4 ms·

Is anyone aware of a source for this type of news that isn't quite so one-sided? It seems all we have is hyper-lefty "sky is falling" stuff and hard-charging ri

by tacos 10y ago

Is anyone aware of a source for this type of news that isn't quite so one-sided? It seems all we have is hyper-lefty "sky is falling" stuff and hard-charging right-wing "shut up kids, the government knows what's best for you." I want reporting, not advocacy. The better of the mainstream press outlets are balanced to a fault but get the interesting details wrong or leave them out altogether. The fringe outlets target their core audience with lots of spun details and a lack of opposing viewpoint. EDIT: If anyone can get past "lefty vs righty" and answer my core question I'd really appreciate it. This is a genuine query for information, not a clever way to troll.

gshulegaard 10y ago
I...hmmm...I don't know if my personal bias is influencing my perspective, but I usually find the EFF as a reasonable reporting source. They tend to fall on the left, but I struggle to see them as "hyper-lefty". The key for me about the EFF is they are usually good at providing sources. I am going to take the time to read the linked Memorandum and Order document and form my own opinion: > https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/20151106-702Mem_Opinion_Order_for_Public_Release.pdf https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/20151106-702Mem_Opinion_... Although, I do tend to agree with the EFF on a fair amount of issues (not always though).
- tacos 10y ago
  My personal bias is way in favor of the EFF but the tone still irks me. And don't be fooled by footnotes! Unlike EFF, Wikipedia consciously strives for balance and they often come up way short, too. Any decent advocacy organization knows how to play the "references" game.
  - studentrob 10y ago
    I agree with you, often the tone of EFF feels off. It can vary a lot by article. I think this is evidence of a nascent tech community. We are fractured in our approach to some things (e.g. RMS vs others) and this shows in the varied responses by EFF. I definitely don't agree with everything they have to say about tech and policy but I am glad they exist. They keep pretty good tabs on government and private company policy. Sometimes it feels weird when they criticize some private company for a policy which I feel is not a big deal, but I just register my disagreement and note they're not me ;-)
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
clarkmoody 10y ago
Those who care about the Fourth Amendment are probably more libertarian than anything, so left/right doesn't make sense for this particular issue.
- bobwaycott 10y ago
  Oh, come on. The Fourth Amendment has existed and been debated, challenged, abused, and defended long before libertarians were calling themselves a thing. Suggesting libertarians care about it more is just additional partisan nonsense. And it's partisan nonsense that doesn't make sense for this particular issue. Plenty of right-leaning Americans care about the 4th. Plenty of left-leaning Americans care about it, as well. We could maybe tease out some commonalities among them in relation to how they define the contours of Fourth Amendment issues. But beyond that, you're pretty much just making stuff up. I realize there's a great many HNers who love to brandish their libertarian badges at every opportunity, but it makes for a really annoying echo chamber, and it creates unnecessary partisan division on issues we could otherwise rationally discuss.
  - clarkmoody 10y ago
    Where's the fire? Lowercase-L libertarian means that you care about liberty. I could have said "classical liberal," which would encompass modern libertarians and the Founders alike. > echo chamber I'm not getting a strong libertarian vibe from HN on anything except encryption/privacy, which is really ironic.
krapp 10y ago
Advocacy is what most people want nowadays - reporting that resonates with your biases seems more fair (and thus, is trusted more) than reporting which might challenge your preconceptions. eff.org gets posted as often as it does because of its bias, not despite it. Although to be fair, eff articles do get called out a lot on Hacker News as well - the userbase is diverse, any anything of interest will be argued from both sides, sometimes in good faith, sometimes not. But I think that's why biased articles are more likely to be posted than unbiased ones - the bias is what makes it seems interesting.
Zpalmtree 10y ago
You don't have to be left wing to support privacy, in fact lots of right wing people including myself have it as one of their core beliefs.
bobwaycott 10y ago
I feel like you may perhaps be looking for this kind of news to show up in something akin to a legal or policy review/journal. Otherwise, I believe you'll find it difficult to locate a dispassionate presentation of the facts without too much editorializing. On the other hand, even when disagreeing with others' conclusions, sometimes I like a bit of advocacy along with reporting, as it helps remind me people care.

by tacos 10y ago

gshulegaard 10y ago

I...hmmm...I don't know if my personal bias is influencing my perspective, but I usually find the EFF as a reasonable reporting source. They tend to fall on the left, but I struggle to see them as "hyper-lefty". The key for me about the EFF is they are usually good at providing sources. I am going to take the time to read the linked Memorandum and Order document and form my own opinion: > https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/20151106-702Mem_Opinion_Order_for_Public_Release.pdf https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/20151106-702Mem_Opinion_... Although, I do tend to agree with the EFF on a fair amount of issues (not always though).

tacos 10y ago
My personal bias is way in favor of the EFF but the tone still irks me. And don't be fooled by footnotes! Unlike EFF, Wikipedia consciously strives for balance and they often come up way short, too. Any decent advocacy organization knows how to play the "references" game.
- studentrob 10y ago
  I agree with you, often the tone of EFF feels off. It can vary a lot by article. I think this is evidence of a nascent tech community. We are fractured in our approach to some things (e.g. RMS vs others) and this shows in the varied responses by EFF. I definitely don't agree with everything they have to say about tech and policy but I am glad they exist. They keep pretty good tabs on government and private company policy. Sometimes it feels weird when they criticize some private company for a policy which I feel is not a big deal, but I just register my disagreement and note they're not me ;-)

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

clarkmoody 10y ago

Those who care about the Fourth Amendment are probably more libertarian than anything, so left/right doesn't make sense for this particular issue.

bobwaycott 10y ago
Oh, come on. The Fourth Amendment has existed and been debated, challenged, abused, and defended long before libertarians were calling themselves a thing. Suggesting libertarians care about it more is just additional partisan nonsense. And it's partisan nonsense that doesn't make sense for this particular issue. Plenty of right-leaning Americans care about the 4th. Plenty of left-leaning Americans care about it, as well. We could maybe tease out some commonalities among them in relation to how they define the contours of Fourth Amendment issues. But beyond that, you're pretty much just making stuff up. I realize there's a great many HNers who love to brandish their libertarian badges at every opportunity, but it makes for a really annoying echo chamber, and it creates unnecessary partisan division on issues we could otherwise rationally discuss.
- clarkmoody 10y ago
  Where's the fire? Lowercase-L libertarian means that you care about liberty. I could have said "classical liberal," which would encompass modern libertarians and the Founders alike. > echo chamber I'm not getting a strong libertarian vibe from HN on anything except encryption/privacy, which is really ironic.

krapp 10y ago

Advocacy is what most people want nowadays - reporting that resonates with your biases seems more fair (and thus, is trusted more) than reporting which might challenge your preconceptions. eff.org gets posted as often as it does because of its bias, not despite it. Although to be fair, eff articles do get called out a lot on Hacker News as well - the userbase is diverse, any anything of interest will be argued from both sides, sometimes in good faith, sometimes not. But I think that's why biased articles are more likely to be posted than unbiased ones - the bias is what makes it seems interesting.

Zpalmtree 10y ago

You don't have to be left wing to support privacy, in fact lots of right wing people including myself have it as one of their core beliefs.

bobwaycott 10y ago

I feel like you may perhaps be looking for this kind of news to show up in something akin to a legal or policy review/journal. Otherwise, I believe you'll find it difficult to locate a dispassionate presentation of the facts without too much editorializing. On the other hand, even when disagreeing with others' conclusions, sometimes I like a bit of advocacy along with reporting, as it helps remind me people care.