6 ms·

Until people actually go to jail for like 30 years and until fines far exceed any profits, companies will continue to indulge in this type of behaviour. The re

by SeanDav 11y ago

Until people actually go to jail for like 30 years and until fines far exceed any profits, companies will continue to indulge in this type of behaviour. The rewards are just too good and the downsides too easy to live with.

jbattle 11y ago
Or even having their massive bonuses clawed back. Ignoring the motivations of the company for a second, employees at places like GS are clearly incentivized to push the limits. Personally collect big bonuses now, let the company as a whole pay fines in several years. Not a good dynamic
talmand 11y ago
Yep, give me $100 with maybe having to give back $1 while admitting it was wrong and I'm sure I'll never do that deal again.
InclinedPlane 11y ago
If you steal a slice of pizza 3 times you can go to prison for a very long time. If you steal billions over years and years and wreck the economy while doing so, you won't face any personal consequences.
- Godel_unicode 11y ago
  This is not true in the majority of the United States unless you already had felony convictions unrelated to your pizza caper. The misdemeanor petty theft only gets upgraded to a felony if you have a pattern of behavior, and that upgraded felony would only be your first strike.
slg 11y ago
I wonder what people here would say if non-tech folks started talking like this about the tech industry. For example, how many stories have we heard about data leaks involving complete incompetence or negligence by the company involved? How many of them have ended up in jail or even with a fine?
- drewrv 11y ago
  GS "knowingly misled investors". This is worse than incompetence, it's outright fraud. It's less analogous to accidental customer data leaks and more analogous to running a phishing operation.
  - spinlock 11y ago
    They sampled rather than investigate every note. We all take those "short cuts."
  - slg 11y ago
    Similar things happen in the tech world. Ashley Madison had a feature that you could pay to have your data deleted from their database. Except they never deleted the data for those that paid. That is outright fraud as well. When their user data eventually leaked, it resulted in countless lives and relationships ruined and at least a handful of suicides. While civil lawsuits have been filed, I haven't seen any talk of criminal charges.
    - adamnemecek 11y ago
      Dude, you aren't actually comparing the two are you. Do you actually believe that tanking the global economy comes anywhere close to what you described? May I ask where you work? No one not working on/with ties to Wall Street would have this opinion.
      - slg 11y ago
        I don't work anywhere close or on anything similar to Wall Street. But I do have a degree in econ and know that what "tanked the global economy" is a lot more complicated than Goldman Sachs lying to investors. But whatever, let's just lynch the bankers and their big bonuses and pretend that our industry is without flaws.
    - jbdigriz 11y ago
      People need their totems and need for them to be simplistic and singular to classify them as black or white. No thought given to things like government MANDATING increased numbers of subprime loans to facilitate a populist agenda, nor the guilt of the vast majority choosing to live beyond their means knowingly. Instead, they want a boogey man everyone can point their blame towards. The degree of that folly will be apparent over the years to come
kartman 11y ago
wow, pretty amazing - i wish i could get away with stuff like this! obama should have listed this as his top failure. they have actually proven that they are smarter than each and everyone of us - in acquiring money by any means and getting away with it. very impressive in a twisted way.

by SeanDav 11y ago

jbattle 11y ago

Or even having their massive bonuses clawed back. Ignoring the motivations of the company for a second, employees at places like GS are clearly incentivized to push the limits. Personally collect big bonuses now, let the company as a whole pay fines in several years. Not a good dynamic

talmand 11y ago

Yep, give me $100 with maybe having to give back $1 while admitting it was wrong and I'm sure I'll never do that deal again.

InclinedPlane 11y ago

If you steal a slice of pizza 3 times you can go to prison for a very long time. If you steal billions over years and years and wreck the economy while doing so, you won't face any personal consequences.

Godel_unicode 11y ago
This is not true in the majority of the United States unless you already had felony convictions unrelated to your pizza caper. The misdemeanor petty theft only gets upgraded to a felony if you have a pattern of behavior, and that upgraded felony would only be your first strike.

slg 11y ago

I wonder what people here would say if non-tech folks started talking like this about the tech industry. For example, how many stories have we heard about data leaks involving complete incompetence or negligence by the company involved? How many of them have ended up in jail or even with a fine?

drewrv 11y ago
GS "knowingly misled investors". This is worse than incompetence, it's outright fraud. It's less analogous to accidental customer data leaks and more analogous to running a phishing operation.
- spinlock 11y ago
  They sampled rather than investigate every note. We all take those "short cuts."
- slg 11y ago
  Similar things happen in the tech world. Ashley Madison had a feature that you could pay to have your data deleted from their database. Except they never deleted the data for those that paid. That is outright fraud as well. When their user data eventually leaked, it resulted in countless lives and relationships ruined and at least a handful of suicides. While civil lawsuits have been filed, I haven't seen any talk of criminal charges.
  - adamnemecek 11y ago
    Dude, you aren't actually comparing the two are you. Do you actually believe that tanking the global economy comes anywhere close to what you described? May I ask where you work? No one not working on/with ties to Wall Street would have this opinion.
    - slg 11y ago
      I don't work anywhere close or on anything similar to Wall Street. But I do have a degree in econ and know that what "tanked the global economy" is a lot more complicated than Goldman Sachs lying to investors. But whatever, let's just lynch the bankers and their big bonuses and pretend that our industry is without flaws.
  - jbdigriz 11y ago
    People need their totems and need for them to be simplistic and singular to classify them as black or white. No thought given to things like government MANDATING increased numbers of subprime loans to facilitate a populist agenda, nor the guilt of the vast majority choosing to live beyond their means knowingly. Instead, they want a boogey man everyone can point their blame towards. The degree of that folly will be apparent over the years to come

kartman 11y ago

wow, pretty amazing - i wish i could get away with stuff like this! obama should have listed this as his top failure. they have actually proven that they are smarter than each and everyone of us - in acquiring money by any means and getting away with it. very impressive in a twisted way.