5 ms·

Debian 8.4 released

134 points by TimWolla 11y ago

corybrown 11y ago
I'm surprised that this is top of HN right now. It's a minor release with security updates already present on up to date machines. Can someone enlighten me?
- akerro 11y ago
  Finally something about Linux not MS or Google, Go or Node? Dunno.
- TimWolla 11y ago
  I submitted it, because I wondered why suddenly there were 67 updated packages available for my server. Other's might wonder as well.
  - vmp 11y ago
    Exactly, thanks. :)
- diskcat 11y ago
  Gotta make sure all the sysadmins know to update and it's more likely they are on HN than checking the update server every 2 minutes.
  - chrisper 11y ago
    Sysadmins hopefully use the mailinglist to stay up to date with announcements!
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - nanch 11y ago
      That doesn't really happen, seriously.
- riscy 11y ago
  For me it was a nice reminder to update my Debian server.
- bubuga 11y ago
  I upvoted the submission, mainly because Debian doesn't get the publicity and the recognition it deserves. Debian deserves a little love once in a while.
elipsey 11y ago
I don't get it either. Also, I see no new packages from the US ftp. Is it still April Fools Day?
- andyking 11y ago
  I've got a few new packages from the UK FTP site today, but if you've been keeping up to date generally there shouldn't be many updates. This update is mainly for install media, so people installing fresh don't have to download months of updates before configuring their system for the first time.
  - elipsey 11y ago
    your right, my version number just went up while i wasn't looking :) $ cat /etc/debian_version 8.4
kolom 11y ago
I saw this while the update command was running over ssh, coincidence?
- puzzlingcaptcha 11y ago
  In fact, no.
moon_of_moon 11y ago
First release since Ians passing? http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/30/ian_murdock_debian_founder/ http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/30/ian_murdock_debian_f... BTW does anyone have any color on what the heck happened that night?
- julie1 11y ago
  I tried to. Apparently he claimed to have been harassed by the police, but he also was said to be incoherent and violent in his behaviours. Bruce Perens unnicely -at my opinion that is not the most reliable in the world- disclosed his mental illness. 1 day after on his blog and /. The family also asked for discretion. A wish that has been followed by the majority of the community. Except people like me. Because, well, I wanted to understand. I tried to see for similar cases with google news what happened, and a non scientifically screening of hundreds of case in the USA would tend to suggests that if the victim is categorized mentally ill then news about police violence does not seems to make it higher than local news. I am just a little pea on the internet, I have no way to confirm my conclusions are right. It would require a true journalistic investigation to infirm of confirm the case. The conclusion I drew for myself having attended FOSS for 10 years as a topic organizer in conferences is the level of freaks tended to be higher than on average. Still not a scientific conclusion. I naively expected the community to be aware of that. My naive expectation is that the society would recognize the positive contribution of FOSS to the IT thus to the economy and thus would try to push harder on this case. Apparently I am naïve or delusive according to the feedback I had on this story. Well, I encourage people to make their own opinions and investigate with their own means. I am still a tad disappointed in my expectations.
  - jlgaddis 11y ago
    I guess you finally figured out you were hellbanned and created a new account?
    - julie1 11y ago
      Ah? I did not even knew about it. What is hellban? Is it what we called trollcaved in the old days? I was finding something was weired and coincidently used an old brower with one of my old credential in it. Just coincidence. I did not even cared.
justinmayer 11y ago
While we're on the topic of Debian, am I the only one who finds it odd that Debian Jessie is apparently never going to support HTTP/2? It seems an unfortunate decision was made at some point to skip OpenSSL 1.0.2: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=767661 https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=767661 Nowhere have I been able to find any information regarding plans to backport OpenSSL 1.0.2+ to Jessie. With Google turning off SPDY in Chrome next month, the lack of HTTP/2 support makes Debian a rather poor environment as a web server. I hope someone will point out that I'm wrong and that I've horribly misunderstood the current state of affairs. Otherwise, it seems like strong motivation to migrate our web applications to Ubuntu Xenial.
- Ambroos 11y ago
  Nope, it's accurate (and a shame). We've split up our SSL termination for this exact reason. Instead of doing SSL and HTTP/2 on our application servers themselves, we put a box with Debian Stretch in front of it doing just proxying and stapling on HTTP/2 + SSL. Since the box has just one very limited responsibility that's easy to test we can afford running unstable software at that point.
- lamby 11y ago
  > Debian Jessie is apparently never going to support HTTP/2? I suppose it depends on what you mean. The, say, nginx package in jessie itself won't get new features (by design) but the backports repositories -- which are now official -- have an nginx that supports HTTP/2. Am happily serving HTTP/2 from jessie right now :)
  - Ambroos 11y ago
    Unfortunately, since you don't have OpenSSL 1.0.2, you are only negotiating HTTP/2 over NPN, which Chrome will drop together with SPDY. To still get Chrome to negotiate HTTP/2 after the SPDY+NPN drop, you will need ALPN. Which is only supported in OpenSSL 1.0.2+.
simonebrunozzi 11y ago
Let's talk about Linux on laptops: am I the only one perennially debating between Debian and Ubuntu? I love Debian, but Ubuntu seems to have better support. What do you guys think?
- chx 11y ago
  This won't be the answer you are looking for but let's face some bitter truth: I have been running Linux on my laptops since 2004 and in my experience it's always a struggle (servers since 1993 are happy, it's the desktop that suffers). As of right now, this struggle no longer worths it. Just use Winux (my made up name for the Ubuntu userspace under Windows 10 plus perhaps Xming).
  - SwellJoe 11y ago
    I've been predominantly a Linux user on desktop/laptop since 1995. It has literally never been easier; to install, to use, to find hardware that works (even weird stuff like pro audio devices and oddball controllers), and to act like it's a "normal" computer without having to worry about drivers, kernels, X, etc. I have had at least as much trouble from my Windows partition and my Android phones as I have from my Linux (mostly Fedora and CentOS) systems. There really is no longer a credible case to be made that Linux is hard to use on the desktop. I even lend my older computers out to extremely non-technical friends (the kind who don't own a computer) without having to go into any significant detail about how to use Linux; they figure it out in a few minutes, mostly on their own. If you wanted to make that case even as recently as maybe five years ago, I wouldn't have argued. But, really...the Linux desktop experience today is excellent, certainly comparable to Windows or Mac OS X. And, with Steam providing a huge variety of Linux games, I haven't rebooted into Windows in almost a year (I used to reboot for video projection work, but am no longer involved in that business...I was on the verge of switching even that to Linux, and had I done any more of those jobs it would have been with Linux).
    - chx 11y ago
      > There really is no longer a credible case to be made that Linux is hard to use on the desktop. No, Linux desktop is as easy to use as Windows (sometimes perhaps easier), the problem is one layer lower: the drivers. 1. Bluetooth breaks about every 3-4 months. 2. Wifi. Where do I start. Say: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Wireless_network_configuration#iwlwifi https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Wireless_network_config... "If you have problems connecting to networks in general or your link quality is very poor, try to disable 802.11n" -- are you kidding me? Then if you have anything complicated, chances are you are completely and totally screwed. Examples: a) PPPoE over Wifi is simply not supported. b) The only way I found to connect to my work VPN is via a Firefox-running-as-root (I kid you not -- and it wasn't me me who came up with this solution obviously). 3. Battery life. http://unix.stackexchange.com/a/119620/9452 http://unix.stackexchange.com/a/119620/9452 4. USB 3.0. Sure, NEC and Intel hosts are supported. Throw your card away if it's not NEC. 5. Hybrid graphics. On to the destkop: 1. Skype. Say what you want, Microsoft abandoned it and Skype is a huge part of communications these days, sorry. 2. Chrome and hardware acceleration.

134 points by TimWolla 11y ago

I'm surprised that this is top of HN right now. It's a minor release with security updates already present on up to date machines. Can someone enlighten me?

akerro 11y ago
Finally something about Linux not MS or Google, Go or Node? Dunno.
TimWolla 11y ago
I submitted it, because I wondered why suddenly there were 67 updated packages available for my server. Other's might wonder as well.
- vmp 11y ago
  Exactly, thanks. :)
diskcat 11y ago
Gotta make sure all the sysadmins know to update and it's more likely they are on HN than checking the update server every 2 minutes.
- chrisper 11y ago
  Sysadmins hopefully use the mailinglist to stay up to date with announcements!
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - nanch 11y ago
    That doesn't really happen, seriously.
riscy 11y ago
For me it was a nice reminder to update my Debian server.
bubuga 11y ago
I upvoted the submission, mainly because Debian doesn't get the publicity and the recognition it deserves. Debian deserves a little love once in a while.

elipsey 11y ago

I don't get it either. Also, I see no new packages from the US ftp. Is it still April Fools Day?

andyking 11y ago
I've got a few new packages from the UK FTP site today, but if you've been keeping up to date generally there shouldn't be many updates. This update is mainly for install media, so people installing fresh don't have to download months of updates before configuring their system for the first time.
- elipsey 11y ago
  your right, my version number just went up while i wasn't looking :) $ cat /etc/debian_version 8.4

kolom 11y ago

I saw this while the update command was running over ssh, coincidence?

puzzlingcaptcha 11y ago
In fact, no.

moon_of_moon 11y ago

First release since Ians passing? http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/30/ian_murdock_debian_founder/ http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/30/ian_murdock_debian_f... BTW does anyone have any color on what the heck happened that night?

julie1 11y ago
I tried to. Apparently he claimed to have been harassed by the police, but he also was said to be incoherent and violent in his behaviours. Bruce Perens unnicely -at my opinion that is not the most reliable in the world- disclosed his mental illness. 1 day after on his blog and /. The family also asked for discretion. A wish that has been followed by the majority of the community. Except people like me. Because, well, I wanted to understand. I tried to see for similar cases with google news what happened, and a non scientifically screening of hundreds of case in the USA would tend to suggests that if the victim is categorized mentally ill then news about police violence does not seems to make it higher than local news. I am just a little pea on the internet, I have no way to confirm my conclusions are right. It would require a true journalistic investigation to infirm of confirm the case. The conclusion I drew for myself having attended FOSS for 10 years as a topic organizer in conferences is the level of freaks tended to be higher than on average. Still not a scientific conclusion. I naively expected the community to be aware of that. My naive expectation is that the society would recognize the positive contribution of FOSS to the IT thus to the economy and thus would try to push harder on this case. Apparently I am naïve or delusive according to the feedback I had on this story. Well, I encourage people to make their own opinions and investigate with their own means. I am still a tad disappointed in my expectations.
- jlgaddis 11y ago
  I guess you finally figured out you were hellbanned and created a new account?
  - julie1 11y ago
    Ah? I did not even knew about it. What is hellban? Is it what we called trollcaved in the old days? I was finding something was weired and coincidently used an old brower with one of my old credential in it. Just coincidence. I did not even cared.

justinmayer 11y ago

While we're on the topic of Debian, am I the only one who finds it odd that Debian Jessie is apparently never going to support HTTP/2? It seems an unfortunate decision was made at some point to skip OpenSSL 1.0.2: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=767661 https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=767661 Nowhere have I been able to find any information regarding plans to backport OpenSSL 1.0.2+ to Jessie. With Google turning off SPDY in Chrome next month, the lack of HTTP/2 support makes Debian a rather poor environment as a web server. I hope someone will point out that I'm wrong and that I've horribly misunderstood the current state of affairs. Otherwise, it seems like strong motivation to migrate our web applications to Ubuntu Xenial.

Ambroos 11y ago
Nope, it's accurate (and a shame). We've split up our SSL termination for this exact reason. Instead of doing SSL and HTTP/2 on our application servers themselves, we put a box with Debian Stretch in front of it doing just proxying and stapling on HTTP/2 + SSL. Since the box has just one very limited responsibility that's easy to test we can afford running unstable software at that point.
lamby 11y ago
> Debian Jessie is apparently never going to support HTTP/2? I suppose it depends on what you mean. The, say, nginx package in jessie itself won't get new features (by design) but the backports repositories -- which are now official -- have an nginx that supports HTTP/2. Am happily serving HTTP/2 from jessie right now :)
- Ambroos 11y ago
  Unfortunately, since you don't have OpenSSL 1.0.2, you are only negotiating HTTP/2 over NPN, which Chrome will drop together with SPDY. To still get Chrome to negotiate HTTP/2 after the SPDY+NPN drop, you will need ALPN. Which is only supported in OpenSSL 1.0.2+.

simonebrunozzi 11y ago

Let's talk about Linux on laptops: am I the only one perennially debating between Debian and Ubuntu? I love Debian, but Ubuntu seems to have better support. What do you guys think?

chx 11y ago
This won't be the answer you are looking for but let's face some bitter truth: I have been running Linux on my laptops since 2004 and in my experience it's always a struggle (servers since 1993 are happy, it's the desktop that suffers). As of right now, this struggle no longer worths it. Just use Winux (my made up name for the Ubuntu userspace under Windows 10 plus perhaps Xming).
- SwellJoe 11y ago
  I've been predominantly a Linux user on desktop/laptop since 1995. It has literally never been easier; to install, to use, to find hardware that works (even weird stuff like pro audio devices and oddball controllers), and to act like it's a "normal" computer without having to worry about drivers, kernels, X, etc. I have had at least as much trouble from my Windows partition and my Android phones as I have from my Linux (mostly Fedora and CentOS) systems. There really is no longer a credible case to be made that Linux is hard to use on the desktop. I even lend my older computers out to extremely non-technical friends (the kind who don't own a computer) without having to go into any significant detail about how to use Linux; they figure it out in a few minutes, mostly on their own. If you wanted to make that case even as recently as maybe five years ago, I wouldn't have argued. But, really...the Linux desktop experience today is excellent, certainly comparable to Windows or Mac OS X. And, with Steam providing a huge variety of Linux games, I haven't rebooted into Windows in almost a year (I used to reboot for video projection work, but am no longer involved in that business...I was on the verge of switching even that to Linux, and had I done any more of those jobs it would have been with Linux).
  - chx 11y ago
    > There really is no longer a credible case to be made that Linux is hard to use on the desktop. No, Linux desktop is as easy to use as Windows (sometimes perhaps easier), the problem is one layer lower: the drivers. 1. Bluetooth breaks about every 3-4 months. 2. Wifi. Where do I start. Say: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Wireless_network_configuration#iwlwifi https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Wireless_network_config... "If you have problems connecting to networks in general or your link quality is very poor, try to disable 802.11n" -- are you kidding me? Then if you have anything complicated, chances are you are completely and totally screwed. Examples: a) PPPoE over Wifi is simply not supported. b) The only way I found to connect to my work VPN is via a Firefox-running-as-root (I kid you not -- and it wasn't me me who came up with this solution obviously). 3. Battery life. http://unix.stackexchange.com/a/119620/9452 http://unix.stackexchange.com/a/119620/9452 4. USB 3.0. Sure, NEC and Intel hosts are supported. Throw your card away if it's not NEC. 5. Hybrid graphics. On to the destkop: 1. Skype. Say what you want, Microsoft abandoned it and Skype is a huge part of communications these days, sorry. 2. Chrome and hardware acceleration.