5 ms·

It doesn't seem out of line, but there's definitely a better way to handle this. As a senior member of the team, you need to swallow hard, take emotion and ego

by basseq 11y ago

It doesn't seem out of line, but there's definitely a better way to handle this. As a senior member of the team, you need to swallow hard, take emotion and ego out of the equation, and handle the situation in a positive way. While "snapping" isn't unreasonable, the better response is more level-headed. "I like the fact that you took initiative on something that needs doing. However, we have established ways of doing this. There may also be other things you should be doing with your time instead. If you don't, here, sit behind me and let's set it up together. And in the future, check with me before you jump into something like this." That's the balance. Firm. Corrective. Accretive. And at the end of the process, you now have a junior dev you can trust to set up servers "your way".

simula67 11y ago
> However, we have established ways of doing this Also you need to explain why this way is the established way.
mc32 11y ago
It's not necessary to always treat someone as a child. Nor should it be necessary to deconstruct everything. Quick to the point explanations. No need to dance and coddle. The junior dev has the right attitude (wanting to help) but if he thinks tweaking a server some else has set up is a way to help without having gotten some okay shows how green they are and have not yet attained necessary decision making skills. I like the enthusiasm but I don't like the lack of awareness.
- tamana 11y ago
  You're doing it again. You are using hyperbolic rude language, calling an adult a "child" -- that is being childish. And you are ignoring the reality that people all have different levels of knowledge and experience -- there is no binary flip between child and adult. People will extrapolate from their limited interactions with you, because communication is lossy. When you snap "don't touch that" they will obey "stay away from me as much as possible"
  - arm 11y ago
    Actually, I don’t think he was doing that (calling an adult a child). I believe when he said “it's not necessary to always treat someone as a child”, he was referring to this part of the parent comment: “"I like the fact that you took initiative on something that needs doing. However, we have established ways of doing this. There may also be other things you should be doing with your time instead. If you don't, here, sit behind me and let's set it up together. And in the future, check with me before you jump into something like this."” Frankly, that does seem like the sort of response a parent might give their child when they do something wrong.
    - purerandomness 11y ago
      > Frankly, that does seem like the sort of response a parent might give their child when they do something wrong. To me, it sounds like normal, human communication. I'm not surprised it's also used in parenting. I'd rather work in an environment where this style of communication is encouraged (as opposed to the response the author got) - wouldn't you?
      - mosdave 11y ago
        > I'd rather work in an environment where this style of communication is encouraged (as opposed to the response the author got) - wouldn't you? no.
  - knieveltech 11y ago
    Someone says "don't touch that" (with cause) and an individual goes on to parse that as "stay away from me until the end of time" then they brought some baggage into the conversation. It's more than questionable to expect others to be aware of said baggage much less expect them to be extra-super-careful to not tip over the emotional apple cart. Far enough down that continuum and you've arrived at emotional hostage-taking. Much simpler to parse what was said at face value and go on with your day.
    - basseq 10y ago
- basseq 10y ago
  > I like the enthusiasm but I don't like the lack of awareness. Why not communicate that? Otherwise you're shutting down everything, enthusiasm included. Some of this is style: my example response is pretty middle-of-the-road IMO. But there's a difference between a "quick to the point explanation" that helps the green dev develop necessary decision-making (and other) skills, and something that's the equivalent of "Hssss! My precious!"

by basseq 11y ago

simula67 11y ago

> However, we have established ways of doing this Also you need to explain why this way is the established way.

mc32 11y ago

It's not necessary to always treat someone as a child. Nor should it be necessary to deconstruct everything. Quick to the point explanations. No need to dance and coddle. The junior dev has the right attitude (wanting to help) but if he thinks tweaking a server some else has set up is a way to help without having gotten some okay shows how green they are and have not yet attained necessary decision making skills. I like the enthusiasm but I don't like the lack of awareness.

tamana 11y ago
You're doing it again. You are using hyperbolic rude language, calling an adult a "child" -- that is being childish. And you are ignoring the reality that people all have different levels of knowledge and experience -- there is no binary flip between child and adult. People will extrapolate from their limited interactions with you, because communication is lossy. When you snap "don't touch that" they will obey "stay away from me as much as possible"
- arm 11y ago
  Actually, I don’t think he was doing that (calling an adult a child). I believe when he said “it's not necessary to always treat someone as a child”, he was referring to this part of the parent comment: “"I like the fact that you took initiative on something that needs doing. However, we have established ways of doing this. There may also be other things you should be doing with your time instead. If you don't, here, sit behind me and let's set it up together. And in the future, check with me before you jump into something like this."” Frankly, that does seem like the sort of response a parent might give their child when they do something wrong.
  - purerandomness 11y ago
    > Frankly, that does seem like the sort of response a parent might give their child when they do something wrong. To me, it sounds like normal, human communication. I'm not surprised it's also used in parenting. I'd rather work in an environment where this style of communication is encouraged (as opposed to the response the author got) - wouldn't you?
    - mosdave 11y ago
      > I'd rather work in an environment where this style of communication is encouraged (as opposed to the response the author got) - wouldn't you? no.
- knieveltech 11y ago
  Someone says "don't touch that" (with cause) and an individual goes on to parse that as "stay away from me until the end of time" then they brought some baggage into the conversation. It's more than questionable to expect others to be aware of said baggage much less expect them to be extra-super-careful to not tip over the emotional apple cart. Far enough down that continuum and you've arrived at emotional hostage-taking. Much simpler to parse what was said at face value and go on with your day.
  - basseq 10y ago
basseq 10y ago
> I like the enthusiasm but I don't like the lack of awareness. Why not communicate that? Otherwise you're shutting down everything, enthusiasm included. Some of this is style: my example response is pretty middle-of-the-road IMO. But there's a difference between a "quick to the point explanation" that helps the green dev develop necessary decision-making (and other) skills, and something that's the equivalent of "Hssss! My precious!"