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I don't know why you were downvoted. It's an interesting question you bring up, maybe I can offer some perspective. Why do you feel not high value? You must hav

I don't know why you were downvoted. It's an interesting question you bring up, maybe I can offer some perspective. Why do you feel not high value? You must have had poor experiences on the dating market I reckon. Here's the thing though. Your valuable traits you've listed imply a lot about your potential to provide (clarification: survival resources). In a first-world country where the women have their material resources met, the women just don't need that provider value as much. Think about it: Bay Area has a lot of above-average net worth families. Women are highly educated and employed. So your ability to provide, in and of itself, I don't think will be very attractive in your environment. Would it be more attractive to an East Asian from a less prosperous background? I would think so. Why is this? Harsher environments change sexual strategies and preferences. I highly recommend watching this video on r-K selection theory, it most certainly applies to humans as well on some level: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V06JBpW6O7I&index=3&list=PLMNj_r5bccUw40CpD-JYXJyVsDYsj7ITD https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V06JBpW6O7I&index=3&list=PLM... Anyways, what now? Let's say you agree with my premise. I've seen plenty of guys there. I'm guessing you're a highly intelligent and hard-working first or second generation immigrant with a technical job. I've seen this pattern a lot: people like this have trouble with Western women. Well, you need to play more to social status to differentiate yourself. Things like charisma, social dominance, preselection (women like men that other women like) are things to look into. Looking good physically as a man goes a long way as well: get on a solid lifting / bodybuilding program, groom and dress well. There are plenty of resources all around for these things I've mentioned. To summarize: it's 2016 and you live in the Bay Area. You don't need to provide for women. You need to excite them. You need to differentiate from other men in attractiveness, both socially and physically. There are certain parts of the internet which focus on this stuff and have proven results, though I'll let you search around rather than linking anything here on HN (though I think someone else in this thread posted a link).

stcredzero 11y ago
Your valuable traits you've listed imply a lot about your potential to provide I think this is an illustration of the phenomenon, but it's not the phenomenon you think. Half of the 4 sentences in my self description had nothing to do with my ability to provide. Also, the 1st two sentences had much to do with my socioeconomic status and implied level of education -- both of which are sub-cultural markers. Yet you project on me a preoccupation with providing. Growing up as someone from this culture who just so happens to have this face, I know from both sides the distortion of this culture. We east asian men are supposedly useful economic and intellectual entities with inferior aesthetics or souls or something like that. Your projection fits this pattern. The Bay Area is the same millieu where there was a widespread racist idea in the dot-com years, that south asians were somehow incapable of the deep thinking required for creating a disruptive startup. I didn't say that. It's from the self account of an Indian entrepreneur in a documentary about race in Silicon Valley. I don't really see this place as having changed. If you are from the dominant culture, of course you are spinning this in terms of those complaining being somehow inferior. Not all those who complain are without reason. If you look at culture historically, this happens again and again, and it's quite hard to see from inside the dominant culture.
- hardcandy 11y ago
  Don't give up hope unless you're really quite sure there is none to be had. My freshman college roommate was the most stereotypical shy, hover-parented, second generation Indian immigrant you could imagine. He worked hard to understand social dynamics and improve himself (zxcvvcxz's posts hint at where to start). My roommate was naturally charismatic but it had been repressed by certain dynamics within his culture. I watched him work hard to develop his personality and become more charismatic. I watched him lift in the gym until he became a giant. It was extremely difficult and I doubt everyone is capable of this but from a sample size of 1 I can at least tell you that it's possible and possible in the people that others would least expect it from. By the end of four years my then best friend was the smoothest, most confident mother fucker in the room and enjoyed success in social situations that his high school self couldn't have even imagined and there's no doubt it changed and will continue to change the course of the rest of his life.
- zxcvvcxz 11y ago
  > Half of the 4 sentences in my self description had nothing to do with my ability to provide. That's why I said imply. And yes, of course they do. Good education and talented == good job == money. > Growing up as someone from this culture who just so happens to have this face, I know from both sides the distortion of this culture. We east asian men are supposedly useful economic and intellectual entities with inferior aesthetics or souls or something like that. Your projection fits this pattern. My best friends are East Asian men. So I know the stereotypes pretty well. I wouldn't call it a projection so much as an acknowledgement of how the average American woman will view you, subconsciously or not. Anyways, if my post offended you, that was not the purpose. The purpose was to expose you to the realities of stereotypes and subconscious thought patterns that women (and perhaps society as a whole) will place upon people like you, and have placed on people like my friends. You can complain and bemoan about it, sure, I sympathize. But what I'm trying to express to you is the simple reality of how mating dynamics are different in prosperous Western countries, how women will likely view you, and what types of strategies you could cultivate to increase your odds of success. And for the record, I think your culture (or type of people, whatever you want to call it) are very high value. That's why they're my best friends, and my startup co-founders. But I think society has terrible values (or value functions, rather) when it comes to social capital and the dating market. Look at the pop culture to get a taste of how disdainful of engineers and computer people we are. Always shown as very undesirable. I saw this first hand through college telling people I was a "computer engineer". 'Gross, not cool at all, maybe in 10 years though after I'm done partying' was the general attitude I got from girls, before I started to cultivate different traits.

stcredzero 11y ago

Your valuable traits you've listed imply a lot about your potential to provide I think this is an illustration of the phenomenon, but it's not the phenomenon you think. Half of the 4 sentences in my self description had nothing to do with my ability to provide. Also, the 1st two sentences had much to do with my socioeconomic status and implied level of education -- both of which are sub-cultural markers. Yet you project on me a preoccupation with providing. Growing up as someone from this culture who just so happens to have this face, I know from both sides the distortion of this culture. We east asian men are supposedly useful economic and intellectual entities with inferior aesthetics or souls or something like that. Your projection fits this pattern. The Bay Area is the same millieu where there was a widespread racist idea in the dot-com years, that south asians were somehow incapable of the deep thinking required for creating a disruptive startup. I didn't say that. It's from the self account of an Indian entrepreneur in a documentary about race in Silicon Valley. I don't really see this place as having changed. If you are from the dominant culture, of course you are spinning this in terms of those complaining being somehow inferior. Not all those who complain are without reason. If you look at culture historically, this happens again and again, and it's quite hard to see from inside the dominant culture.

hardcandy 11y ago
Don't give up hope unless you're really quite sure there is none to be had. My freshman college roommate was the most stereotypical shy, hover-parented, second generation Indian immigrant you could imagine. He worked hard to understand social dynamics and improve himself (zxcvvcxz's posts hint at where to start). My roommate was naturally charismatic but it had been repressed by certain dynamics within his culture. I watched him work hard to develop his personality and become more charismatic. I watched him lift in the gym until he became a giant. It was extremely difficult and I doubt everyone is capable of this but from a sample size of 1 I can at least tell you that it's possible and possible in the people that others would least expect it from. By the end of four years my then best friend was the smoothest, most confident mother fucker in the room and enjoyed success in social situations that his high school self couldn't have even imagined and there's no doubt it changed and will continue to change the course of the rest of his life.
zxcvvcxz 11y ago
> Half of the 4 sentences in my self description had nothing to do with my ability to provide. That's why I said imply. And yes, of course they do. Good education and talented == good job == money. > Growing up as someone from this culture who just so happens to have this face, I know from both sides the distortion of this culture. We east asian men are supposedly useful economic and intellectual entities with inferior aesthetics or souls or something like that. Your projection fits this pattern. My best friends are East Asian men. So I know the stereotypes pretty well. I wouldn't call it a projection so much as an acknowledgement of how the average American woman will view you, subconsciously or not. Anyways, if my post offended you, that was not the purpose. The purpose was to expose you to the realities of stereotypes and subconscious thought patterns that women (and perhaps society as a whole) will place upon people like you, and have placed on people like my friends. You can complain and bemoan about it, sure, I sympathize. But what I'm trying to express to you is the simple reality of how mating dynamics are different in prosperous Western countries, how women will likely view you, and what types of strategies you could cultivate to increase your odds of success. And for the record, I think your culture (or type of people, whatever you want to call it) are very high value. That's why they're my best friends, and my startup co-founders. But I think society has terrible values (or value functions, rather) when it comes to social capital and the dating market. Look at the pop culture to get a taste of how disdainful of engineers and computer people we are. Always shown as very undesirable. I saw this first hand through college telling people I was a "computer engineer". 'Gross, not cool at all, maybe in 10 years though after I'm done partying' was the general attitude I got from girls, before I started to cultivate different traits.