11 ms·

Getting Started with Swift on Android

65 points by antfarm 11y ago

V-2 11y ago
"Getting Started with Swift on Android" "FAQ [...] Does this mean I can write Android applications in Swift? No."
- M4v3R 11y ago
  To clarify - you cannot currently write GUI applications for Android in Swift, because no UI toolkit exists for this task at the moment.
  - V-2 11y ago
    Well, thanks. I kind of figured it out, but still I believe it should be stated explicitly, because it looks quite confusing
    - apeacox 11y ago
      Consider it's a getting started, not a develop android apps with swift. Then it's explained in the FAQ, IMHO it makes sense.
      - V-2 11y ago
        Not explicitly, in the sense that it tells me what can't be done instead of what can
        deleted 11y ago
        [deleted]
      - cwyers 11y ago
        Getting started is a phrase often used for tutorials. Tutorials most often are for things that one can actually do.
      - weego 11y ago
        Which begs the question of why anyone thinks it's worth getting started if the outcome isn't something that anyone could do anything with.
- justinpombrio 11y ago
  Aha: it's "(getting started with swift) on android", not "getting started with (swift on android)".
nenadst 11y ago
Has anybody used Silver ? http://www.elementscompiler.com/elements/silver/ http://www.elementscompiler.com/elements/silver/ It seems to offer a working Swift compiler which can also create android apps (and ios and .net)
- rob74 11y ago
  I haven't used it yet, but intrigued by your comment I did a bit of research, and here's the gist of what I have understood: the company behind Silver is RemObjects, and they offer a cross-platform compiler suite called Elements, which supports three languages: C#, Oxygene (their own creation, apparently heavily influenced by Object Pascal) and now Silver, which is Swift with "a few features" added to bring it in line with the other two languages. They're trying to downplay the additions for obvious reasons, but they sound pretty hefty to me: Exception Handling, Partial/Static Classes, External/Inline Functions, Events etc. Imagine what Rob Pike would say if someone came along and added all that to Go ;) (see https://docs.elementscompiler.com/ https://docs.elementscompiler.com/ and https://docs.elementscompiler.com/Silver/LanguageExtensions/ https://docs.elementscompiler.com/Silver/LanguageExtensions/ for details). That being said, the compiler (and IDE for Mac) are freely available, so you can try it out. RemObjects have been around for a while and I was pleased with their products back in the day when I was developing in Delphi, so I'm sure Elements is a solid product as well, just maybe not what you are expecting...
tkubacki 11y ago
I personaly hope Google will replace Java with Dart at some point - it will be easier to switch for average Java dev (syntax) and there is already Dart for Android project - Flutter
- on_and_off 11y ago
  Flutter is a very very very long way from being a replacement for the native UI kit though. It is stuck in an uncanny valley where the effects sorta looks like those of the platform, but are different enough to make the discrepencies very visible. A simple list skips a lot of frames on my Nexus 6P, I can't imagine what I will look like on the regular user's phone. None of the samples do anything interesting, they are just very tiny fragments of UI and even then there are many things missing. Bringing Flutter up to speed with the native UI toolkit would demand a titanic amount of work
drivebyops 11y ago
Would this work to create games for android with OpenGL?
abledon 11y ago
Is it just 'Rumour' at this point Android will officially adopt Swift as their primary application development language?
- akhilcacharya 11y ago
  I'd actually like this. Swift is a really great language, even though them adopting it is very unlikely. I think Google is more likely to keep Java than it is to adopt Swift, or even Go or Kotlin.
- on_and_off 11y ago
  Yes. There are probably internal discussions about the future of the platform, but we have no official information. This 'android port of swift' only allows to target the NDK, not to build an Android app from A to Z.
taveras 11y ago
This is exciting! I can only wonder if Oracle has been enough trouble to pester Google into using a language such as Swift.
bitmapbrother 11y ago
Is there a reason Google didn't make the UI framework language agnostic? Had they coded the Framework API in C/C++ they could easily have made any language a first class citizen by supplying the necessary API wrappers/facades for the languages that needed it.
- yardie 11y ago
  They chose Java because it made sense at the time. Most mobile apps before the current smartphone era were Java based using j2me (or whatever it was called). Just like most iOS developers were existing Mac developers using Obj-C. Still don't know why they don't have hooks for other languages. Your option is to use NDK (I think haven't coded for Android in ages) for those that insisted on C/++
  - bitmapbrother 11y ago
    I'm aware of why they selected Java (mindshare) for their development platform, but that doesn't exactly explain why they coded the majority of their framework in Java. Had they used C/C++ the interoperability with other languages for UI based applications would have been trivial with the respective API wrappers in place.
    - pjmlp 11y ago
      But they do, just those APIs aren't exposed to other NDK applications. For example, the 2D rendering engine is implemented in Skia.
  - pjmlp 11y ago
    Symbian and PocketPC are much older than Android.
  - st3v3r 11y ago
    "Most mobile apps before the current smartphone era were Java based using j2me" Which was routinely criticized for being absolutely terrible, second only to BREW.
- 11y ago
awinter-py 11y ago
I pity the fool JNI
GoldenMonkey 11y ago
Android port has been merged into the swift code-base: https://github.com/apple/swift/pull/1442 https://github.com/apple/swift/pull/1442

65 points by antfarm 11y ago

V-2 11y ago

"Getting Started with Swift on Android" "FAQ [...] Does this mean I can write Android applications in Swift? No."

M4v3R 11y ago
To clarify - you cannot currently write GUI applications for Android in Swift, because no UI toolkit exists for this task at the moment.
- V-2 11y ago
  Well, thanks. I kind of figured it out, but still I believe it should be stated explicitly, because it looks quite confusing
  - apeacox 11y ago
    Consider it's a getting started, not a develop android apps with swift. Then it's explained in the FAQ, IMHO it makes sense.
    - V-2 11y ago
      Not explicitly, in the sense that it tells me what can't be done instead of what can
      - deleted 11y ago
        [deleted]
    - cwyers 11y ago
      Getting started is a phrase often used for tutorials. Tutorials most often are for things that one can actually do.
    - weego 11y ago
      Which begs the question of why anyone thinks it's worth getting started if the outcome isn't something that anyone could do anything with.
justinpombrio 11y ago
Aha: it's "(getting started with swift) on android", not "getting started with (swift on android)".

nenadst 11y ago

Has anybody used Silver ? http://www.elementscompiler.com/elements/silver/ http://www.elementscompiler.com/elements/silver/ It seems to offer a working Swift compiler which can also create android apps (and ios and .net)

rob74 11y ago
I haven't used it yet, but intrigued by your comment I did a bit of research, and here's the gist of what I have understood: the company behind Silver is RemObjects, and they offer a cross-platform compiler suite called Elements, which supports three languages: C#, Oxygene (their own creation, apparently heavily influenced by Object Pascal) and now Silver, which is Swift with "a few features" added to bring it in line with the other two languages. They're trying to downplay the additions for obvious reasons, but they sound pretty hefty to me: Exception Handling, Partial/Static Classes, External/Inline Functions, Events etc. Imagine what Rob Pike would say if someone came along and added all that to Go ;) (see https://docs.elementscompiler.com/ https://docs.elementscompiler.com/ and https://docs.elementscompiler.com/Silver/LanguageExtensions/ https://docs.elementscompiler.com/Silver/LanguageExtensions/ for details). That being said, the compiler (and IDE for Mac) are freely available, so you can try it out. RemObjects have been around for a while and I was pleased with their products back in the day when I was developing in Delphi, so I'm sure Elements is a solid product as well, just maybe not what you are expecting...

tkubacki 11y ago

I personaly hope Google will replace Java with Dart at some point - it will be easier to switch for average Java dev (syntax) and there is already Dart for Android project - Flutter

on_and_off 11y ago
Flutter is a very very very long way from being a replacement for the native UI kit though. It is stuck in an uncanny valley where the effects sorta looks like those of the platform, but are different enough to make the discrepencies very visible. A simple list skips a lot of frames on my Nexus 6P, I can't imagine what I will look like on the regular user's phone. None of the samples do anything interesting, they are just very tiny fragments of UI and even then there are many things missing. Bringing Flutter up to speed with the native UI toolkit would demand a titanic amount of work

drivebyops 11y ago

Would this work to create games for android with OpenGL?

abledon 11y ago

Is it just 'Rumour' at this point Android will officially adopt Swift as their primary application development language?

akhilcacharya 11y ago
I'd actually like this. Swift is a really great language, even though them adopting it is very unlikely. I think Google is more likely to keep Java than it is to adopt Swift, or even Go or Kotlin.
on_and_off 11y ago
Yes. There are probably internal discussions about the future of the platform, but we have no official information. This 'android port of swift' only allows to target the NDK, not to build an Android app from A to Z.

taveras 11y ago

This is exciting! I can only wonder if Oracle has been enough trouble to pester Google into using a language such as Swift.

bitmapbrother 11y ago

Is there a reason Google didn't make the UI framework language agnostic? Had they coded the Framework API in C/C++ they could easily have made any language a first class citizen by supplying the necessary API wrappers/facades for the languages that needed it.

yardie 11y ago
They chose Java because it made sense at the time. Most mobile apps before the current smartphone era were Java based using j2me (or whatever it was called). Just like most iOS developers were existing Mac developers using Obj-C. Still don't know why they don't have hooks for other languages. Your option is to use NDK (I think haven't coded for Android in ages) for those that insisted on C/++
- bitmapbrother 11y ago
  I'm aware of why they selected Java (mindshare) for their development platform, but that doesn't exactly explain why they coded the majority of their framework in Java. Had they used C/C++ the interoperability with other languages for UI based applications would have been trivial with the respective API wrappers in place.
  - pjmlp 11y ago
    But they do, just those APIs aren't exposed to other NDK applications. For example, the 2D rendering engine is implemented in Skia.
- pjmlp 11y ago
  Symbian and PocketPC are much older than Android.
- st3v3r 11y ago
  "Most mobile apps before the current smartphone era were Java based using j2me" Which was routinely criticized for being absolutely terrible, second only to BREW.
11y ago

awinter-py 11y ago

I pity the fool JNI

GoldenMonkey 11y ago

Android port has been merged into the swift code-base: https://github.com/apple/swift/pull/1442 https://github.com/apple/swift/pull/1442