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Ask HN: Is the Thiel Fellowship worth it?

• morgante 11y ago
  I didn't go through it, but you should almost certainly apply. You can always decline later. I'm too old for it, but it's basically free money. You can always return to college later if you really want to.
  • SaaS_throwme 11y ago
    > but you should almost certainly apply Also, need to remember it adds up - YC, 500Startups, tech stars, etc. and then pondering about the results and then the sorrow phase after not being accepted. Weigh your trade offs.
    • jtmarmon 11y ago
      don't apply to things because you might get rejected from them is certainly good life advice
      • Balgair 11y ago
        I think they are talking about the time involved with the application and the associated worry and issues of rejection after rejection (on odds).
    • jstandard 11y ago
      If you can't deal with rejection or selling people on your idea/yourself, then entrepreneurship is likely not the right path for you. If it takes a few rejected applications to learn that, it is time well spent.
      • SaaS_throwme 11y ago
        Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. Dealing with rejections takes time, you get distracted, you get sad, it kills time which can be put in much better use. You can deal with rejections, but that doesn't mean you have to deal with rejections. You can use the time to make your product better. Someone famously said "Be so good, they can't ignore you", being mediocre and spending time in those activities is not very fruitful.
• selectout 11y ago
  I wasn't in it myself but am friends with several who were. It seems to be absolutely worth it. As morgante said earlier, you can always turn it down.
• jarcane 11y ago
  Are you morally and ethically comfortable with taking money from a fascist to be a living cog in his anti-education political statement?
  • burkaman 11y ago
    Isn't he mostly a libertarian? You can't just label all political views you don't like "fascism".
    • temuze 11y ago
      I'm not a libertarian, but I'd consider libertarianism pretty opposite to fascism.
    • jarcane 11y ago
      He's buds with the NRx scene, funds Moldbug's company, and the two basically quote each other's anti-democractic, anti-education, anti-woman rhetoric regularly enough to be a known quantity. He basically wrote a whole book aping Moldbug's "Cathedral" theory. FFS, he gave money to Ted Cruz, a guy who makes Donald Trump look less frightening. I sure as shit don't want his dirty money, not even to slack off for two years.
      • XFrequentist 11y ago
        "Anti-woman"? On what is that based? (Agree that the other antis listed are indeed self-evident, btw.)
        • burkaman 11y ago
          You could infer that from this: "The 1920s were the last decade in American history during which one could be genuinely optimistic about politics. Since 1920, the vast increase in welfare beneficiaries and the extension of the franchise to women — two constituencies that are notoriously tough for libertarians — have rendered the notion of “capitalist democracy” into an oxymoron." - http://www.cato-unbound.org/2009/04/13/peter-thiel/education-libertarian http://www.cato-unbound.org/2009/04/13/peter-thiel/education... So basically women have ruined any chance of democracy achieving the political goals he wants. I'm sure he would disagree that this is anti-women, but it's not hard to read it that way. He sort of addresses this criticism at the bottom of the article, but not really: "It would be absurd to suggest that women’s votes will be taken away or that this would solve the political problems that vex us. While I don’t think any class of people should be disenfranchised, I have little hope that voting will make things better."
• tedmiston 11y ago
  The general answer to this question for any accelerator-type program is: talk with someone who went through it and you trust. Alternatively, look at outcomes of the companies from (recent) batches, but be careful -- that can lead to attributing too much to the program vs. innate qualities of those founders. If you can't find a connection to someone who went through it personally, try a cold email. Many founders will give you a short call or respond to a well-written email that briefly and directly asks about their experience and recommendation if you can prove (briefly) your qualifications. If you're going to take this approach, expect to be very open with sharing details of your idea. With the Thiel Fellowship specifically, you may consider reaching out to the founders of Sprayable Energy. They ran a successful Kickstarter campaign [I was a backer], and are pretty cool dudes. http://techcrunch.com/2013/08/20/sprayable-energy/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/08/20/sprayable-energy/
• paulpauper 11y ago
  These fellows are selected for high IQ will benefit either way. By virtue of his intelligence, connections, and family wealth, Bill Gates would have been successful whether he stayed in college or not. I'm sure many of these failed fellows will go to college and resume where they left off.
• jtmarmon 11y ago
  Thiel Fellow here. The question is not whether or not you should take it, it's whether or not you should drop out. I had already dropped out when I took it so it was a no brainer for me. If you've already dropped out or decided to I don't even know why you're asking - at worst it's free money. If you're asking whether or not you should drop out, that's a pretty opinionated thing and depends entirely on your circumstances, but I'd recommend you go for it (fellowship or not). As morgante said, you can always go back to college. 10 years from now sillicon valley might not be so friendly to us tadpoles
  • Harimwakairi 11y ago
    While I completely agree that attendance at a four-year university is overhyped as The Key to Success, the idea that "you can always go back to college" is flawed. While people do go back to school all the time, calling a multiyear timeout on making money is extremely difficult once you start acquiring real responsibilities, and working a real job while in school is no cakewalk. source: I dropped out, worked as an engineer, then went back and graduated at 29.
    • argonaut 11y ago
      It's not flawed at all. You can always go back to college if you want. If you don't want to go back to college (because you don't judge it to be worth taking time off your career for)... yes, I suppose that will make going back to college rather difficult ;)
    • cableshaft 11y ago
      And another thing you might not consider if you drop out or delay college now: college tuition has been increasing really fast for well over a decade now, and it's not clear when that's going to stop. I took an 8 year hiatus from school, and when I went back, tuition had doubled since the last time I attended. I ended up graduating with $25k in student loan debt, whereas if I had stuck it out the first time around it would have been a much more manageable $12k. I wouldn't be anywhere near in as much debt right now if I had taken out loans and stuck with school the first time around.
• giaour 11y ago
  Kind of, in the sense that fellows get a large check and few responsibilities. You have to drop out of college, but you can always reapply and return. Not really, in the sense that fellows are used as poster children for Thiel's vision of society. If you don't agree with the seasteader movement, you probably won't appreciate being a spokesperson for that worldview. If a different organization you disagreed with offered you a big check to drop out of college and act like a true believer, would you do it?
  • ESRogs 11y ago
    Are you really asked to be a spokesman for seasteading? Or are you just pointing out that fellows will find themselves associated with it
    • giaour 11y ago
      Fellows will find themselves associated with Thiel's political stances.
• vessenes 11y ago
  If you aren't already plugged in to Silicon Valley in some way, getting accepted will definitely help your startup career, mostly through knowledge and mentoring acquired and the relationships. Social capital, essentially. Plus all the knowledge you get trying to make a startup go. I would imagine if you'd been accepted, you could always go to University once your startup is 'done', either finished or acquired, and you would likely have your pick. That said, you get a different sort of social capital from going to a top-tier school and graduate school, and of course, in a good technical degree program you will learn a bunch of useful things, largely around rigor of thought, how to learn, how to work with peer groups and just how much smarter than you many people are. Peter says those things don't matter, and in a way he's right; for the indomitable, driven hard-working, socially skilled, lucky entrepreneur, college is bullshit. Seriously, a total waste of working years. For the rest of us, there are benefits, especially at a top-tier school.
• wcummings 11y ago
  Doesn't hurt to apply, right?
• jpeg_hero 11y ago
  What every you do do not go back to college! Go work at Burger King, go into the woods and forage for nuts and berries.
  • traviswingo 11y ago
    Ha. I'm stoked for season 3 in a couple weeks.
• traviswingo 11y ago
  The Thiel fellowship is for individuals who have a clear idea what they want to do and how they are going to execute it. It's for those select few individuals who think school will only slow them down on their path to making a difference. If you're already second guessing if it's worth it or not, before you've even applied, you should take a step back and think about how important school really is to you and if you're the type of person who believes in themselves so much you'd think it a waste of time to sit in a classroom.
  • brian_cloutier 11y ago
    That is not true. I know multiple Thiel fellows who either don't have a definite goal or have wildly changed their goals since becoming a fellow. A bit of soul-searching seems to be encouraged. You also don't have to think college is a waste to think that being a Thiel fellow is better. You just have to think that a Thiel fellowship is better. That's not difficult, you're given some pretty incredible resources.
    • lostdog 11y ago
      How has it turned out for them?
• dfield 11y ago
  I cofounded Figma with the support of the Thiel Fellowship. It was definitely worth it to me, but dropping out of school is a very unique and personal decision. You should definitely apply and you should introspect deeply before taking it. BTW, some of the statements on this thread that "fellows are used as poster children for Thiel's vision of society" and equating taking the fellowship to becoming a "living cog in his anti-education political statement" are just downright false. I actually assumed going in that we would need to do press or something; after all, I've always heard "there's no free lunch." However, in reality I found the fellowship never pressured me to do media if it wasn't helpful for Figma. In fact, Figma was in stealth mode for the entire two year fellowship. There's literally no downside other than not attending school for two years. (And you can quit at any time to go back.) If anyone has specific questions about the fellowship, feel free to reply and I'll try to answer later today.
  • max_ 11y ago
    I am currently in my first year studying B.Architecture. But I want my lifes work(my core passion) to be around Software/Tech. I enrolled to Arch school simply because I thought it was cool and did not do Computer Science cause the syllabus here is kind of out dated (they lack, an Artificial Intelligence module, something i want to get deeply into)
    • elmin 11y ago
      The vast majority of what you learn in a CS program was published in the 50-70s. Just because it's a little outdated doesn't mean there isn't a lot to learn. Also, don't forget that you can always change schools, as hard as it might seem, it can be the right call.
      • sammydavis 11y ago
        One thing that modern CS programs should give you is more insight into the engineering and craftsmanship side of programming. Also, I think most of techniques we use to build distributed systems today were built way after the 90s. Think of the all the stuff google invented, plus other significant systems paxos, etc. In the 70s they were trying to build scalable relational databases, now we can build things that scale much more, and it's not just hardware, it is the techniques to handle them. All that stuff might not matter if you are most startups, because they don't need to build that huge shit usually, you can just use someone else's infrastructure.
• a_imho 11y ago
  Meta, the lack of https and the outdated copyright is a bit embarrassing imo.
• hackuser 11y ago
  Why not take advantage of college and all that you can learn there first? The chance won't come again to study the world ... not just IT but history, natural sciences, neuropsychology, literature ... and to do it surrounded by peers and with a faculty of experts to advise and teach you, and all those resources: Labs, libraries, etc. You can do startups later and will work for the rest of your life. Does the Thiel Fellowship really reject the same person if they happen to have a college degree? They must forgo college?
  • max_ 11y ago
    I want to build a company, my course is 5 years, am already 20 and the age limit for application is 22. in case i wait, I do not think i have another chance of getting 100K like that again.
    • shivpat 11y ago
      If your idea is truly good enough to build a company, you will.
    • hackuser 11y ago
      That's too bad about the age limit. You could change to a program that you can complete by the time you're 22, but I'm sure you've considered that. > I do not think i have another chance of getting 100K like that again. I certainly am in no position to make recommendations (nobody is), so I'll add some general observations: 1) You'll have other chances at $100K (if you're someone who has the skills to build companies). It's a good opportunity, but $100K investments aren't once-in-a-lifetime for a moderately successful entrepreneur. In fact, I would guess that the social capital, the network, is worth far more (and will yield far more investment than $100K). 2) Life will not work out at all like you plan. That doesn't at all mean that you shouldn't pursue goals and dreams, but I wouldn't be too rigid about any particular opportunity or outcome as the only option, do-or-die. Most startups fail; many others end up doing things their founders never expected. And life is much more than startups and work. Enjoy the ride. I hope whatever you choose turns out to be a fantastic experience.
• gravypod 11y ago
  Something that rung true with me was something one of my friends told me long ago. You go to college not to build your dreams, but to build someone else's. If you know what you want to do, and know how to do it there is no need for a college. If you want to go and work for someone else, you need a college education.
  • hackuser 11y ago
    There is so much more to college than learning vocational skills and a certification. Those skills are only a tiny part of it and self-development, especially of your intellect and knowledge, is most of it.
    • gravypod 11y ago
      I don't think that anyone would suggest that someone motivated could get by with building their own dreams without subjecting themselves to academic torture.
      • hackuser 11y ago
        > academic torture If you start with that premise, there's nothing left to discuss. But many find college worthwhile and the best years of their lives, personally and intellectually.
• jasonlaramburu 11y ago
  I have 3 friends who did it. Of that, 2 eventually went back and got their degrees. They also commented that their parents were a bit upset about the whole thing. It seems like the Thiel Fellowship doesn't have the same kind of formal, large investor network that a program like YC offers, which is important for success. You should apply to YC and Thiel and then make your decision once you get accepted to both!
• throwaway52353 11y ago
  What you get. - Incredible peer group - Access to the best professional network on the planet - Help to make things happen - Introductions to investors The price you pay. - Part of billionaire's PR effort. Personal consequences for mistakes that might lead to negative PR - Pressure on fund raising. Big raise == success
• redtycoon 11y ago
  you probably should apply soon, they take forever to respond :/