popular since the time of their invention, the rise of YouTube, Vine, Instagram etc. show that global audiences can be developed without needing to be US centric. Your comment "this awesome clip the world is laughing and talking about" refers to SNL, but there are examples of viral videos that didn't originate from a big-name US studio. "Charlie bit my finger" and "Gangnam Style" are two examples. I don't think it's too much of a stretch that English-language long-form content (30-60 minute series) can be developed without having a "Made in America" imprimatur on it. Danish crime shows are popular in Europe and the UK, while Korean dramas are extremely popular in East Asian markets. Indian cinema is also popular in the Middle East, North Africa and parts of Southeast Asia. A small slice of British shows like Made in Chelsea have carved out a niche in English-speaking markets like the US, Canada and Australia. I hope production studios large and small across the world are seeing this as an opportunity to expand past their borders rather than simply continue "Business as usual" under the protectionism offered with these types of restrictive licensing rules.
cdnsteve 11y ago
Content geofencing makes no sense. Until businesses realize this people will always find ways around it.
- rhino369 11y ago
  It makes a lot of sense for the world we live in now. Most revenue from TV is still captured by regular broadcast or cable viewership. Those means of distribution are typically geofenced. If you have an American show, Sky or BBC will pay more than Netflix will. Plus, people in developing countries can't and won't pay western prices for content. It makes sense to geofence and then sell it to them much cheaper.
  - russdill 11y ago
    But in most cases here, people are willing to pay the same price as the original country of origin of the content but are denied that option.
lostgame 11y ago
I ended up having the conversation with a co-worker...I live in Canada, and anyone who lives up here can back me up on the fact that this country is just awful with regards to its copyright litigation with regards to television, especially. It's far, far easier for me to pirate content than it is to legally buy it. Until that's the case, I'm not interested in forking over my money to be inconvenienced (and this is coming from a dude who buys his music mainly on vinyl).
- guiomie 11y ago
  Wait, you are justifying an illegal action of yours because it is easier than the legal route? Since when doing the right thing is and should always be easier... So, do you also not pay income tax because it is much easier to not do so? There are countless examples where being illegal is easier over legal, but as a society some of us understand that if the majority respect the law and order, we are much better off. I'm Canadian, and I certainly don't back you up on this. I use Netflix, Crave, my providers VoD service, independent and mainstream theaters to consume content all the time. When I realize I've spent more then I should on entertainment, I simply find other stuff to do or consume. Is it really about being "easier" and not about being cheap? Personally, I find it quite easy to swipe my credit card or link it to a Google Play account. I am amazed to read this under the caption of articles picture: "Netflix customer Susan Lorenz of Toronto doesn't understand why the company is suddenly shutting her out from the content she used to be able to see." ... Susan most certainly understands why.
  - Grishnakh 11y ago
    No, she doesn't understand why. Maybe you can enlighten us. She used to pay hard cash for access to Netflix (the US version), and watched US content legally. Now she's being prevented from that. If the content creator doesn't want to sell access to the content for you, then you have every right to access it through other means. They never had to cut off access to these non-US customers: they were paying good money for this service, the same money as someone in America. Why shouldn't they be allowed access? Why is their money not as good as an American's money? Don't forget, we have a Free Trade treaty between Canada and the US. They're not practicing free trade here as the treaty states, so she has every right to work around it.
cazum 11y ago
What exactly does Netflix stand to gain from making it harder for its non-american subscribers to VPN the geoblocked content? Surely they must have predicted a substantial drop in subscription rates as soon as people realize they can't watch the good stuff. It just seems like international-marketshare suicide.
- fossuser 11y ago
  My guess is that Netflix has now positioned themselves as the first global 'television' network. They hopefully have enough power and leverage to stop the content producers from stupidly restricting access via region, but they're not able to do this effectively if users can easily bypass the restrictions. If it doesn't work out then at least they'll get a global audience for their own content and the rest will go back to piracy.
  - skykooler 11y ago
    They don't even have a global audience for their own content - House of Cards isn't available in many countries because Netflix sold the TV networks exclusive distribution.
- pjc50 11y ago
  I suspect they were given ultimatum(s) from the content copyright holders, and decided to keep the content but lose the international viewers. Then this can be used as leverage in the ongoing negotiations.
- petra 11y ago
  In order to make content companies cooperate with them on international expansion, i assume content creators demanded this, so they could still play the old game of selling content differently in different places - with a simple reasoning - more control = more revenues.
- rtkwe 11y ago
  The deals they've signed with companies allow them to distribute shows X, Y, & Z in say the US other companies have the rights to that same show in Canada or the UK. Netflix can't just distribute the copyrighted content wherever they want and keep the media creating companies they rely on for content coming back to renew deals.
nicolas_t 11y ago
I still can access netflix through the VPN I use. As long as I still can do that, I will keep my account. The second they block it, I'll cancel my netflix account and will go back to resorting to piracy. If movie studios don't want my money then so be it, I'll find better use for it. EDIT: And I say this as someone who spends roughly $100/month supporting artists I like on Patreon and Kickstarter, so I'm not opposed to paying for content. I'm just opposed to big media conglomerates screwing me.
- OSButler 11y ago
  Their blocking seems to be quite aggressive, as a lot of regular hosting providers even had their IP ranges blocked by them. I've been following a few forum posts where people were sharing their working VPN provider/ISP, but those were showing the same error message a few days later, so it looks like they are actively monitoring traffic and maybe even social media to block further IP ranges.
  - rabidrabbit 11y ago
    I was not able to test it (for example borrowing a residential IP in a different country) but I suspect they detect OpenVPN via packets inspection, like this example: "Detecting VPN (and its configuration!) and proxy users on the server side" by @ValdikSS https://medium.com/@ValdikSS/detecting-vpn-and-its-configuration-and-proxy-users-on-the-server-side-1bcc59742413#.forbbpie6 https://medium.com/@ValdikSS/detecting-vpn-and-its-configura...
- justinhj 11y ago
  How are they screwing you? You pay for a Netflix sub in the country you live in, and you're paying only for the content they can license there. By making sure people can't watch whatever country they want easily, they make it easier to negotiate with license holders.
  - jsutton 11y ago
    They're screwing you because, while everyone pays the same price for the same service, the library that you have access to depends entirely on what side of the border you're on. This makes absolutely no sense in a globally connected world.
pinkskip 11y ago
Same here downunder. Loved my Netflix US subscription. Now I have no subscription with Netflix guess they don't want money ey?
byuu 11y ago
I've been rather stunned at how no one has come up with a strong workaround to this yet. It's really quite simple, we just need slick, easy-to-use software for it. Make software that both turns your home computer into a single-user VPN server, that lets you set the maximum upload bandwidth to ~5mbit/s or so, and lets you only pass through Netflix content; and also gives you a VPN client that lets you connect to another's computer and only uses the VPN for Netflix content, allowing your web browser and everything else to continue working through your regular ISP. The whitelisting eliminates the traditional concern of someone using your connection for torrents or worse illegal content. The bandwidth limiting ensures smooth QoS for your own network. Latency here is not a concern at all ... it's streaming video. Once you have this software, it's simply a matter of setting up a message forum somewhere where people say, "I am from 'country X' and want to watch content from 'country Y'", and waiting for someone in the reverse situation to come along. As long as your connections are always-on, this works perfectly. As an alternative to the fact that more people will want US Netflix than any other region, people could also offer server-only access for nominal Paypal fees. Eg lease out a 5mbit/s link for $10/mo. The price would naturally follow supply and demand. I can change my IP any time, and there is no possible way Netflix can ban my hostmask as a VPN (all of Time Warner Cable in Columbus, Ohio.) And if this forces Netflix to start charging by billing region ... good!! Now we can offer services that let people pay for the regions they want to access! Or if they try and block that too, then perhaps people sharing VPNs can share their account logins next. Either way, this is a cat-and-mouse game with a very clear end-game. Why the hell is no one working on this problem? There are millions of people affected by this VPN block nonsense. On that note, I have a US 300/20 connection I'd be happy to share, and I can do the software the hard way with BSD/pf. Is there anyone with an always-on JP connection that would like to trade with me? I would also be willing to pay someone for a residential ISP VPN connection in Japan, which I would use exclusively for Netflix only. I'd really love to be able to use Netflix Japan again; it's helped a lot with my listening comprehension in studying the language. (Side note: this proxy software wouldn't have to be just Netflix. It could be a wonderful anti-geolocking system. The major VPN and VPS models are clearly detectable and blockable. This could allow fine-grained whitelisting or blacklisting and decentralization of VPN services.)
- dijit 11y ago
randommodnar 11y ago
Well, I've cancelled my account. Who needs Netflix when I've got BitTorrent?
ericfrederich 11y ago
Popcorn Time should publish some graphs of their traffic. I bet there will be a correlation between Netflix blocking proxies and downloads of Popcorn Time
- deskamess 11y ago
  I thought Popcorn Time had shut down?
  - atemerev 11y ago
    The domain was shut down. Big deal. The source code is still on Github, and new mirrors appear every once and then.
  - JTon 11y ago
    If I recall correctly the original project did close down and others picked up where it left off. Some good, some malicious. I use this subreddit to find a trusted one: https://www.reddit.com/r/PopCornTime/ https://www.reddit.com/r/PopCornTime/ https://popcorntime.sh https://popcorntime.sh
bryanlarsen 11y ago
Netflix really screwed up with House of Cards. They should be able to take the high ground and say: "Don't get mad at us, they're making us do it. We're leading by example, maybe someday everybody will realize that regional restrictions are a bad idea." But their licensing and handling of House of Cards prevents them from taking the moral high ground.
qwertymaster 11y ago
After years of using netflix, since long before it was even available in Germany, I canceled my account the moment I couldn't access the US library anymore. The German library is just not worth it and titles were often missing English subtitles, even for movies which were available on US netflix with subtitles. As I usually watch shows with english subtitles (including shows in english) and original audio, this really bothered me and made the non-US experience even worse. Never really watched many of the German shows on there, maybe one or two.
NovaS1X 11y ago
Piracy has always been a convenience problem and only partly a cost problem. Pirating content is the easiest, fastest, highest quality, and most available method of watching content. The price is just a nice bonus. Digital restrictions hurt everyone and maybe one day Hollywood will wake up and realize that you can't strong-arm the market into behaving how you want it to and you have to adapt to consumer demand. It's one of the few industries that I know of that try this hard to fight against consumer demand. It's so backwards. Until the day they change, pirate on.
- mmanfrin 11y ago
  Yep -- I want to watch tv shows on the night they come out so I can talk with friends about them the day after. Nearly every per-episode-purchase vendor lists them the day after (most likely because the networks that air the shows require them to wait). It's dumb, and all it does is push me away from paying them more than they'd make on advertising from me anyway.
make3 11y ago
I see no statistics. This article is air.
kinofcain 11y ago
But violating the license terms by border hopping is piracy. Not saying I agree with geo restrictions, or any of the other silliness (I don't, and thankfully we're rapidly moving away from that sort of thing), but using VPNs or foreign credit cards to subscribe to a service that isn't available to you because the company selling it doesn't have a license to do so is still, technically, piracy.
- anExcitedBeast 11y ago
  Sure, but piracy where everyone gets paid.
  - rhino369 11y ago
    No, piracy where the service provider you subscribe to gets paid, but the rightful license holders don't. Sometimes the license holder and the service provider are the same, in which case everyone gets paid. But in most cases you aren't. Sure you pay netflix, but netflix just keeps the money. They definitely don't go find and pay the right people.
- Johnny555 11y ago
  That is certainly an ethical gray area -- an strong argument could be made that paying for content (even when you pay extra to view out-of-area content by using a VPN) is not piracy at all since the content owner is still getting paid for his content. (you're still paying a fair price for the content even though the content owner might have gotten more (or less) money for his content had you viewed it in your own country). It may be against the law in your country (or the country that hosts the content), but that doesn't neccessarily mean it's piracy) Much like how visiting Canada to purchase much cheaper prescription drugs is not "stealing" drugs even though it means that drug manufacturers are getting less revenue than if you bought the drugs in the USA. (I'll admit being guilty of that one when my mother was on an expensive prescription drug that was not covered under her insurance plan. I helped her source the same drug for 20% of the cost at a Canadian Pharmacy, otherwise she couldn't have afforded it and would have had to use a less effective substitute (with more side effects) that was covered under insurance.
unabridged 11y ago
Why does netflix care so much? Doesn't just blocking ip's by country satisfy whatever legal requirement? Do the contracts with content provider specifically require netflix to maintain a list of VPN providers and block them?
gshulegaard 11y ago
A lot of people seem angry about the geo-blocking, and I would agree with the sentiment, but can anyone tell me why Netflix is geo-blocking so heavily? Companies don't do things for no reason...
- kstenerud 11y ago
  Because content producers are threatening to remove their support of Netflix.
  - gshulegaard 11y ago
    Which is what I thought...so why the Netflix hate? Shouldn't we be instead be getting angry at the copyright holders essentially exercising monopolistic control of the market?
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - atemerev 11y ago
      Isn't everybody already?
blue_dinner 11y ago
We can say the same about taxes and regulations: if it's too high, individuals will just go elsewhere. For some reason, we always try to punish the individuals that do this. Piracy will only continue to make it more difficult for small and mid-sized companies to compete. The multi-national corporations will always have the resources to wait out the slaughter. The end result will be the same as what we have with the music industry: huge companies owning all of the media.
brendangregg 11y ago
"We look forward to offering all of our content everywhere and to consumers being able to enjoy all of Netflix without using a proxy. That’s the goal we will keep pushing towards." -- David Fullagar is Vice President of Content Delivery Architecture at Netflix. https://media.netflix.com/en/company-blog/evolving-proxy-detection-as-a-global-service https://media.netflix.com/en/company-blog/evolving-proxy-det...
cbaleanu 11y ago
Same story here, but I have been living in Eastern Europe and then Australia and then back for a few years now, paying for unblock-us and Netflix US which I signed up for while in the US. Ever since my first experience with Netflix powered by a Roku I have been praising how awesome it is, trying to get my friends to sign up for the service. And then the geofencing crap happened but the service was suddenly available in our country, but with minus 90 percent of the content - a lot of my friends signed up and then cancelled their subscription. I for one am seriously thinking about canceling both unblock-us and Netflix as I suddenly feel a 'localized' citizen with no way to legally we global anymore and it sucks.
xg15 11y ago
Imagine I live in Canada and one day drive to the US and purchase a House of Cards DVD, which I take back with me to Canada. Would you consider what I just did piracy? No? Then why is it piracy if I do the exact same thing by different technical means? (Streaming the content instead of buying a physical disk)

207 points by nkurz 11y ago

xufi 11y ago

Atleast you can download : for personal use in Canada last I read.

err4nt 11y ago
It was ten years ago. I believe this has changed since then…
- lisivka 11y ago
  It cannot be changed. You can download (watch) any proprietary content (if you can), but you cannot redistribute it to others.
  - msbarnett 11y ago
    Canada signed the TPP, which tadically changes things
    - bluehazed 11y ago
      Signed, not ratified, nor codified anything in law.
upofadown 11y ago
I think that you could argue that as long as you download to a medium that has had the copy levy applied then it is OK. That would only work for audio downloaded to things like audio CD-Rs and the like. Interestingly up to a few years ago it was pretty much legal to put stuff up on the internet and let others download it. The Canadian government had to pass a law to specifically address that. The funny thing was that during the period before the law there was an internet legend that downloading was OK and uploading was illegal when in fact it was the opposite. * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_sharing_in_Canada https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_sharing_in_Canada

Geojim 11y ago

Puts pressure back on regional rights holders to sign on with Netflix - join the dominant market player and make a few bucks, or see your content pirated and get nothing

distances 11y ago
The whole deal system is a problem here. In Germany even the latest season of House of Cards isn't available, and that's their own production.
- danmaz74 11y ago
  Production that, I'm pretty sure, they sold to some German network for more than it would bring in on Netflix itself... gotta love economics!
  - slowmotiony 11y ago
    Yup, sold to Sky.

mrmondo 11y ago

The same is happening here in Australia talking to people.

cylinder 11y ago
How does that blocking even work? How does nflx know I'm using a VPN?
- superuser2 11y ago
  Many users on the same IP, IP is registered to a cloud hosting company, etc. They'll never have perfect detection but you can do pretty well without much effort.
  - cylinder 11y ago
    are there VPN out there where you can purchase a static IP of your own for it?
    - superuser2 11y ago
      You can run your own VPN server on a VPS, but Netflix is (rumored to be) blocking the IP address ranges of DigitalOcean, Linode, AWS, etc.
      - obrit 11y ago
        I tried running OpenVPN on DigitalOcean and AWS and had no luck with Netflix on either host.
      - etatoby 11y ago
        I tried proxying through a server in Germany (in a big, well known hosting provider) and I got the same message, both with ssh -D and pptpd. So they're either reading signatures left on the packets by various VPN / proxy technologies (fragmentation and other obscure metrics), or they're blocking the IP ranges of major hosting providers, or both.

leonatan 11y ago

Good. This is the only way to make the publishers change something.

user10001 11y ago

Hollywood movies are such shit these days, I wouldn't even watch most of them for free.

Ralfp 11y ago
Nobody is forcing you to. Plenty of folk have Netflix for access to favorite classics or TV series when they have time to. New titles are only added value for them.
- omegant 11y ago
  In Spain Netflix has a VERY limited classic (or contemporary for that matter) catalog. Is only worth paying it for series IMHO.
  - rtkwe 11y ago
    That's going to vary wildly from country to country depending on what deals they're able to actually get for content. In the US it's pretty good for watching old shows.
OSButler 11y ago
US Netflix has a decent collection of Korean movies for example, where new movies have been added on a regular basis for the past year or so. It's just that the Hollywood content is most prominently displayed on the home page, but if you know what you're looking for, then there may be a few worthwhile sub-categories available for you on Netflix.

wjoe 11y ago

Regional rights agreements are really slowing down the move of TV to online. Publishers say "well, we already signed these agreements with these TV companies, so we can't let this shows be streamed online in those countries". TV companies say "well, we only got the rights to broadcast on TV, so we can't stream the show online in this country". Hopefully as the popularity of online streaming increases, new contracts will take online streaming into account more. There's no real reason to have regional restrictions online, but I'm sure they'll continue as long as the companies want to get more money

richmarr 11y ago
> There's no real reason to have regional restrictions online... While I broadly agree with you I don't buy this one point. By restricting availability by region, publishers can (a) spread out their promotion costs & reduce risk exposure, and (b) charge more. Wearing my techno-utopian hat, the first reason is bullshit that nees solving and the second reason is greed. Wearing my realist hat, both reasons are the way the world works and neither seems like it's going to change in short order as publishers hold a monopoly over content. Does anyone know if Netflix delay release of their own content by region?
- Gmo 11y ago
  They kind of do. At least in France, until about a month ago, you could not watch House of Cards on Netflix because the show was sold to a local network ! It's been "fixed" now though.
abricot 11y ago
> Hopefully as the popularity of online streaming increases, new contracts will take online streaming into account more. There's no real reason to have regional restrictions online, but I'm sure they'll continue as long as the companies want to get more money ...and hopefully Netflix will survive until that time.
- rtkwe 11y ago
  Just a note the spaces in front of your quote completely breaks it on mobile which sees: > Hopefully as the popularity of onli And can't scroll to see the rest.

zamalek 11y ago

The same effect is occurring in South Africa. People I know are switching back to piracy because our Netflix catalog is probably in the region of 10% of America (for the same reasons, as well as others). After years of not being able to legally access some copyrighted content, with no discussion and no change, I honestly don't see the copyright holders backing down - strange considering that they are the only ones actually losing out. Nobody deserves to have their hard work stolen, but I can't lie and deny that I don't perceive some form of justice happening here.

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
- zamalek 11y ago
  * Unshaped and uncapped copper is also available. I'm paying about USD100/mo for this at 10Mbps. Hellkom is "balancing" my line to 6Mbps, but that somehow still caters for two concurrent Netflix streams. * Soft-capped (or uncapped shaped) copper is now available for much lower prices, even at 10Mbps. * Copper bandwidth limits are much higher. For example, 200GB for something like USD15/mo. * Fiber is being rolled out. Slightly more expensive than ADSL and very difficult to get hold of as you need to acquire a specific amount of business in your area. * Mobile data remains a pathetic joke. I wouldn't risk using it for streaming: out-of-bundle it would cost over USD1000 to stream a single HD movie on MTN. It's still not acceptable (even Zimbabwe is far cheaper) but has drastically improved. Most people I know have an account with one of the streaming services.
  - diyorgasms 11y ago
    Wow thanks for the reply. It seems like things are really improving. Here in the USA, we seem to be moving almost backward, with the telecom companies just now implementing caps on previously uncapped connections, and fighting against the deployment of next generation infrastructure.
instakill 11y ago
I use getflix and it still works. The ZA selection is a joke.

tech-no-logical 11y ago

I must say I've been considering the same thing (I'm in the netherlands). for now, there's still ways to watch the US version of netflix, but should that too be blocked, I will probably revert to piracy, even though I've been against it for a long time...

sgift 11y ago

The only reason I subscribed to Netflix was that it was the best way to get Warehouse 13, which I really wanted to see at the time. For now Netflix still has enough content to satisfy me, but the idea that the library is so much smaller here in Germany than in the U.S. was never to my liking .. Greedy companies force Netflix to block customers, customers pirate content instead, all loose. One would think Hollywood learned their lesson, just as the music industry did, but it doesn't look that way. Maybe one day they'll find out that the correct solution if you ran against a wall is not do it again and hope that the wall falls, but to go around it.

themartorana 11y ago
It's never been well explained to me how this is a profitable model, especially considering the ease with which popular shows are pirated - in full HD and digital sound I might add. What do studios really stand to gain by keeping Germany et al from so much content?
- sgift 11y ago
  They sell it over different channels (Amazon Prime, DVD, etc.) and somehow seem to think that people will use more than one to get all content they want. They probably do this to get better rates from Netflix, e.g. "You know, if you don't pay us x we can always give our content someone else". To me this sounds like madness, I would never use multiple streaming services, but I'm not an Hollywood exec, so maybe there is some method to the madness that I'm not able to see.
  - joshuacc 11y ago
    FWIW, I regularly use Netflix, Amazon Prime, and YouTube. In the past I would also use iTunes.
- rhino369 11y ago
  Why is everyone assuming that greedy German companies aren't willing to sell? Is it also possible that Netflix isn't willing to pay the going rate or hasn't bothered to negotiate for the rights. Netflix launched globally without taking the time to negotiate content for most countries on earth. I'm not sure you can assume that Netflix is being diligent in trying to acquire content. Especially since even in the USA netlix appears to be pivoting into being a content creator instead of a content aggregator.

secoif 11y ago

Same issue in Singapore. The Netflix library available here doesn't even contain the latest season of House of Cards – and it's a bloody Netflix production. I would love to pay someone for timely content, but now that Netflix is blocking vpn access there is literally nobody to pay. It's complete madness.

dogma1138 11y ago
Netflix doesn't own house of cards actually, it exclusive rights to it in some countries in others it doesn't.
- maze-le 11y ago
  Since it is a production of them, is seems utterly moronic to remove one of the main reasons people would join their services in the first place. Many non-us customers joined, just to cancel the account right after they realized that they had no access to the good content. In some cases this is not the fault of netflix, but that of 19th century copyright laws. I cannot blame them, when other services had the rights prior to them... But 'House of Cards' is a Netflix production, and this doesn't apply here. They would have done themselfs a favour by not selling the rights to this content to the highest bidder. Especially since their ads suggest access to 'House of Cards'.
  - drspacemonkey 11y ago
    The problem comes from the original BBC House of Cards. Netflix doesn't actually own the rights, they're licensed from a company called Media Rights Capital.
    - bryanlarsen 11y ago
      Netflix funded production, so would have had strong leverage over MRC's relicensing. We can't see the contracts, but I'm fairly confident that Netflix would have had at least right of first refusal for rights for any region.

thrusong 11y ago

We're in Canada and have been cable cutters for almost five years now. We've gotten by on Netflix US and YouTube with the occasional pirated streaming site, but we're barely ever using Netflix anymore. We've turned to Kodi. We don't want to pirate, but it's hard to make a compelling argument against it when you get everything you want even easier than torrents. Add to that the abusive monopolies of Shaw and Bell, who each now have their own streaming subscriptions, services like Hulu and HBO Now either being blocked here or controlled by Shaw or Bell, and the Netlix subscription increasing by 50% in May for a lacklustre catalogue. With all of that, the three movies I go to the cinema to see each month, and my Netflix subscription, it's hard not to feel like I pay my share for content. Not a popular opinion, I'm sure, but I'm not getting a dozen streaming services subscriptions.

kejaed 11y ago
What's wrong with Bell/Saw/Rogers having their own streaming services? I've found Bell's Crave TV to be pretty good, Shomi not as much.
- Cuuugi 11y ago
  Crave TV has great content, but they have been very frustrating for me technically. Random drops in the stream, session cookies getting corrupted (they only recently allow password changes from their site).
  - kejaed 11y ago
    Agree with that 100%. Any time I've had to use web/iOS apps for Crave, I've wondered what is up with Bell Media's software people. The TSN app is just as poor, especially compared to what Rogers' Sportsnet app is doing on iOS.
- pmelendez 11y ago
  May I ask what you don't like about Shomi? Is it the content?

planetjones 11y ago

I am an English person living in Switzerland. Netflix Switzerland is useless to me (no House of Cards, not enough focus on UK and USA content, etc.). Therefore I had a Netflix USA account, which I accessed via unblock-us. The clampdown by Netflix has been "successful" and I now can't access Netflix USA using unblock-us. This happened halfway through watching House of Cards. So my choice was either stop watching or download the remaining episodes... I am tired of companies talking about borderless trade, global economy, etc. when the distribution of movies and tv shows is stuck in the sad world of geo-restrictions. I also legally get access to UK TV channels through my cable subscription, but I don't get access to iPlayer as that's only for UK residents... so again the only option to catch-up on TV that I forgot to record, is to use an unblocker.

kennywinker 11y ago
This blows my mind. How on earth does Netflix not have the rights to show their own show in Switzerland? I understand their hands are sometimes tied in getting content from the studios, but they own House of Cards... I'm so confused how they could end up in that situation...
- detaro 11y ago
  Simple: They sold exclusive rights in quite a few countries to TV networks before they expanded there.
  - michaelbuckbee 11y ago
    Not disagreeing, but it still seems odd as the Netflix Original Content is the big carrot to get people hooked into their ecosystem.
    - detaro 11y ago
      I can only assume they didn't plan to expand this quickly and would have lost a lot of money by adding "in case we are in this market by then" clauses to the contracts. But yes, it certainly leaves a strange impression.

thinkMOAR 11y ago

Wonder when the first person stands up and claim this is blatant racism/ discrimination. Because it literally is. 'oh you come from this country and you have netflix? -- oops then you cannot see because you are canadian/european/ whoever' Media copyrightrights per country, its 2016 its insane release your media globally or don't release it at all.

dogma1138 11y ago
Don't blame Netflix blame those countries because they are the ones which prevent titles from being released as they have local companies that bought the distribution rights.
- thinkMOAR 11y ago
  The topic of this thread is Netflix, and i have personal experience with these limits of netflix, hence i referred to them. Though it applies to all such parties. And netflix being the biggest could certainly 'make a fist' and get some stuff done. And since Netflix is such a big party, they have blame too.
CosmicShadow 11y ago
It sure is how it feels. Facebook trending: look at this awesome SNL clip the world is laughing and talking about! Click on it, oh sorry, you can't watch this in Canada, but hey, the rest of the world that matters can(read: the US), so yeah, good bye. Any content provider that blocks you out based on your location makes you feel discriminated against and it sucks! I like how Netflix says that we are very vocal, but minor and 'inconsequential'. Well yeah, fuck you too!
- rchaud 11y ago
  I don't agree that that's the case. To me, region-restrictions for US content (the most popular worldwide) present a massive opportunity for content creators not based in the US to make something that is in fact truly globally available. While it's true that US TV and movies have been globally popular since the time of their invention, the rise of YouTube, Vine, Instagram etc. show that global audiences can be developed without needing to be US centric. Your comment "this awesome clip the world is laughing and talking about" refers to SNL, but there are examples of viral videos that didn't originate from a big-name US studio. "Charlie bit my finger" and "Gangnam Style" are two examples. I don't think it's too much of a stretch that English-language long-form content (30-60 minute series) can be developed without having a "Made in America" imprimatur on it. Danish crime shows are popular in Europe and the UK, while Korean dramas are extremely popular in East Asian markets. Indian cinema is also popular in the Middle East, North Africa and parts of Southeast Asia. A small slice of British shows like Made in Chelsea have carved out a niche in English-speaking markets like the US, Canada and Australia. I hope production studios large and small across the world are seeing this as an opportunity to expand past their borders rather than simply continue "Business as usual" under the protectionism offered with these types of restrictive licensing rules.

cdnsteve 11y ago

Content geofencing makes no sense. Until businesses realize this people will always find ways around it.

rhino369 11y ago
It makes a lot of sense for the world we live in now. Most revenue from TV is still captured by regular broadcast or cable viewership. Those means of distribution are typically geofenced. If you have an American show, Sky or BBC will pay more than Netflix will. Plus, people in developing countries can't and won't pay western prices for content. It makes sense to geofence and then sell it to them much cheaper.
- russdill 11y ago
  But in most cases here, people are willing to pay the same price as the original country of origin of the content but are denied that option.

lostgame 11y ago

I ended up having the conversation with a co-worker...I live in Canada, and anyone who lives up here can back me up on the fact that this country is just awful with regards to its copyright litigation with regards to television, especially. It's far, far easier for me to pirate content than it is to legally buy it. Until that's the case, I'm not interested in forking over my money to be inconvenienced (and this is coming from a dude who buys his music mainly on vinyl).

guiomie 11y ago
Wait, you are justifying an illegal action of yours because it is easier than the legal route? Since when doing the right thing is and should always be easier... So, do you also not pay income tax because it is much easier to not do so? There are countless examples where being illegal is easier over legal, but as a society some of us understand that if the majority respect the law and order, we are much better off. I'm Canadian, and I certainly don't back you up on this. I use Netflix, Crave, my providers VoD service, independent and mainstream theaters to consume content all the time. When I realize I've spent more then I should on entertainment, I simply find other stuff to do or consume. Is it really about being "easier" and not about being cheap? Personally, I find it quite easy to swipe my credit card or link it to a Google Play account. I am amazed to read this under the caption of articles picture: "Netflix customer Susan Lorenz of Toronto doesn't understand why the company is suddenly shutting her out from the content she used to be able to see." ... Susan most certainly understands why.
- Grishnakh 11y ago
  No, she doesn't understand why. Maybe you can enlighten us. She used to pay hard cash for access to Netflix (the US version), and watched US content legally. Now she's being prevented from that. If the content creator doesn't want to sell access to the content for you, then you have every right to access it through other means. They never had to cut off access to these non-US customers: they were paying good money for this service, the same money as someone in America. Why shouldn't they be allowed access? Why is their money not as good as an American's money? Don't forget, we have a Free Trade treaty between Canada and the US. They're not practicing free trade here as the treaty states, so she has every right to work around it.

cazum 11y ago

What exactly does Netflix stand to gain from making it harder for its non-american subscribers to VPN the geoblocked content? Surely they must have predicted a substantial drop in subscription rates as soon as people realize they can't watch the good stuff. It just seems like international-marketshare suicide.

fossuser 11y ago
My guess is that Netflix has now positioned themselves as the first global 'television' network. They hopefully have enough power and leverage to stop the content producers from stupidly restricting access via region, but they're not able to do this effectively if users can easily bypass the restrictions. If it doesn't work out then at least they'll get a global audience for their own content and the rest will go back to piracy.
- skykooler 11y ago
  They don't even have a global audience for their own content - House of Cards isn't available in many countries because Netflix sold the TV networks exclusive distribution.
pjc50 11y ago
I suspect they were given ultimatum(s) from the content copyright holders, and decided to keep the content but lose the international viewers. Then this can be used as leverage in the ongoing negotiations.
petra 11y ago
In order to make content companies cooperate with them on international expansion, i assume content creators demanded this, so they could still play the old game of selling content differently in different places - with a simple reasoning - more control = more revenues.
rtkwe 11y ago
The deals they've signed with companies allow them to distribute shows X, Y, & Z in say the US other companies have the rights to that same show in Canada or the UK. Netflix can't just distribute the copyrighted content wherever they want and keep the media creating companies they rely on for content coming back to renew deals.

nicolas_t 11y ago

I still can access netflix through the VPN I use. As long as I still can do that, I will keep my account. The second they block it, I'll cancel my netflix account and will go back to resorting to piracy. If movie studios don't want my money then so be it, I'll find better use for it. EDIT: And I say this as someone who spends roughly $100/month supporting artists I like on Patreon and Kickstarter, so I'm not opposed to paying for content. I'm just opposed to big media conglomerates screwing me.

OSButler 11y ago
Their blocking seems to be quite aggressive, as a lot of regular hosting providers even had their IP ranges blocked by them. I've been following a few forum posts where people were sharing their working VPN provider/ISP, but those were showing the same error message a few days later, so it looks like they are actively monitoring traffic and maybe even social media to block further IP ranges.
- rabidrabbit 11y ago
  I was not able to test it (for example borrowing a residential IP in a different country) but I suspect they detect OpenVPN via packets inspection, like this example: "Detecting VPN (and its configuration!) and proxy users on the server side" by @ValdikSS https://medium.com/@ValdikSS/detecting-vpn-and-its-configuration-and-proxy-users-on-the-server-side-1bcc59742413#.forbbpie6 https://medium.com/@ValdikSS/detecting-vpn-and-its-configura...
justinhj 11y ago
How are they screwing you? You pay for a Netflix sub in the country you live in, and you're paying only for the content they can license there. By making sure people can't watch whatever country they want easily, they make it easier to negotiate with license holders.
- jsutton 11y ago
  They're screwing you because, while everyone pays the same price for the same service, the library that you have access to depends entirely on what side of the border you're on. This makes absolutely no sense in a globally connected world.

pinkskip 11y ago

Same here downunder. Loved my Netflix US subscription. Now I have no subscription with Netflix guess they don't want money ey?

byuu 11y ago

I've been rather stunned at how no one has come up with a strong workaround to this yet. It's really quite simple, we just need slick, easy-to-use software for it. Make software that both turns your home computer into a single-user VPN server, that lets you set the maximum upload bandwidth to ~5mbit/s or so, and lets you only pass through Netflix content; and also gives you a VPN client that lets you connect to another's computer and only uses the VPN for Netflix content, allowing your web browser and everything else to continue working through your regular ISP. The whitelisting eliminates the traditional concern of someone using your connection for torrents or worse illegal content. The bandwidth limiting ensures smooth QoS for your own network. Latency here is not a concern at all ... it's streaming video. Once you have this software, it's simply a matter of setting up a message forum somewhere where people say, "I am from 'country X' and want to watch content from 'country Y'", and waiting for someone in the reverse situation to come along. As long as your connections are always-on, this works perfectly. As an alternative to the fact that more people will want US Netflix than any other region, people could also offer server-only access for nominal Paypal fees. Eg lease out a 5mbit/s link for $10/mo. The price would naturally follow supply and demand. I can change my IP any time, and there is no possible way Netflix can ban my hostmask as a VPN (all of Time Warner Cable in Columbus, Ohio.) And if this forces Netflix to start charging by billing region ... good!! Now we can offer services that let people pay for the regions they want to access! Or if they try and block that too, then perhaps people sharing VPNs can share their account logins next. Either way, this is a cat-and-mouse game with a very clear end-game. Why the hell is no one working on this problem? There are millions of people affected by this VPN block nonsense. On that note, I have a US 300/20 connection I'd be happy to share, and I can do the software the hard way with BSD/pf. Is there anyone with an always-on JP connection that would like to trade with me? I would also be willing to pay someone for a residential ISP VPN connection in Japan, which I would use exclusively for Netflix only. I'd really love to be able to use Netflix Japan again; it's helped a lot with my listening comprehension in studying the language. (Side note: this proxy software wouldn't have to be just Netflix. It could be a wonderful anti-geolocking system. The major VPN and VPS models are clearly detectable and blockable. This could allow fine-grained whitelisting or blacklisting and decentralization of VPN services.)

dijit 11y ago

randommodnar 11y ago

Well, I've cancelled my account. Who needs Netflix when I've got BitTorrent?

ericfrederich 11y ago

Popcorn Time should publish some graphs of their traffic. I bet there will be a correlation between Netflix blocking proxies and downloads of Popcorn Time

deskamess 11y ago
I thought Popcorn Time had shut down?
- atemerev 11y ago
  The domain was shut down. Big deal. The source code is still on Github, and new mirrors appear every once and then.
- JTon 11y ago
  If I recall correctly the original project did close down and others picked up where it left off. Some good, some malicious. I use this subreddit to find a trusted one: https://www.reddit.com/r/PopCornTime/ https://www.reddit.com/r/PopCornTime/ https://popcorntime.sh https://popcorntime.sh

bryanlarsen 11y ago

Netflix really screwed up with House of Cards. They should be able to take the high ground and say: "Don't get mad at us, they're making us do it. We're leading by example, maybe someday everybody will realize that regional restrictions are a bad idea." But their licensing and handling of House of Cards prevents them from taking the moral high ground.

qwertymaster 11y ago

After years of using netflix, since long before it was even available in Germany, I canceled my account the moment I couldn't access the US library anymore. The German library is just not worth it and titles were often missing English subtitles, even for movies which were available on US netflix with subtitles. As I usually watch shows with english subtitles (including shows in english) and original audio, this really bothered me and made the non-US experience even worse. Never really watched many of the German shows on there, maybe one or two.

NovaS1X 11y ago

Piracy has always been a convenience problem and only partly a cost problem. Pirating content is the easiest, fastest, highest quality, and most available method of watching content. The price is just a nice bonus. Digital restrictions hurt everyone and maybe one day Hollywood will wake up and realize that you can't strong-arm the market into behaving how you want it to and you have to adapt to consumer demand. It's one of the few industries that I know of that try this hard to fight against consumer demand. It's so backwards. Until the day they change, pirate on.

mmanfrin 11y ago
Yep -- I want to watch tv shows on the night they come out so I can talk with friends about them the day after. Nearly every per-episode-purchase vendor lists them the day after (most likely because the networks that air the shows require them to wait). It's dumb, and all it does is push me away from paying them more than they'd make on advertising from me anyway.

make3 11y ago

I see no statistics. This article is air.

kinofcain 11y ago

But violating the license terms by border hopping is piracy. Not saying I agree with geo restrictions, or any of the other silliness (I don't, and thankfully we're rapidly moving away from that sort of thing), but using VPNs or foreign credit cards to subscribe to a service that isn't available to you because the company selling it doesn't have a license to do so is still, technically, piracy.

anExcitedBeast 11y ago
Sure, but piracy where everyone gets paid.
- rhino369 11y ago
  No, piracy where the service provider you subscribe to gets paid, but the rightful license holders don't. Sometimes the license holder and the service provider are the same, in which case everyone gets paid. But in most cases you aren't. Sure you pay netflix, but netflix just keeps the money. They definitely don't go find and pay the right people.
Johnny555 11y ago
That is certainly an ethical gray area -- an strong argument could be made that paying for content (even when you pay extra to view out-of-area content by using a VPN) is not piracy at all since the content owner is still getting paid for his content. (you're still paying a fair price for the content even though the content owner might have gotten more (or less) money for his content had you viewed it in your own country). It may be against the law in your country (or the country that hosts the content), but that doesn't neccessarily mean it's piracy) Much like how visiting Canada to purchase much cheaper prescription drugs is not "stealing" drugs even though it means that drug manufacturers are getting less revenue than if you bought the drugs in the USA. (I'll admit being guilty of that one when my mother was on an expensive prescription drug that was not covered under her insurance plan. I helped her source the same drug for 20% of the cost at a Canadian Pharmacy, otherwise she couldn't have afforded it and would have had to use a less effective substitute (with more side effects) that was covered under insurance.

unabridged 11y ago

Why does netflix care so much? Doesn't just blocking ip's by country satisfy whatever legal requirement? Do the contracts with content provider specifically require netflix to maintain a list of VPN providers and block them?

gshulegaard 11y ago

A lot of people seem angry about the geo-blocking, and I would agree with the sentiment, but can anyone tell me why Netflix is geo-blocking so heavily? Companies don't do things for no reason...

kstenerud 11y ago
Because content producers are threatening to remove their support of Netflix.
- gshulegaard 11y ago
  Which is what I thought...so why the Netflix hate? Shouldn't we be instead be getting angry at the copyright holders essentially exercising monopolistic control of the market?
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - atemerev 11y ago
    Isn't everybody already?

blue_dinner 11y ago

We can say the same about taxes and regulations: if it's too high, individuals will just go elsewhere. For some reason, we always try to punish the individuals that do this. Piracy will only continue to make it more difficult for small and mid-sized companies to compete. The multi-national corporations will always have the resources to wait out the slaughter. The end result will be the same as what we have with the music industry: huge companies owning all of the media.

brendangregg 11y ago

"We look forward to offering all of our content everywhere and to consumers being able to enjoy all of Netflix without using a proxy. That’s the goal we will keep pushing towards." -- David Fullagar is Vice President of Content Delivery Architecture at Netflix. https://media.netflix.com/en/company-blog/evolving-proxy-detection-as-a-global-service https://media.netflix.com/en/company-blog/evolving-proxy-det...

cbaleanu 11y ago

Same story here, but I have been living in Eastern Europe and then Australia and then back for a few years now, paying for unblock-us and Netflix US which I signed up for while in the US. Ever since my first experience with Netflix powered by a Roku I have been praising how awesome it is, trying to get my friends to sign up for the service. And then the geofencing crap happened but the service was suddenly available in our country, but with minus 90 percent of the content - a lot of my friends signed up and then cancelled their subscription. I for one am seriously thinking about canceling both unblock-us and Netflix as I suddenly feel a 'localized' citizen with no way to legally we global anymore and it sucks.

xg15 11y ago

Imagine I live in Canada and one day drive to the US and purchase a House of Cards DVD, which I take back with me to Canada. Would you consider what I just did piracy? No? Then why is it piracy if I do the exact same thing by different technical means? (Streaming the content instead of buying a physical disk)