3 ms·

I thought of using the term technical skill, but given Collin’s opinion on modern art I felt artistic was more appropriate - his views about modern art is more

I thought of using the term technical skill, but given Collin’s opinion on modern art I felt artistic was more appropriate - his views about modern art is more than a critic of a lack of technical skills. I do agree with you the distinction between art and craft is a very interesting topic :)

eternalban 11y ago
[My apologies for the late reply -- network issues] In my view painting ended as an Art† with Cubism. This was a glorious death [1] but the end nonetheless. The limits of this medium -- with the medium considered as an artistic protoplasm of a living civilization and culture -- were effectively probed. I'll admit I haven't read OP and Mr. Collin's views, but to be perfectly frank, the thinking artists also arrived at the same the end conclusion [2] and in case of Duchamp quite effectively pointed the realities of plastic arts in the coming era [3] but sadly the kids didn't quite get his Gallic humor. Note for example, that in his serious 'artistic' work [4] he was basically reduced to drawing diagrams. I was watching Burke's connections the other day and at the end of the first season's episode, he was riffing on how we -- the allegedly Sapiens Homo -- are no longer getting the penetrating look at our reality and the human condition from the artists, but rather engineers and scientists. I agree with this. A "school" of art is a pedagogical platform. What contribution does Mr. Collin think painting can make at this point? To point out the vacuity and surface deep modern Western culture? Already done. [5][6] (A fun aside: put these last two next to pics of the 'leadership' choices currently on menu for the American electorate ..) There remains the psychological aspects that medium can still contain/convey, but that is the personal realm. Plastic arts are, imo, quite an effective tool in self-analysis, but why on earth would I think that my psychological investigations belong in a public space or would serve any purpose other than (possible future ;) biographical matter? †: definitive &| prophetic expression of the human condition in context of a civilizational lens. [1]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e6/Georges_Braque,_1909-10,_La_guitare_%28Mandora,_La_Mandore%29,_oil_on_canvas,_71.1_x_55.9_cm,_Tate_Modern,_London.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e6/Georges_Braqu... | Georges Braque, 1909-10, La guitare [2]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/c/c0/20150719231100!Duchamp_-_Nude_Descending_a_Staircase.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/c/c0/20150... | Nude Descending A Staircase | M. Duchamp [3]: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c6/dd/23/c6dd23f8f1054c644134698b1ac0fe0e.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c6/dd/23/c6dd23f8f... | the entirely misunderstood "father of conceptual art". [4]: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/56/6f/4c/566f4cc40ecc01a526d17d6d7adf2cf1.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/56/6f/4c/566f4cc40... [5]: https://static-secure.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Film/Pix/pictures/2013/3/4/1362406527737/Roy-Lichtenstein-010.jpg https://static-secure.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Film/Pix/picture... | Roy Lichtenstein [6]: https://blogs.lt.vt.edu/emilyborg/files/2014/11/Warhol_3.jpg https://blogs.lt.vt.edu/emilyborg/files/2014/11/Warhol_3.jpg | Warhol [p.s. for clarity on notions]: Take Van Eyck's Arnolfini Portrait [a], "circa 1390–1441" and the beginnings of Protestant Reformation [b] circa same time frame. Hope the connection between the use of personal-point-of-view perspective, and Protestant assertion of the right of layman to read and interpret scripture is clear. This is Art. [a]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnolfini_Portrait#/media/File:Van_Eyck_-_Arnolfini_Portrait.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnolfini_Portrait#/media/File... [b]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Schism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Schism
- clock_tower 11y ago
  > What contribution does Mr. Collin think painting can make at this point? To point out the vacuity and surface deep modern Western culture? From the article: "Collins explains: 'My general feeling in terms of art making is the train got off the rails in the 1860s and 1870s, and my practical instinct is to go back to where it was, try to put it back, fix it up, and start going again.' "'Our culture,' he continued, 'has inherited the idea that if artists are not avant-garde they cannot have a significant role. That’s a fallacy we’ve inherited from some Parisian nut-job radicals. The rejection of beauty is so accepted. It’s high time that we as a culture attend to our beauty position.'" I think it's fair to call this a pedagogical platform, and a novel contribution to the world of art in general.
- clock_tower 11y ago
  Thinking further, perhaps you could categorize this movement as an elaborate parody. "Old Master" style expressed a contentment with life as it currently existed, a sense of the beauty of things, and a sense of timelessness which aren't really present today; a painting of a bottle of Coke in the style of a bowl of fruit, or a stockbroker in a BMW in the style of a hunter on his horse, is both an impressive technical accomplishment and a very elaborate joke...

eternalban 11y ago

[My apologies for the late reply -- network issues] In my view painting ended as an Art† with Cubism. This was a glorious death [1] but the end nonetheless. The limits of this medium -- with the medium considered as an artistic protoplasm of a living civilization and culture -- were effectively probed. I'll admit I haven't read OP and Mr. Collin's views, but to be perfectly frank, the thinking artists also arrived at the same the end conclusion [2] and in case of Duchamp quite effectively pointed the realities of plastic arts in the coming era [3] but sadly the kids didn't quite get his Gallic humor. Note for example, that in his serious 'artistic' work [4] he was basically reduced to drawing diagrams. I was watching Burke's connections the other day and at the end of the first season's episode, he was riffing on how we -- the allegedly Sapiens Homo -- are no longer getting the penetrating look at our reality and the human condition from the artists, but rather engineers and scientists. I agree with this. A "school" of art is a pedagogical platform. What contribution does Mr. Collin think painting can make at this point? To point out the vacuity and surface deep modern Western culture? Already done. [5][6] (A fun aside: put these last two next to pics of the 'leadership' choices currently on menu for the American electorate ..) There remains the psychological aspects that medium can still contain/convey, but that is the personal realm. Plastic arts are, imo, quite an effective tool in self-analysis, but why on earth would I think that my psychological investigations belong in a public space or would serve any purpose other than (possible future ;) biographical matter? †: definitive &| prophetic expression of the human condition in context of a civilizational lens. [1]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e6/Georges_Braque,_1909-10,_La_guitare_%28Mandora,_La_Mandore%29,_oil_on_canvas,_71.1_x_55.9_cm,_Tate_Modern,_London.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e6/Georges_Braqu... | Georges Braque, 1909-10, La guitare [2]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/c/c0/20150719231100!Duchamp_-_Nude_Descending_a_Staircase.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/c/c0/20150... | Nude Descending A Staircase | M. Duchamp [3]: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c6/dd/23/c6dd23f8f1054c644134698b1ac0fe0e.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c6/dd/23/c6dd23f8f... | the entirely misunderstood "father of conceptual art". [4]: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/56/6f/4c/566f4cc40ecc01a526d17d6d7adf2cf1.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/56/6f/4c/566f4cc40... [5]: https://static-secure.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Film/Pix/pictures/2013/3/4/1362406527737/Roy-Lichtenstein-010.jpg https://static-secure.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Film/Pix/picture... | Roy Lichtenstein [6]: https://blogs.lt.vt.edu/emilyborg/files/2014/11/Warhol_3.jpg https://blogs.lt.vt.edu/emilyborg/files/2014/11/Warhol_3.jpg | Warhol [p.s. for clarity on notions]: Take Van Eyck's Arnolfini Portrait [a], "circa 1390–1441" and the beginnings of Protestant Reformation [b] circa same time frame. Hope the connection between the use of personal-point-of-view perspective, and Protestant assertion of the right of layman to read and interpret scripture is clear. This is Art. [a]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnolfini_Portrait#/media/File:Van_Eyck_-_Arnolfini_Portrait.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnolfini_Portrait#/media/File... [b]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Schism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Schism

clock_tower 11y ago
> What contribution does Mr. Collin think painting can make at this point? To point out the vacuity and surface deep modern Western culture? From the article: "Collins explains: 'My general feeling in terms of art making is the train got off the rails in the 1860s and 1870s, and my practical instinct is to go back to where it was, try to put it back, fix it up, and start going again.' "'Our culture,' he continued, 'has inherited the idea that if artists are not avant-garde they cannot have a significant role. That’s a fallacy we’ve inherited from some Parisian nut-job radicals. The rejection of beauty is so accepted. It’s high time that we as a culture attend to our beauty position.'" I think it's fair to call this a pedagogical platform, and a novel contribution to the world of art in general.
clock_tower 11y ago
Thinking further, perhaps you could categorize this movement as an elaborate parody. "Old Master" style expressed a contentment with life as it currently existed, a sense of the beauty of things, and a sense of timelessness which aren't really present today; a painting of a bottle of Coke in the style of a bowl of fruit, or a stockbroker in a BMW in the style of a hunter on his horse, is both an impressive technical accomplishment and a very elaborate joke...