5 ms·

But, of course, Phil Jones wrote some rude emails and used the words "trick" and "hide", therefore global warming isn't real and poses no threat even if it is.

by gjm11 17y ago

But, of course, Phil Jones wrote some rude emails and used the words "trick" and "hide", therefore global warming isn't real and poses no threat even if it is. So, nothing to worry about.

deleted 17y ago
[deleted]
antidaily 17y ago
You don't understand… I've seen it. I've seen it happening. The ocean is dying, the plankton is dying… It's people! Soylent Green is made out of people. They're making our food out of people. Soon, they'll be breeding us like cattle—for food! You gotta tell 'em! Listen to me, Hatcher! You gotta tell 'em—SOYLENT GREEN IS PEOPLE!!
- Eliezer 17y ago
  I'll tell you what you gotta tell 'em! SOYLENT GREEN IS THERMODYNAMICALLY INEFFICIENT!
  - cousin_it 17y ago
    Yeah, that makes as much sense as machines using humans for energy in the Matrix. For a good time, see this Reddit thread: http://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/b5gz7/an_american_physicist_is_calling_for_hollywood/c0l22xs http://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/b5gz7/an_american_p...
jmaygarden 17y ago
What does this have to do with global warming? The new iceberg was dislodged by a collision. Nothing in the article indicates temperature as a factor.
- hendler 17y ago
  [Edit: scientists are cautious about saying this specific event is caused by warming tempuratures - but overall they are not cautious about linking melting ice shelves to overall warming.] Can every article related to global climate change site every other article? Ice caps are getting smaller and breaking up more rapidly over the last 30 years... because the average temperature of the earth is rising. There is a remote possibility that all climate change science is bad because some climate change science is bad. But the more likely scenario is that most climate change science is good science, and observations like giant icebergs are relevant evidence that is easy for most to understand - so they are used as examples. http://nsidc.org/quickfacts/icebergs.html http://nsidc.org/quickfacts/icebergs.html http://nsidc.org/news/press/20080325_Wilkins.html http://nsidc.org/news/press/20080325_Wilkins.html http://www.radioaustralianews.net.au/stories/201002/2831331.htm?desktop http://www.radioaustralianews.net.au/stories/201002/2831331.... ""We don't see any evidence at the moment, we don't have enough information to be able to say any influence of climate change," he said." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/24/hundreds-of-icebergs-brea_n_369367.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/24/hundreds-of-iceberg... ""Whole ice shelves have broken up," he said, as temperatures have risen in Antarctica, where they are up as much as 5 degrees Fahrenheit (3 degrees Celsius) in the past 60 years. But he cautioned against linking the appearance of the bergs in New Zealand waters to global warming: The phenomenon depends as much on weather patterns and ocean currents as on the rate at which icebergs are calving off Antarctic ice shelves."
  - jacoblyles 17y ago
    >"Ice caps are getting smaller and breaking up more rapidly over the last 30 years" Actually, I'm pretty sure the south pole ice cap is growing, though this is also thought to be a symptom of rising temperatures. edit: uh..what? You think I'm making this up? http://www.slate.com/id/2192730/ http://www.slate.com/id/2192730/ http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2008/0110/p14s01-sten.html http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2008/0110/p14s01-sten.h... http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/seaice.anomaly.antarctic.png http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/seaice.anomal... http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/current.anom.south.jpg http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/current.anom.... http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/a_new_record_for_antartic_total_ice_extent http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/a_new_record_for_ant...
fauigerzigerk 17y ago
If global warming is a danger Mr. Jones has made it a little more dangerous with his illegal actions that have discredited climate research. But anyway, I get the feeling that we're suffering a collective bout of climate hypochondria this century. Haven't icebergs been colliding and breaking apart forever?
- icey 17y ago
  I don't really know if we're reacting appropriately, overreacting, or underreacting to climate change; but I think your last sentence is kind of like saying "Volcanoes have been erupting since Earth began, who cares if a supervolcano is about to erupt?".
  - fauigerzigerk 17y ago
    Is it a supervolcano or is it just supercharged perception of everything that might or might not have to do with climate change? I can't bring myself to react to very long term potential dangers in the same way I would react to clear and immediate dangers like a volcano that's going to blow up in my face. That's why your analogy doesn't work for me.
    - jbooth 17y ago
      Summer ice melts have generally been setting records year after year, both in the northern and southern hemisphere. So, uncertain, but probably more on the "supervolcano" end of your spectrum there. Experiment: Fill a glass with ice water. Take the temp. 32 degrees or so. Drop a thimble full of boiling water in, some of the ice will melt. Take the temp. Still 32 degrees. Repeat. What happens when we're out of ice? (Situation is slightly different for a planet as opposed to a glass but the fundamentals still apply)
      - fauigerzigerk 17y ago
        So are you saying that the temperature up until now should not have been going up since we're not out of ice? [edit] And my second question would be this. If all of this is so simple that it can be demonstrated with a glass of water and a few ice cubes, why is it that a minority of serious scientists has doubts? The same scientists would probably confirm that your experiment is correct.
SamAtt 17y ago
The problem with the Global Warming debate is the fact that there's so much ignorance on BOTH sides. For example, One Iceberg in itself doesn't prove anything because the temperature in one isolated area can vary regardless of the overall global temperature. So you insinuating this is proof of AGW is the equivalent of a Conservative saying Global Warming doesn't exist because it's been the coldest winter on record in the north east. The only thing that can prove or disprove the hypothesis of AGW conclusively is good research and that's why Phil Jones' behavior was so damaging.
orblivion 17y ago
Remember, the majority of the debate is about the cause of increase in temperatures, not the existence.

by gjm11 17y ago

But, of course, Phil Jones wrote some rude emails and used the words "trick" and "hide", therefore global warming isn't real and poses no threat even if it is. So, nothing to worry about.

deleted 17y ago

[deleted]

antidaily 17y ago

You don't understand… I've seen it. I've seen it happening. The ocean is dying, the plankton is dying… It's people! Soylent Green is made out of people. They're making our food out of people. Soon, they'll be breeding us like cattle—for food! You gotta tell 'em! Listen to me, Hatcher! You gotta tell 'em—SOYLENT GREEN IS PEOPLE!!

Eliezer 17y ago
I'll tell you what you gotta tell 'em! SOYLENT GREEN IS THERMODYNAMICALLY INEFFICIENT!
- cousin_it 17y ago
  Yeah, that makes as much sense as machines using humans for energy in the Matrix. For a good time, see this Reddit thread: http://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/b5gz7/an_american_physicist_is_calling_for_hollywood/c0l22xs http://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/b5gz7/an_american_p...

jmaygarden 17y ago

What does this have to do with global warming? The new iceberg was dislodged by a collision. Nothing in the article indicates temperature as a factor.

hendler 17y ago
[Edit: scientists are cautious about saying this specific event is caused by warming tempuratures - but overall they are not cautious about linking melting ice shelves to overall warming.] Can every article related to global climate change site every other article? Ice caps are getting smaller and breaking up more rapidly over the last 30 years... because the average temperature of the earth is rising. There is a remote possibility that all climate change science is bad because some climate change science is bad. But the more likely scenario is that most climate change science is good science, and observations like giant icebergs are relevant evidence that is easy for most to understand - so they are used as examples. http://nsidc.org/quickfacts/icebergs.html http://nsidc.org/quickfacts/icebergs.html http://nsidc.org/news/press/20080325_Wilkins.html http://nsidc.org/news/press/20080325_Wilkins.html http://www.radioaustralianews.net.au/stories/201002/2831331.htm?desktop http://www.radioaustralianews.net.au/stories/201002/2831331.... ""We don't see any evidence at the moment, we don't have enough information to be able to say any influence of climate change," he said." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/24/hundreds-of-icebergs-brea_n_369367.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/24/hundreds-of-iceberg... ""Whole ice shelves have broken up," he said, as temperatures have risen in Antarctica, where they are up as much as 5 degrees Fahrenheit (3 degrees Celsius) in the past 60 years. But he cautioned against linking the appearance of the bergs in New Zealand waters to global warming: The phenomenon depends as much on weather patterns and ocean currents as on the rate at which icebergs are calving off Antarctic ice shelves."
- jacoblyles 17y ago
  >"Ice caps are getting smaller and breaking up more rapidly over the last 30 years" Actually, I'm pretty sure the south pole ice cap is growing, though this is also thought to be a symptom of rising temperatures. edit: uh..what? You think I'm making this up? http://www.slate.com/id/2192730/ http://www.slate.com/id/2192730/ http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2008/0110/p14s01-sten.html http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2008/0110/p14s01-sten.h... http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/seaice.anomaly.antarctic.png http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/seaice.anomal... http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/current.anom.south.jpg http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/current.anom.... http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/a_new_record_for_antartic_total_ice_extent http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/a_new_record_for_ant...

fauigerzigerk 17y ago

If global warming is a danger Mr. Jones has made it a little more dangerous with his illegal actions that have discredited climate research. But anyway, I get the feeling that we're suffering a collective bout of climate hypochondria this century. Haven't icebergs been colliding and breaking apart forever?

icey 17y ago
I don't really know if we're reacting appropriately, overreacting, or underreacting to climate change; but I think your last sentence is kind of like saying "Volcanoes have been erupting since Earth began, who cares if a supervolcano is about to erupt?".
- fauigerzigerk 17y ago
  Is it a supervolcano or is it just supercharged perception of everything that might or might not have to do with climate change? I can't bring myself to react to very long term potential dangers in the same way I would react to clear and immediate dangers like a volcano that's going to blow up in my face. That's why your analogy doesn't work for me.
  - jbooth 17y ago
    Summer ice melts have generally been setting records year after year, both in the northern and southern hemisphere. So, uncertain, but probably more on the "supervolcano" end of your spectrum there. Experiment: Fill a glass with ice water. Take the temp. 32 degrees or so. Drop a thimble full of boiling water in, some of the ice will melt. Take the temp. Still 32 degrees. Repeat. What happens when we're out of ice? (Situation is slightly different for a planet as opposed to a glass but the fundamentals still apply)
    - fauigerzigerk 17y ago
      So are you saying that the temperature up until now should not have been going up since we're not out of ice? [edit] And my second question would be this. If all of this is so simple that it can be demonstrated with a glass of water and a few ice cubes, why is it that a minority of serious scientists has doubts? The same scientists would probably confirm that your experiment is correct.

SamAtt 17y ago

The problem with the Global Warming debate is the fact that there's so much ignorance on BOTH sides. For example, One Iceberg in itself doesn't prove anything because the temperature in one isolated area can vary regardless of the overall global temperature. So you insinuating this is proof of AGW is the equivalent of a Conservative saying Global Warming doesn't exist because it's been the coldest winter on record in the north east. The only thing that can prove or disprove the hypothesis of AGW conclusively is good research and that's why Phil Jones' behavior was so damaging.

orblivion 17y ago

Remember, the majority of the debate is about the cause of increase in temperatures, not the existence.