4 ms·

I'm going to come out and say that this is no different than a person born without arms claiming that they're not disabled, that they're not damaged. To claim

I'm going to come out and say that this is no different than a person born without arms claiming that they're not disabled, that they're not damaged. To claim we shouldn't cure autism because doing so would "reject neuro-atypicality as a valid state of being" (a typical non-statement) is as absurd as saying we shouldn't grow people new limbs (assuming we had the capability) because it's a rejection of amputeeism as a valid state of being. In a perfect world, autistic children would be found extremely young and cured before they suffered any real harm from their condition.

mercer 10y ago
I think it's more complicated than that. Perhaps you have a point when it comes to severe autism where the autist, the caretakers, and society clearly 'suffer' to various degrees and nobody benefits in any way. Perhaps. But this is very much not the case with milder forms of autism. Many high-functioning autists can take care of themselves and even have very successful careers, and there are a number of characteristics typical of autism that are very beneficial to the 'sufferer' and/or society. I'd say autism, or at least some forms of autism, are like being born with wings. In a society made for arms you have a clear disability. But if you find your way and the right environment, well, you might be able to fly and provide things that 'arm-ies' cannot.
DanBC 10y ago
> I'm going to come out and say that this is no different than a person born without arms claiming that they're not disabled, that they're not damaged. You might want to look at the social model of disability, because there are people who do say this. For example, wheelchair using disability rights campaigners have often said that their wheelchairs are not the problem, but the lack of ramps in shops and workplaces is what causes them to be disabled. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_model_of_disability https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_model_of_disability That's not a new concept; it's been around since the 1970s.
- JoeAltmaier 10y ago
  Makes sense, that folks have been fooling themselves since the '70s. It was that kind of decade.
  - DanBC 10y ago
    It's a simple concept. How can I help you understand it? It's created large amounts of social change. American disability law derives from it, for one example. Here's a cite from UK goverment mentioning the social model: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/2010-to-2015-government-policy-equality/2010-to-2015-government-policy-equality https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/2010-to-2015-gove... > We encourage the use of the social model as a way of understanding disability. It says that disability is created by barriers in society. > The barriers generally fall into 3 categories: > the environment – including inaccessible buildings and services > people’s attitudes – stereotyping, discrimination and prejudice > organisations – inflexible policies, practices and procedures You probably need to be aware of this, because not being aware of it creates a risk if you ever have any management role.
    - JoeAltmaier 10y ago
      Of course I'm aware of it. But redefining well-known terms is a sign of groupthink, common among activist group. By pretending words mean a whole new thing, we can identify the in group, and humiliate the out group. I won't participate in that hallucination. A disability is when you have less ability than everybody else. We can mitigate that by addressing {everything you list above}.
      - DanBC 10y ago
        > A disability is when you have less ability than everybody else. What percentile?
    - AlgorithmicTime 10y ago
      >It says that disability is created by barriers in society. Super ridiculous. If you put the people categorized as disabled into the savanna without society around, they'd be far worse off. Disability is NOT A SOCIAL PHENOMENON, it's a physical problem with a human body.

mercer 10y ago

I think it's more complicated than that. Perhaps you have a point when it comes to severe autism where the autist, the caretakers, and society clearly 'suffer' to various degrees and nobody benefits in any way. Perhaps. But this is very much not the case with milder forms of autism. Many high-functioning autists can take care of themselves and even have very successful careers, and there are a number of characteristics typical of autism that are very beneficial to the 'sufferer' and/or society. I'd say autism, or at least some forms of autism, are like being born with wings. In a society made for arms you have a clear disability. But if you find your way and the right environment, well, you might be able to fly and provide things that 'arm-ies' cannot.

DanBC 10y ago

> I'm going to come out and say that this is no different than a person born without arms claiming that they're not disabled, that they're not damaged. You might want to look at the social model of disability, because there are people who do say this. For example, wheelchair using disability rights campaigners have often said that their wheelchairs are not the problem, but the lack of ramps in shops and workplaces is what causes them to be disabled. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_model_of_disability https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_model_of_disability That's not a new concept; it's been around since the 1970s.

JoeAltmaier 10y ago
Makes sense, that folks have been fooling themselves since the '70s. It was that kind of decade.
- DanBC 10y ago
  It's a simple concept. How can I help you understand it? It's created large amounts of social change. American disability law derives from it, for one example. Here's a cite from UK goverment mentioning the social model: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/2010-to-2015-government-policy-equality/2010-to-2015-government-policy-equality https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/2010-to-2015-gove... > We encourage the use of the social model as a way of understanding disability. It says that disability is created by barriers in society. > The barriers generally fall into 3 categories: > the environment – including inaccessible buildings and services > people’s attitudes – stereotyping, discrimination and prejudice > organisations – inflexible policies, practices and procedures You probably need to be aware of this, because not being aware of it creates a risk if you ever have any management role.
  - JoeAltmaier 10y ago
    Of course I'm aware of it. But redefining well-known terms is a sign of groupthink, common among activist group. By pretending words mean a whole new thing, we can identify the in group, and humiliate the out group. I won't participate in that hallucination. A disability is when you have less ability than everybody else. We can mitigate that by addressing {everything you list above}.
    - DanBC 10y ago
      > A disability is when you have less ability than everybody else. What percentile?
  - AlgorithmicTime 10y ago
    >It says that disability is created by barriers in society. Super ridiculous. If you put the people categorized as disabled into the savanna without society around, they'd be far worse off. Disability is NOT A SOCIAL PHENOMENON, it's a physical problem with a human body.