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The reason why nobody has sortition, is because deep down democracy is about being as agreeable as possible to the median citizen. If you have vague feeling tha

by vlehto 11y ago

The reason why nobody has sortition, is because deep down democracy is about being as agreeable as possible to the median citizen. If you have vague feeling that you decided who is prime minister, you are more motivated to pay taxes and fight wars. The country that gets least tax evasion and most volunteers to army is likely to perform better than anybody else. And so survival of the fittest governments has favored democracy for past three centuries.

thaumasiotes 11y ago
> The reason why nobody has sortition, is because deep down democracy is about being as agreeable as possible to the median citizen. If you have vague feeling that you decided who is prime minister, you are more motivated to pay taxes and fight wars. I doubt this has any explanatory power as to why sortition isn't used much today. Among other things, the median citizen doesn't care even a little bit about who is prime minister or otherwise in charge.
- makomk 11y ago
  I think it has a lot of explanatory power. From what I've seen the main reason people don't care about who's in charge is because they think all the candidates are basically the same and none actually represent them.
  - vlehto 11y ago
    ...in the framework of your country. If you are U.S. citizen, you probably would prefer Obama over Enrique Peña Nieto. Personally as a Finn I like Sipilä and Niinistö over Putin. In a way any Finnish party head would suit me better than Putin. It matters little which of them, but it matters a lot that it's one of them. In medieval Europe, vassal dukes would bargain who king they would pay taxes to. And you had situations where Britain was ruled by dude who spoke French and lived in Normandy.
clarkmoody 11y ago
> you are more motivated to pay taxes and fight wars Well, you don't really have a choice in the former, and when there's a draft, you don't in the latter either. > The country that gets least tax evasion and most volunteers to army is likely to perform better than anybody else I disagree. You are elevating the state too high. I would counter that the countries with the most economic freedom -- those that have embraced markets and rule of law -- are the ones at the top.
- vlehto 10y ago
  You do have choice to go completely against your government. If some unpopular dictator enacts draft, there is going to be loads of guerrilla fighters around. Because now they have to fight anyhow, why not fight for themselves.

by vlehto 11y ago

thaumasiotes 11y ago

> The reason why nobody has sortition, is because deep down democracy is about being as agreeable as possible to the median citizen. If you have vague feeling that you decided who is prime minister, you are more motivated to pay taxes and fight wars. I doubt this has any explanatory power as to why sortition isn't used much today. Among other things, the median citizen doesn't care even a little bit about who is prime minister or otherwise in charge.

makomk 11y ago
I think it has a lot of explanatory power. From what I've seen the main reason people don't care about who's in charge is because they think all the candidates are basically the same and none actually represent them.
- vlehto 11y ago
  ...in the framework of your country. If you are U.S. citizen, you probably would prefer Obama over Enrique Peña Nieto. Personally as a Finn I like Sipilä and Niinistö over Putin. In a way any Finnish party head would suit me better than Putin. It matters little which of them, but it matters a lot that it's one of them. In medieval Europe, vassal dukes would bargain who king they would pay taxes to. And you had situations where Britain was ruled by dude who spoke French and lived in Normandy.

clarkmoody 11y ago

> you are more motivated to pay taxes and fight wars Well, you don't really have a choice in the former, and when there's a draft, you don't in the latter either. > The country that gets least tax evasion and most volunteers to army is likely to perform better than anybody else I disagree. You are elevating the state too high. I would counter that the countries with the most economic freedom -- those that have embraced markets and rule of law -- are the ones at the top.

vlehto 10y ago
You do have choice to go completely against your government. If some unpopular dictator enacts draft, there is going to be loads of guerrilla fighters around. Because now they have to fight anyhow, why not fight for themselves.