5 ms·

Like Hurricane Katrina or Hurricane Sandy? Or the streets of Miami flooding? I don't think anything is going to change a denier's minds if they don't want to. W

by joeld42 11y ago

Like Hurricane Katrina or Hurricane Sandy? Or the streets of Miami flooding? I don't think anything is going to change a denier's minds if they don't want to. We just have to try and fix it without them.

pklausler 11y ago
s/without/despite/
wainstead 11y ago
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!" -- Upton Sinclair
- jballanc 11y ago
  The problem, of course, is that the salaries of most supporters of the Republican party would not be impacted at all by most measures that would be taken to curtail emissions. The salaries of the leaders (and, more importantly, their backers) on the other hand...
- refurb 11y ago
  You realize that cuts both ways, right?
mason240 11y ago
This is an unintentionally great comment. When people claim that every weather event is caused by global warming, it's hard to take it those claims seriously.
- joeld42 11y ago
  You're saying that those hurricanes would not have been any less severe without the impact of humans messing with the atmosphere for the last century? I'm not saying "global warming causes all the hurricanes", I'm saying "humans messing with the atmosphere has increased the variance and severity of our weather". If you don't agree with that, you're in willful denial. Anyways, thanks for recognizing that my comment was great. I'll take what I can get.
  - tsax 11y ago
    Just one question, have you looked at the frequency of extreme weather events over the last century? http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/hurdat/All_U.S._Hurricanes.html http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/hurdat/All_U.S._Hurricanes.html http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/Landsea/gw_hurricanes/fig33.jpg http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/Landsea/gw_hurricanes/fig33.jpg
    - exclusiv 11y ago
      Do we really think a century of data is a lot? Especially when you are talking about ~20 events per year? Can you explain why 1850 looks comparable or worse than the 1990s and worse than 2010s so far? I don't see what this proves. The inputs for "man's impact" in the 1850s would not come close to modern day. If we took that into account, by your logic, the bar charts should explode out the top! But it doesn't. Not even close. 1850 - 1.2B people 2010s - ~7B people and a lot more pollution From your linked data, the impact of AGW on hurricanes over the last year = 0 Edit: I think you may agree with me that it doesn't point to more extreme weather events. If so - my comment is directed at the parent.
      - tsax 11y ago
        Yes to your 'EDIT'. If we can't even see increasing frequency of hurricanes, then how can we even begin to attribute things to AGW?
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
  - gone35 11y ago
    I'm saying "humans messing with the atmosphere has increased the variance and severity of our weather. You should know that's a somewhat dated view. The scientific consensus is now much less certain about the link. See e.g. [1, p.7]. [1] http://www.climatechange2013.org/images/report/WG1AR5_SPM_FINAL.pdf http://www.climatechange2013.org/images/report/WG1AR5_SPM_FI...
  - mason240 11y ago

by joeld42 11y ago

pklausler 11y ago

s/without/despite/

wainstead 11y ago

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!" -- Upton Sinclair

jballanc 11y ago
The problem, of course, is that the salaries of most supporters of the Republican party would not be impacted at all by most measures that would be taken to curtail emissions. The salaries of the leaders (and, more importantly, their backers) on the other hand...
refurb 11y ago
You realize that cuts both ways, right?

mason240 11y ago

This is an unintentionally great comment. When people claim that every weather event is caused by global warming, it's hard to take it those claims seriously.

joeld42 11y ago
You're saying that those hurricanes would not have been any less severe without the impact of humans messing with the atmosphere for the last century? I'm not saying "global warming causes all the hurricanes", I'm saying "humans messing with the atmosphere has increased the variance and severity of our weather". If you don't agree with that, you're in willful denial. Anyways, thanks for recognizing that my comment was great. I'll take what I can get.
- tsax 11y ago
  Just one question, have you looked at the frequency of extreme weather events over the last century? http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/hurdat/All_U.S._Hurricanes.html http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/hurdat/All_U.S._Hurricanes.html http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/Landsea/gw_hurricanes/fig33.jpg http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/Landsea/gw_hurricanes/fig33.jpg
  - exclusiv 11y ago
    Do we really think a century of data is a lot? Especially when you are talking about ~20 events per year? Can you explain why 1850 looks comparable or worse than the 1990s and worse than 2010s so far? I don't see what this proves. The inputs for "man's impact" in the 1850s would not come close to modern day. If we took that into account, by your logic, the bar charts should explode out the top! But it doesn't. Not even close. 1850 - 1.2B people 2010s - ~7B people and a lot more pollution From your linked data, the impact of AGW on hurricanes over the last year = 0 Edit: I think you may agree with me that it doesn't point to more extreme weather events. If so - my comment is directed at the parent.
    - tsax 11y ago
      Yes to your 'EDIT'. If we can't even see increasing frequency of hurricanes, then how can we even begin to attribute things to AGW?
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- gone35 11y ago
  I'm saying "humans messing with the atmosphere has increased the variance and severity of our weather. You should know that's a somewhat dated view. The scientific consensus is now much less certain about the link. See e.g. [1, p.7]. [1] http://www.climatechange2013.org/images/report/WG1AR5_SPM_FINAL.pdf http://www.climatechange2013.org/images/report/WG1AR5_SPM_FI...
- mason240 11y ago