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Photography is an incredible way to experience a new location. It isn't ruining vacations, its redefining them. In Laos, I met a young munk named Khao at the t

• onewaystreet 10y ago
  > I find these types of criticisms of photography just part of the hipster "backpacker mentality" You should actually read the article because the author isn't one of those people.
  • dkopi 10y ago
    "But as I stood there in Cambodia, swatted by selfie sticks, bruised by elbows, perfumed by the body odor of my fellow photogs, I realized the irony of being at a temple in which no one was really present. Was Instagram ruining travel?" ... "But here’s to hoping that before clicking “share,” there’s a moment to enjoy the view and a sip of instant coffee. Without getting elbowed. Or poked with a selfie stick. Or tagging that photo #Instabruise."
    • onewaystreet 10y ago
      "So, whether at Angkor Wat, Times Square, or my breakfast table, I will continue to pay homage to the melt. But here’s to hoping that before clicking “share,” there’s a moment to enjoy the view and a sip of instant coffee. Without getting elbowed. Or poked with a selfie stick. Or tagging that photo #Instabruise."
    • l33tbro 10y ago
      Still don't really see what is "hipster" about these quotes from the article. They're pretty fair criticisms of what mainstream tourism is like today. While it's a bit much to say that Instagram is ruining vacations, it's also a touch naive to say that the product is facilitating "memories and being able to share our awesome travel experiences with friends and family is". Social media is, for the most parts, a tool to elevate your perceived social status. So saying "It isn't ruining vacations, its redefining them" in the context of Instagram just reads like a Zuckerberg pull-quote.
      • voyou 10y ago
        Aren't Medium posts repeating cliched arguments contrasting the author with the supposed superficiality of the masses a pretty clear example of "a tool to elevate your perceived social status"?
        • mcphage 10y ago
          I guess the lesson is, if you can't distinguish yourself by doing X, instead try distinguishing yourself by criticizing doing X.
          • stinkytaco 10y ago
            I've always thought about it as a trait of the young, because I remember feeling this way myself. As I searched for identity one of the ways I found it was by not identifying as something. It's a totally understandable, if slightly immature attitude. I still find myself doing it, however, especially when talking about politics. It can be a bit toxic, however, and it's probably the major reason I drifted away from "mainstream" reddit. It seemed dominated by young men complaining about tumblr, which was dominated by young women complaining about reddit. Of course, just reading that sentence, I see I've fallen into the trap.
            • mcphage 10y ago
              > Of course, just reading that sentence, I see I've fallen into the trap. See https://xkcd.com/774/ https://xkcd.com/774/ :-) In all honestly, though, I wouldn't worry about it too much. People are just doing what they do to find their identity, and as long as you don't look down on them for not finding the best solution (because who has?) then keep looking for what works best for you. And recognize that it'll change over time. Embrace the changes, but don't dismiss those who haven't made the same changes as you.
    • deleted 10y ago
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    • kristianc 10y ago
      I can't say that I experienced (or saw) many selfie sticks myself. The moments before sunrise at Angkor tend to be dark enough to render selfie sticks pretty useless.
    • cholantesh 10y ago
      Sorry, Ms. Pilon, but this is par for course at any major tourist attraction, and has been for a very long time.
• bmj 10y ago
  “Instagram,” Suler said, “is therefore a tool for validating one’s life.” I think this is the crux of the issue. You are right--photography has been part of vacations since cameras were generally available. But what's different is the real-time nature of sharing those images, and the real time acceptance (or rejection) of those images via likes and comments. If those are more important than the lived experience, then, I think we have a problem. I'm a friendly critic of Instagram (it is the only social media outlet my wife and I use). It is perfect for sharing images while we travel. It is also easy, however, to get up checking if folks have liked our photos, or commented on them. That's not Instagram's fault, of course, but I wouldn't even worry about such things if we weren't sharing photos almost immediately.
  • dilemma 10y ago
    > I think this is the crux of the issue. You are right--photography has been part of vacations since cameras were generally available. But what's different is the real-time nature of sharing those images, and the real time acceptance (or rejection) of those images via likes and comments. If those are more important than the lived experience, then, I think we have a problem. Why?
    • dkopi 10y ago
      I usually don't share pictures until I'm back from vacation. I spend a lot of time sorting and sifting through the photos, picking only the best to share. People have a very short attention span. If your vacation album has more than 50 photos, it doesn't matter how good the photos are, or how exciting the experience is.
      • dilemma 10y ago
        So the answer to "Why?" is "because I say so".
      • saiya-jin 10y ago
        same here. when going on vacation compared to weekend outing, we usually bring quite a few photos from various sources (recent trip to Borneo - my dslr, gopro for diving, fiancee's point-and-shoot used also heavily in underwater housing for diving, her cell phone which she carries everywhere compared to camera). All combined it was cca 2000 pieces, damn too much but when you are there seeing all the diffrent beauty all the time, it's hard to resist snapping more than bare minimum. the issue among others is, the most amazing places are sometimes off the grid, some photos require some proper processing (panoramas, night shots with milky way etc). which tends to take a lot of time and you need proper PC for it (lightroom, autopano, photoshop etc). it would be a poor use of precious vacation time to spend evenings editing photos, wouldn't it... on the other hand, however amazing it was (and it was, highly recommending before those idiots burn rest of rainforest and transform it into palm tree plantations) - I am not going to look in next months into photos once processed, however amazing they are (and some, especially diving and jungle ones are really :-O to me). we do various mountain stuff a lot and most weekends tend to bring additional set of pics. so it has to be process-quickly-and-move-on, otherwise it takes all my free time.
• kakakiki 10y ago
  You are right. The masters of photography made memorable photos sometimes (and most often) at the risk of their lives. Now that everyone has access to the tech to reach more people, more people are getting into it.
  • kakakiki 10y ago
    Why am I getting down voted? It is a fact that they took risks - calculated ones to get the shots they wanted. Pretending otherwise won't give them justice.
• HemanHeartYou 10y ago
  it puts an emphasis on making memories, so much so that the actual memories aren't as good as the ones you would have had you not spend all day trying to find a good spot for a selfie
• theoh 10y ago
  Art teachers often tell students to document by sketching rather than by taking photos. Snapping an image can be a lazy, visually uninvolved way of registering a situation of interest. For me that's the lamentable phenomenon here. I'm not sure about the relevance of Susan Sontag's thought -- it seems like the selfie stick nonsense is a more superficial and trivial kind of digital self-indulgence than she probably imagined.
  • askafriend 10y ago
    There is lazy photography but there is also involved, artistic, interesting photography. Not all photography is lazy, and in fact it's a very fun way to experience a place. I just got back from visiting a country for the first time and I had an incredible time going around with my lightweight camera rig (not iPhone).
• hawkice 10y ago
  > I find these types of criticisms of photography just part of the hipster "backpacker mentality": [...] I see a sunset and I don't upload it to Instagram. Oh no! I guess I became a hipster! Please, I'll download Instagram, I'm not trying to be snooty, I'm just a guy. I appreciate things like sunsets, I didn't know I had to share them. Most places have sunsets. Maybe I can tweet that you should look at your own? No, to be safe, I'll post an Instagram every day. That way I won't be seen as condescending by random people on Hacker News.
  • centizen 10y ago
    If you don't want to use Instagram, that's perfectly fine. Just don't pass judgement on those who do, that's all the above poster is saying.
    • hawkice 10y ago
      The above poster was saying there is a subculture of people who, in order to feel superior, conspicuously avoid posting on Instagram about a sunset. This is an absurd characterization. There is no place in the galaxy in which it is conspicuous to not post beautiful things to Instagram. I have no judgments for users of Instagram, but a pocket full of confusion for someone who assigns a motive and subculture to everyone who doesn't live their lives exactly the way they do. It's provincial and sad, ironically so, considering that in context, that these people are documenting the travels to a foreign land.
  • deleted 10y ago
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• osweiller 10y ago
  The article was fairly nuanced and even-handed. The anecdote about a photo yielding some enlightened experience seems like an absurd stretch, and does little to counter the overwhelming evidence that people are more concerned about telling others about their experience than actually experiencing. Memories and being able to share our awesome travel experiences with friends and family is. Indeed. One of the primary criticism of this philosophy is that it's a giant lie. That people use this sort of "share how awesome it is" approach as a compensation for it not being awesome. As the stated quote says, the camera is the ultimate fantasy machine. The peaceful picture of Angkor Wat (or the Pyramids, or countless other big instagram game sites) is essentially a lie -- the image of peaceful historic tranquility is a fraud.
  • camikazeg 10y ago
    I agree, the giant lie is the problem. It has taken me a fair amount of travel; getting repeatedly lured in to tourist destinations based on the amazingly beautiful and serene photos of them to realize that it is all a lie and to try to plan my vacations around avoiding that lie. Two situations really stand out in my mind: The first was at a tiger temple in Thailand, where the monks would run tourists through a photo assembly line of sorts. They would have all of the tigers out at specified times of the day in a controlled area, the tour bus arrives, everyone files out in a single file line, one monk takes your camera out of your hand while another leads you around to the various tigers that are setup in photogenic poses while the first snaps a photo with each of them, and then leads you out. The second was at Antelope Canyon in Arizona. All of the tourists get loaded in to an off-road bus and driven to the entrance of the canyon. Because it is such a narrow and twisting path through the canyon, they are able to shove huge numbers of people through while allowing everyone to get the perfect shot. When I was there it was before Instagram, but the guides would go so far as tell everyone the proper f-stop and shutter speed to capture each photo correctly as they tossed dust up in to the rays of light piercing the canyon, or put sand up on a ledge to get the photos of it cascading off. Then they would hold each group back for a few minutes until the group ahead cleared out of the shot. It was a cattle call in both experiences but the photos represent an experience completely unlike what actually happened. I have learned that when vacationing, you are much better off going to the "second rate" destination if you actually want to enjoy anything. Just a few miles from Antelope Canyon is another slot canyon called Water Holes Canyon that was only 70% as impressive as Antelope Canyon, but we were the only people there and could explore it however we wanted! Once you know about the lie, it's easy enough to avoid, but sometimes the pull to get that shot is still strong. The picture of me with the tiger is pretty damn impressive!
• wahsd 10y ago
  Funny you used such an example, because it's a rather short sighted perspective. Sure, feel all warm and fuzzy about it, but reality is that what you are partaking in is really the deconstruction of human diversity and uniqueness and smoothing out of humanity into a grey matter of mediocrity and uniformity. Sure, maybe you won't experience the outcomes in your lifetime, but do you think your child or grandchild will also be able to go to that same place and have a similar experience? No, they won't, because the relentless drive of the internet will not stop trying to consolidate and creating uniformity. WE are really starting to see its horrific effects on humanity in Europe, where a self-loathing population that wails for diversity is self-destructing by deconstructing the very thing that makes them unique and actually contributes to diversity and uniqueness. The problem is that everyone is so mired down in the myopic small scale, that they can't see the permanent and irreversible destruction and devastation and repercussions their actions cause on a bigger scale. But so is humanity, furiously paving the path to hell in narrow minded, short sighted, selfish, bleeding heart on their sleeve soaked pavers.
• sakopov 10y ago
  I don't think this has anything to do with photography. As someone who's always out with my DSLRs and lenses on nature/wilderness hikes I can say that every picture I take is with the intent of freezing something that is beautiful to my eyes and being able to take it with me. The entire process is like painting on a canvas to me. It's peaceful, relaxing and beautiful. Taking a picture of your feet dangling off a cliff screams "hey look at me I'm so cool because I travel and I want your likes to feel better about myself". It's not about photography. The only intent here is to share and not enjoy what's around you.