2 ms·

"Instead of asking for race/ethnicity, just say that the shirts are available in fit variations A, B, C, etc., and show photos of several models of all races ea

"Instead of asking for race/ethnicity, just say that the shirts are available in fit variations A, B, C, etc., and show photos of several models of all races each modeling the variation that fits that model best." That assumes people will accurately self-assess and honestly report their body types. And...you'd be very surprised at how few people can do that. In fact, "vanity sizing" is quite common in the fashion business. This is a term meaning a label that says one size, often smaller than the actual measurements of the garment, in order to make the buyer feel better about him/herself. (For instance, ever buy a pair of jeans in size 34? Chances are they're really a 36. The clothing company figures you'd refuse to admit to yourself that you're actually a 36. So it plays to your vanity, rather than risking your business by telling you something you don't want to hear.) On the whole, your idea seems better than "race" or "ethnicity" as category. But the weird benefit of "race" or "ethnicity" is that it doesn't force the buyer to take a conscious self-assessment of his body type. Perhaps another way to go about this would be to ask a series of questions. "Do you ever have the following problems buying shirts off the rack? [Problem 1,Problem 2,Problem 3,...,Problem N]." These would come with visualizations. Example: "The sleeves are usually too short."

tzs 11y ago
> That assumes people will accurately self-assess and honestly report their body types. And...you'd be very surprised at how few people can do that. I don't think that matters in this case. Even if I am way off in my self-assessed body type, and so look for a ripped Hercules of a model when deciding which fit variation to order instead of the Homer Simpson model that I should be looking for...I'm likely to pick a ripped Hercules that matches my race. So, if the fit variation options are just for choosing the value of that parameter that the race question currently answers, it should work the same for most people.
braythwayt 11y ago
I worked in men’s clothing for quite a while, and I have an anecdote to report about customers self-assessing their size and cut. If you sell people what they ask for, they will hate you for it. In my day, off-the-rack shirts came in a collar size, an arm length, and there were three cuts: tailored or “european,” standard, and “full,” for the pear-shaped gentleman. People sized themselves at least an inch too small on the collar, and would woefully under-report their arm length too. The problem, of course, was that as you gain weight, your neck grows in girth and you need a larger collar. What about the arm length? Well, that’s measured from the nape of the neck to the wrist. As you gain weight, you gain fat and/or muscle around your shoulders and upper arm, and that can increase the measured length of the arm, even though your skeleton remains the same. Customers would ask for a shirt in the size they wanted their neck to be, and if you sold it to them, they’s squeeze into it, there’s be an unsightly bulge, and they would decide that your shirts were unflattering. One of the tricks in those days was to report that a particular shirt’s measurement was more accurate in metric, so if the customer didn’t mind, could I take a metric measurement... And I would sell them the correctly sized shirt. Although it was larger than they requested, it would look better because it fit properly, and they would see a thinner, fitter person in the mirror. Needless to say, the exact same thing was true in the cut of the shirt. The endomorphs would ask for a standard, and the standards would ask for the tailored cut. And then they’d hate the shirt. The best thing was to report that this particular manufacturer was off on their sizing, and just hand them the short that you could eyeball was right for them. They’d be back for more. So where were we? Oh yes, you absolutely cannot rely on people self-selecting their body type. The best thing is to measure.
kelnos 11y ago
> That assumes people will accurately self-assess and honestly report their body types. And...you'd be very surprised at how few people can do that. Skerritt actually addresses this, though near the end of the article: "Respondents only need to answer the question to the best of their abilities. Because people tend to make the same mistakes, or tell the same lies, or have the same misconceptions about themselves — because none of us are as original as we like to think — they invariably produced similar responses, yielding the patterns necessary to fit your shirt." So it seems it doesn't matter. Even when people lie, they tend to all lie in the same ways, and you can still get a proper fit based on the patterns in the lies.

tzs 11y ago

> That assumes people will accurately self-assess and honestly report their body types. And...you'd be very surprised at how few people can do that. I don't think that matters in this case. Even if I am way off in my self-assessed body type, and so look for a ripped Hercules of a model when deciding which fit variation to order instead of the Homer Simpson model that I should be looking for...I'm likely to pick a ripped Hercules that matches my race. So, if the fit variation options are just for choosing the value of that parameter that the race question currently answers, it should work the same for most people.

braythwayt 11y ago

I worked in men’s clothing for quite a while, and I have an anecdote to report about customers self-assessing their size and cut. If you sell people what they ask for, they will hate you for it. In my day, off-the-rack shirts came in a collar size, an arm length, and there were three cuts: tailored or “european,” standard, and “full,” for the pear-shaped gentleman. People sized themselves at least an inch too small on the collar, and would woefully under-report their arm length too. The problem, of course, was that as you gain weight, your neck grows in girth and you need a larger collar. What about the arm length? Well, that’s measured from the nape of the neck to the wrist. As you gain weight, you gain fat and/or muscle around your shoulders and upper arm, and that can increase the measured length of the arm, even though your skeleton remains the same. Customers would ask for a shirt in the size they wanted their neck to be, and if you sold it to them, they’s squeeze into it, there’s be an unsightly bulge, and they would decide that your shirts were unflattering. One of the tricks in those days was to report that a particular shirt’s measurement was more accurate in metric, so if the customer didn’t mind, could I take a metric measurement... And I would sell them the correctly sized shirt. Although it was larger than they requested, it would look better because it fit properly, and they would see a thinner, fitter person in the mirror. Needless to say, the exact same thing was true in the cut of the shirt. The endomorphs would ask for a standard, and the standards would ask for the tailored cut. And then they’d hate the shirt. The best thing was to report that this particular manufacturer was off on their sizing, and just hand them the short that you could eyeball was right for them. They’d be back for more. So where were we? Oh yes, you absolutely cannot rely on people self-selecting their body type. The best thing is to measure.

kelnos 11y ago

> That assumes people will accurately self-assess and honestly report their body types. And...you'd be very surprised at how few people can do that. Skerritt actually addresses this, though near the end of the article: "Respondents only need to answer the question to the best of their abilities. Because people tend to make the same mistakes, or tell the same lies, or have the same misconceptions about themselves — because none of us are as original as we like to think — they invariably produced similar responses, yielding the patterns necessary to fit your shirt." So it seems it doesn't matter. Even when people lie, they tend to all lie in the same ways, and you can still get a proper fit based on the patterns in the lies.