6 ms·

I was bullish on using dating apps as I went on a good date within a week of signing up to one, amazing since I'm on the lower end of the 1-10 attractiveness sc

by colmvp 11y ago

I was bullish on using dating apps as I went on a good date within a week of signing up to one, amazing since I'm on the lower end of the 1-10 attractiveness scale. Realistically, I'd put myself as 2. However, since then, it's been miss after miss. And it suuuuucks. Nothings more demoralizing than going weeks without a hit, or having women 'accept' to communicate with you, only to give uninteresting, insipid responses.

danielrhodes 11y ago
You can be ugly as sin, but lucky for you women are not that vapid. Working on self esteem, confidence, and emotional awareness will pratically erase any physical deficits.
- cellularmitosis 11y ago
  but lucky for you women are not that vapid So I used to believe this. I believed that allowing myself to be a slave to physical attraction was a character flaw, that every time I paid attention to an attractive woman and rejected an unattractive woman that I was a shallow, vapid person. I felt ashamed of it. But have you ever tried dating someone whom you just weren't physically attracted to? I have (twice). It turns out it doesn't work in the long run. Convincing yourself that its the "right thing to do" will work in the short term, but eventually you'll build resentment towards them until the relationship falls apart. I'd encourage you to reconsider this viewpoint, and to stop promulgating it. Be honest with yourself. Anything else is just being reckless with another human being's emotions.
  - alashley 11y ago
    Well said, whenever I hear some one say "I don't care about looks" I think they're trying to put themselves above being superficial, but I think a lot of the time its just lip service. Everyone has their own definition of "good looking" and to that end looks do matter to many people.
  - danielrhodes 11y ago
    Everybody looks different to each other, and there are definitely women who are seen by others to be attractive which I don't find all that attractive (not my type). Likewise, women do not purely look at physical appearance to decide if they find somebody attractive, and neither do men. There are clearly other factors at play. So for somebody to say: I am not physically attractive and therefore not suitable to date is likely not true. Even if you could objectively say that you were physically unattractive, your best bet is to compensate by being better at the other things that form attraction.
- m_fayer 11y ago
  You can have all the self esteem and confidence in the world, but without verbal communication or body language these traits are hard to perceive. It takes extra effort to not be vapid on Tinder and co, and to recognise that a person's ability to craft a compelling impression out of a few flattering photos and a shred of text is an indicator of a capacity for self-branding and not necessarily much else.
- colmvp 11y ago
  Uh I feel like it's fictional to frame it as if women don't care about physical looks. Just go to a cafe and see who they are paired up with. Rarely do I see huge variance with physical attractiveness between the pair. Or read dating stories on Washington Post's date lab where as a reader you can decipher physical attraction between the participants within first few paragraphs and accurately predict the likelihood of the participants dating a second time.
  - massysett 11y ago
    In the case of Date Lab, it's more likely this is because the writer knew the outcome so she will slant the piece from the beginning. She will only add material that advances the thesis--which is that they belong together or they don't.
  - danielrhodes 11y ago
    Well you are right that it is certainly not an absolute truth. Some people do select mostly on appearance. However, since appearance is so subjective and the way we are seen is not absolute, attractiveness loses a lot of meaning. I think it is also dependent on age: younger people tend to go for appearances far more. Nonetheless, confidence is not as subjective: it really has a positive impact when all other things are held equal.
  - giaour 11y ago
    You can blame online dating for that, too! http://priceonomics.com/online-dating-and-the-death-of-the-mixed/ http://priceonomics.com/online-dating-and-the-death-of-the-m...
CyberDildonics 11y ago
As with many things you will get out what you put in.
- colmvp 11y ago
  Eh. I put a helluvalot effort in the messages I send. I can't necessarily say the same for the responses I receive. It is what it is.
  - stouset 11y ago
    Honesty that may be part of your problem. Think of Tinder as meeting someone in a virtual bar — you're not going to spend a hell of a lot of time on what you open with. All you're going for is something just interesting and personal enough to actually start a conversation. If you're regularly sending opening messages more than a sentence or two long, you're probably investing way too much effort to start out.
  - paulcole 11y ago
    Yep, this is a big mistake. Messages should be short and should take almost no effort to write. On OKC my success rate was very high and my initial messages were made up of 3 sentences max: 1) Hello 2) Show I read their profile. "Oh you like The Mountain Goats? I saw them when I was in Chicago last summer." 3) Ask a question about their interests. "I've been looking to take cooking classes. Any recommendations?" I had an incredibly high response rate, 1 out of every 3 or 4.
    - alashley 11y ago
      Agreed, I get a much higher response rate with a quick message than I used to when I would send more ahem in-depth messages. I think it sort of mirrors real-life interactions in that way, generally one doesn't approach someone at a bar and start off with a long-winded introduction.
    - ones_and_zeros 11y ago
      To me that even seems like tooo much effort. I had great success with the "funny tongue in cheek question/comment about a photo" approach. "Looking pretty friendly with that penguin, do you guys still keep in touch?" "Id say we should hula hoop together, but my hula hoop is in the shop. Unless you have a spare?"
CptJamesCook 11y ago
Don't be so quick to rate yourself ugly. Women actually consider 80% of men to be worse looking than average average: http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your-looks-and-online-dating/ http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your-looks-and-online-dati... That reality can make a lot of average to somewhat good looking men feel ugly. Are you in incredibly good shape? Have you hired a professional stylist? Have you hired a professional photographer? Have you taken professional pictures shirtless, with dogs, traveling, and with cool friends? I'm guessing you haven't done all of the above, so there is hope. Women are attracted to your overall value, not just looks. Find a way to show it online. Implement all of the strategies from this online dating guide: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3l310a/the_red_pillers_guide_to_online_dating/ https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3l310a/the_red_...
- amwelles 11y ago
  The Red Pill is notoriously sexist. I'd recommend /r/okcupid's guides, which apply to any gender or sexual orientation: - https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsprofile https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsprofile - https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsmessaging https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsmessaging
  - ben_jones 11y ago
    Agreed. Coming into college I found The Red Pill and thought it was some kind of guide to male-success. Really it's just the path to being a cynic which is neither the path to happiness or success. It takes the lowest stereotypes and applies them as natural laws to society. The problem is there is no set of laws for societal interactions, people are good, people are bad, people do crazy things, people do predictable things..
  - CptJamesCook 11y ago
    I found the red pill guide far more actionable and effective than the okcupid guide. Men and women don't have the same challenges in dating so combining advice for the two is unhelpful. (Ignoring the ad hominem)
  - 11y ago
ramses0 11y ago
Once upon a time I dated a very good looking girl. I got to see the "before" and "after" as it took her two hours in the morning to get ready. It gave me a theory which I call the "two hours a day" theory. If anyone (even a self-described "2") puts in 2 hours a day trying to look attractive, they will have some level of success. That might be 2 hours a day picking your clothes, 2 hours fixing your hair, brushing your teeth, whatever... short term things. That might also be 2 hours a day in the gym (physical appearance), or 2 hours a day practicing public speaking (confidence, crowd control), anything which helps radiate attractiveness, draw people in so they can see all the things that make you attractive which don't appear at first glance. If you're not spending 2 hours a day trying to look attractive or be attractive, you can't really complain because the most attractive people I know spend (invest) on the order of that much time to get there and stay there. If it's a weight thing, hit up the weight loss subreddits (/r/loseit, /r/fitness, /r/progresspics, etc) and talk to a psychologist about it. When you don't take care of yourself it can manifest as weight gain, but the core is not taking care of yourself which is fundamentally psychological. (ie: rating yourself as a 2 on a scale of 1-10 doesn't bode well for positive self-image and self confidence). Talk to a psychologist about it, seriously. May is Mental Health Awareness month so it's a perfect time to look into it and take action. If it's anything else cosmetic (hair, teeth, skin, clothes) that's an easy fix and a lot of times can literally be resolved in an afternoon if you have the right instruction (/r/skincareaddiction, /r/malefashionadvice, /r/streetwear). My email is ramses0@yahoo.com if you or anyone else wants to continue the discussion (news.y.c messaging isn't the thing I check the most) and if you're in the Bay Area I wouldn't mind meeting up some time, hanging out and just talking.
- ben_jones 11y ago
  Really interesting point. I had similar thoughts but I always distributed the time investment over the course of the day, like you spend 5 minutes at lunch in your decision not to get fast-food, 20 minutes throughout the day getting the right out-fit, an hour doing cardio, etc. I think the two hours at once thing is more meaningful because it makes you really great at that one thing. Then you get to spend the whole day thinking in the back of your mind "I'm really great at this one thing".
- 11y ago
IkmoIkmo 11y ago
About the 'accept but don't communicate'... I've watched friends, boys n girls, just swipe everything without looking. Then when they get a match, they look and consider it. Essentially they're optimising for themselves. Why do the filter work on a group of maybe's, when you can filter on a smaller group of certainties? So if someone accepts you and does't reply, I'd say nowadays (not 1-2 years ago), it's pretty likely they didn't change their minds, but simply decided for the first time you're not for them. Other than that, don't read into it too much. I've got one pretty attractive friend, easy 7, who doesn't match shit, in fact we were laughing about it among friends (including him) a few weeks ago, he hadn't been on a date in months and he was definitely trying. Keep ya head up! :)
kevin365 11y ago
I know! I wish I could force women to talk to me against their will :-/

by colmvp 11y ago

danielrhodes 11y ago

You can be ugly as sin, but lucky for you women are not that vapid. Working on self esteem, confidence, and emotional awareness will pratically erase any physical deficits.

cellularmitosis 11y ago
but lucky for you women are not that vapid So I used to believe this. I believed that allowing myself to be a slave to physical attraction was a character flaw, that every time I paid attention to an attractive woman and rejected an unattractive woman that I was a shallow, vapid person. I felt ashamed of it. But have you ever tried dating someone whom you just weren't physically attracted to? I have (twice). It turns out it doesn't work in the long run. Convincing yourself that its the "right thing to do" will work in the short term, but eventually you'll build resentment towards them until the relationship falls apart. I'd encourage you to reconsider this viewpoint, and to stop promulgating it. Be honest with yourself. Anything else is just being reckless with another human being's emotions.
- alashley 11y ago
  Well said, whenever I hear some one say "I don't care about looks" I think they're trying to put themselves above being superficial, but I think a lot of the time its just lip service. Everyone has their own definition of "good looking" and to that end looks do matter to many people.
- danielrhodes 11y ago
  Everybody looks different to each other, and there are definitely women who are seen by others to be attractive which I don't find all that attractive (not my type). Likewise, women do not purely look at physical appearance to decide if they find somebody attractive, and neither do men. There are clearly other factors at play. So for somebody to say: I am not physically attractive and therefore not suitable to date is likely not true. Even if you could objectively say that you were physically unattractive, your best bet is to compensate by being better at the other things that form attraction.
m_fayer 11y ago
You can have all the self esteem and confidence in the world, but without verbal communication or body language these traits are hard to perceive. It takes extra effort to not be vapid on Tinder and co, and to recognise that a person's ability to craft a compelling impression out of a few flattering photos and a shred of text is an indicator of a capacity for self-branding and not necessarily much else.
colmvp 11y ago
Uh I feel like it's fictional to frame it as if women don't care about physical looks. Just go to a cafe and see who they are paired up with. Rarely do I see huge variance with physical attractiveness between the pair. Or read dating stories on Washington Post's date lab where as a reader you can decipher physical attraction between the participants within first few paragraphs and accurately predict the likelihood of the participants dating a second time.
- massysett 11y ago
  In the case of Date Lab, it's more likely this is because the writer knew the outcome so she will slant the piece from the beginning. She will only add material that advances the thesis--which is that they belong together or they don't.
- danielrhodes 11y ago
  Well you are right that it is certainly not an absolute truth. Some people do select mostly on appearance. However, since appearance is so subjective and the way we are seen is not absolute, attractiveness loses a lot of meaning. I think it is also dependent on age: younger people tend to go for appearances far more. Nonetheless, confidence is not as subjective: it really has a positive impact when all other things are held equal.
- giaour 11y ago
  You can blame online dating for that, too! http://priceonomics.com/online-dating-and-the-death-of-the-mixed/ http://priceonomics.com/online-dating-and-the-death-of-the-m...

CyberDildonics 11y ago

As with many things you will get out what you put in.

colmvp 11y ago
Eh. I put a helluvalot effort in the messages I send. I can't necessarily say the same for the responses I receive. It is what it is.
- stouset 11y ago
  Honesty that may be part of your problem. Think of Tinder as meeting someone in a virtual bar — you're not going to spend a hell of a lot of time on what you open with. All you're going for is something just interesting and personal enough to actually start a conversation. If you're regularly sending opening messages more than a sentence or two long, you're probably investing way too much effort to start out.
- paulcole 11y ago
  Yep, this is a big mistake. Messages should be short and should take almost no effort to write. On OKC my success rate was very high and my initial messages were made up of 3 sentences max: 1) Hello 2) Show I read their profile. "Oh you like The Mountain Goats? I saw them when I was in Chicago last summer." 3) Ask a question about their interests. "I've been looking to take cooking classes. Any recommendations?" I had an incredibly high response rate, 1 out of every 3 or 4.
  - alashley 11y ago
    Agreed, I get a much higher response rate with a quick message than I used to when I would send more ahem in-depth messages. I think it sort of mirrors real-life interactions in that way, generally one doesn't approach someone at a bar and start off with a long-winded introduction.
  - ones_and_zeros 11y ago
    To me that even seems like tooo much effort. I had great success with the "funny tongue in cheek question/comment about a photo" approach. "Looking pretty friendly with that penguin, do you guys still keep in touch?" "Id say we should hula hoop together, but my hula hoop is in the shop. Unless you have a spare?"

CptJamesCook 11y ago

Don't be so quick to rate yourself ugly. Women actually consider 80% of men to be worse looking than average average: http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your-looks-and-online-dating/ http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your-looks-and-online-dati... That reality can make a lot of average to somewhat good looking men feel ugly. Are you in incredibly good shape? Have you hired a professional stylist? Have you hired a professional photographer? Have you taken professional pictures shirtless, with dogs, traveling, and with cool friends? I'm guessing you haven't done all of the above, so there is hope. Women are attracted to your overall value, not just looks. Find a way to show it online. Implement all of the strategies from this online dating guide: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3l310a/the_red_pillers_guide_to_online_dating/ https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3l310a/the_red_...

amwelles 11y ago
The Red Pill is notoriously sexist. I'd recommend /r/okcupid's guides, which apply to any gender or sexual orientation: - https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsprofile https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsprofile - https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsmessaging https://www.reddit.com/r/OkCupid/wiki/dosanddontsmessaging
- ben_jones 11y ago
  Agreed. Coming into college I found The Red Pill and thought it was some kind of guide to male-success. Really it's just the path to being a cynic which is neither the path to happiness or success. It takes the lowest stereotypes and applies them as natural laws to society. The problem is there is no set of laws for societal interactions, people are good, people are bad, people do crazy things, people do predictable things..
- CptJamesCook 11y ago
  I found the red pill guide far more actionable and effective than the okcupid guide. Men and women don't have the same challenges in dating so combining advice for the two is unhelpful. (Ignoring the ad hominem)
- 11y ago

ramses0 11y ago

Once upon a time I dated a very good looking girl. I got to see the "before" and "after" as it took her two hours in the morning to get ready. It gave me a theory which I call the "two hours a day" theory. If anyone (even a self-described "2") puts in 2 hours a day trying to look attractive, they will have some level of success. That might be 2 hours a day picking your clothes, 2 hours fixing your hair, brushing your teeth, whatever... short term things. That might also be 2 hours a day in the gym (physical appearance), or 2 hours a day practicing public speaking (confidence, crowd control), anything which helps radiate attractiveness, draw people in so they can see all the things that make you attractive which don't appear at first glance. If you're not spending 2 hours a day trying to look attractive or be attractive, you can't really complain because the most attractive people I know spend (invest) on the order of that much time to get there and stay there. If it's a weight thing, hit up the weight loss subreddits (/r/loseit, /r/fitness, /r/progresspics, etc) and talk to a psychologist about it. When you don't take care of yourself it can manifest as weight gain, but the core is not taking care of yourself which is fundamentally psychological. (ie: rating yourself as a 2 on a scale of 1-10 doesn't bode well for positive self-image and self confidence). Talk to a psychologist about it, seriously. May is Mental Health Awareness month so it's a perfect time to look into it and take action. If it's anything else cosmetic (hair, teeth, skin, clothes) that's an easy fix and a lot of times can literally be resolved in an afternoon if you have the right instruction (/r/skincareaddiction, /r/malefashionadvice, /r/streetwear). My email is ramses0@yahoo.com if you or anyone else wants to continue the discussion (news.y.c messaging isn't the thing I check the most) and if you're in the Bay Area I wouldn't mind meeting up some time, hanging out and just talking.

ben_jones 11y ago
Really interesting point. I had similar thoughts but I always distributed the time investment over the course of the day, like you spend 5 minutes at lunch in your decision not to get fast-food, 20 minutes throughout the day getting the right out-fit, an hour doing cardio, etc. I think the two hours at once thing is more meaningful because it makes you really great at that one thing. Then you get to spend the whole day thinking in the back of your mind "I'm really great at this one thing".
11y ago

IkmoIkmo 11y ago

About the 'accept but don't communicate'... I've watched friends, boys n girls, just swipe everything without looking. Then when they get a match, they look and consider it. Essentially they're optimising for themselves. Why do the filter work on a group of maybe's, when you can filter on a smaller group of certainties? So if someone accepts you and does't reply, I'd say nowadays (not 1-2 years ago), it's pretty likely they didn't change their minds, but simply decided for the first time you're not for them. Other than that, don't read into it too much. I've got one pretty attractive friend, easy 7, who doesn't match shit, in fact we were laughing about it among friends (including him) a few weeks ago, he hadn't been on a date in months and he was definitely trying. Keep ya head up! :)

kevin365 11y ago

I know! I wish I could force women to talk to me against their will :-/