5 ms·

I don't get why people want osx to die and ios to run on mac. They are already pretty much the same OS. Open up the OSX UIKit port should be enough to solve tha

by 0x0 11y ago

I don't get why people want osx to die and ios to run on mac. They are already pretty much the same OS. Open up the OSX UIKit port should be enough to solve that "problem". Also, removing the file system tree would be a huge step backwards. Organizing hundreds or thousands of files between dozens to hundreds of projects is just not suited for a "everything in one searchable bag" for a few reasons: To find something with search, you have to already know what you're looking for - something that browsing a folder solves instantly (how can you know you see all relevant files with a search? Maybe there's an important file that didn't match your query?!) - and the common "solution" with tagging/labels are just single-level folders in disguise.... I'm glad Apple decided to not port OSX to the iPad, or replace OSX with an iPad-esque iOS. Most people I've talked to that experienced windows 8 would agree that when Microsoft did just that, it was a misstep.

blackhaz 11y ago
If they remove the file system tree I'll switch to another OS for sure. That's my red line.
- rgacote 11y ago
  I'm a developer so I live and breath the file system tree. On the other hand, don't forget that the original Mac did not have a file system tree. Rather, it had a bunch of linked objects through which you could navigate. (It also had flags for file revision numbers which was never implemented.)
  - kabdib 11y ago
    HFS followed not soon after the original Mac, though. Losing a filesystem hierarchy is loony toons. I can't even
- pbreit 11y ago
  I suspect it is easily hidden for the masses yet easily available for the few.
gardano 11y ago
An article I read way back in the early days of the internet said people were in one of two categories: Searchers and Navigators -- that is, people who were more comfortable getting what they want by searching, and people who were more comfortable getting what they want by navigating a hierarchy. That really struck me, because I'm of the latter type, and it makes me somewhat uncomfortable to have a search paradigm thrust upon me.
- quicklyfrozen 11y ago
  I don't mind searching to find what I want, but I find myself uncomfortable if I can't then see where it "really" is. In a universe with just tags/labels, it doesn't feel like it's anywhere.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - gardano 11y ago
    You hit the nail on the head for me. Exactly how I feel.
  - lotyrin 11y ago
    In case you hadn't considered the alternative position, I get nervous deciding where something should "Really" be when that's based on a number of things, e.g. there's a multitude of hierarchies I could pick when organizing a music collection, and none is inherently correct over the others. Some things defy a hierarchical structure entirely. (I hate having a "Various Artists" folder, and those albums not being visible under each artist. I have considered symlinks, but too often software treats these as multiple copies.) I can avoid that by having my files in a content-based-addressing pool with metainformation.
    - graeme 11y ago
      How many files do you have? And how many projects? I'm not organized by nature, but I need some kind of hierarchy for my computer files. There's too much.
alexkavon 11y ago
> Most people I've talked to that experienced windows 8 would agree that when Microsoft did just that, it was a misstep. Actually Windows 8 can't be a misstep because it led to UI optimization for Windows 10. Windows 8 was just a drastic change for sure, but once you understood it's concepts it was really well suited for beginners and power users alike. The only misstep I can think of with Windows 8 is calling the Start Menu a Start Screen. That made it seem entirely different, when it wasn't.
- 0x0 11y ago
  That's your opinion :) Many I've talked to are not happy even after getting windows 10 and using it for months.
  - justinclift 11y ago
    Definitely a mis-step. The "touch focused" menu interface is literally of no interest to me.
Keyframe 11y ago
I must be the only one that likes Windows 8. Even that launchpad-like start menu.
- wodenokoto 11y ago
  If windows 8 treated the desktop as the most basic place a user could go in the US and treated metro apps as full-screen versions of desktop apps I think it would have been a brilliant OS.
calebgilbert 11y ago
I'll just reply to this comment since, I basically want to echo the same things. One sure way to get me interested in a Linux variant would be to iOS'ify the Mac Desktop. I can think of few things less interesting or desired from my Mac experience. Overall, what a disappointing set of ideas put forth by this article...
kough 11y ago
> Also, removing the file system tree would be a huge step backwards. Absolutely agree. I also fully believe natural text search is the future for computer interfaces. But what this article ignores is that you can easily have both. I use Spotlight to instantly full-text search over all of my files, applications, and their metadata to launch / open / access my data, but I also keep a standard directory structure instead of keeping all my files in one place. I've started thinking of the directory tree as a hierarchical tagging system, and when I'm trying to find a file for which I can't remember the right search terms it's incredibly useful. No need to throw out the baby with the bathwater; multiple views / interfaces to the same data is very useful. I suspect Apple was thinking along the same terms when they introduced the "All My Files" shortcut in the Finder. But I'm sure they realized that the majority of their customers (who are barely able to use their computers; more or less computer illiterate) are just not ready to move beyond the "Desktop" / "Filing Cabinet" metaphor. Actually, I've been thinking about this a lot recently, and I just started using the OS X universal Help menu feature [0] to take actions in complicated applications like Photoshop. Full-text search over all possible menu commands in any application? Yes, please. I really miss being able to do this when I'm in my Debian or Windows environments. [0]: described here http://lifehacker.com/5592856/use-os-xs-application-help-menu-as-a-keyboard-friendly-action-launcher http://lifehacker.com/5592856/use-os-xs-application-help-men...
Razengan 11y ago
> and the common "solution" with tagging/labels are just single-level folders in disguise.... Tags are best when used to complement the hierarchical-folder-based system; as an extra layer of organization, not as a replacement. Tags effectively let you keep a single file in multiple "folders", because the reason you're looking for a particular file is not always the same. For example, my girlfriend is a concept artist and we're both fans of anime, so we trade a lot of reference and "reaction" images back and forth. Without tags, we'd be limited to keeping each file in a single folder, usually the name of the series OR a single character, but we're often looking for images depicting specific emotions, such as "Happy", "Shocked" and so on, and most images usually have multiple characters. With tags I can just save the image under the folder for a particular show, and just tag it with the characters' names and emotions. Keeps everything tidy for the OCD in me and makes searching for anything a snap as well. :)

by 0x0 11y ago

blackhaz 11y ago

If they remove the file system tree I'll switch to another OS for sure. That's my red line.

rgacote 11y ago
I'm a developer so I live and breath the file system tree. On the other hand, don't forget that the original Mac did not have a file system tree. Rather, it had a bunch of linked objects through which you could navigate. (It also had flags for file revision numbers which was never implemented.)
- kabdib 11y ago
  HFS followed not soon after the original Mac, though. Losing a filesystem hierarchy is loony toons. I can't even
pbreit 11y ago
I suspect it is easily hidden for the masses yet easily available for the few.

gardano 11y ago

An article I read way back in the early days of the internet said people were in one of two categories: Searchers and Navigators -- that is, people who were more comfortable getting what they want by searching, and people who were more comfortable getting what they want by navigating a hierarchy. That really struck me, because I'm of the latter type, and it makes me somewhat uncomfortable to have a search paradigm thrust upon me.

quicklyfrozen 11y ago
I don't mind searching to find what I want, but I find myself uncomfortable if I can't then see where it "really" is. In a universe with just tags/labels, it doesn't feel like it's anywhere.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- gardano 11y ago
  You hit the nail on the head for me. Exactly how I feel.
- lotyrin 11y ago
  In case you hadn't considered the alternative position, I get nervous deciding where something should "Really" be when that's based on a number of things, e.g. there's a multitude of hierarchies I could pick when organizing a music collection, and none is inherently correct over the others. Some things defy a hierarchical structure entirely. (I hate having a "Various Artists" folder, and those albums not being visible under each artist. I have considered symlinks, but too often software treats these as multiple copies.) I can avoid that by having my files in a content-based-addressing pool with metainformation.
  - graeme 11y ago
    How many files do you have? And how many projects? I'm not organized by nature, but I need some kind of hierarchy for my computer files. There's too much.

alexkavon 11y ago

> Most people I've talked to that experienced windows 8 would agree that when Microsoft did just that, it was a misstep. Actually Windows 8 can't be a misstep because it led to UI optimization for Windows 10. Windows 8 was just a drastic change for sure, but once you understood it's concepts it was really well suited for beginners and power users alike. The only misstep I can think of with Windows 8 is calling the Start Menu a Start Screen. That made it seem entirely different, when it wasn't.

0x0 11y ago
That's your opinion :) Many I've talked to are not happy even after getting windows 10 and using it for months.
- justinclift 11y ago
  Definitely a mis-step. The "touch focused" menu interface is literally of no interest to me.

Keyframe 11y ago

I must be the only one that likes Windows 8. Even that launchpad-like start menu.

wodenokoto 11y ago
If windows 8 treated the desktop as the most basic place a user could go in the US and treated metro apps as full-screen versions of desktop apps I think it would have been a brilliant OS.

calebgilbert 11y ago

I'll just reply to this comment since, I basically want to echo the same things. One sure way to get me interested in a Linux variant would be to iOS'ify the Mac Desktop. I can think of few things less interesting or desired from my Mac experience. Overall, what a disappointing set of ideas put forth by this article...

kough 11y ago

> Also, removing the file system tree would be a huge step backwards. Absolutely agree. I also fully believe natural text search is the future for computer interfaces. But what this article ignores is that you can easily have both. I use Spotlight to instantly full-text search over all of my files, applications, and their metadata to launch / open / access my data, but I also keep a standard directory structure instead of keeping all my files in one place. I've started thinking of the directory tree as a hierarchical tagging system, and when I'm trying to find a file for which I can't remember the right search terms it's incredibly useful. No need to throw out the baby with the bathwater; multiple views / interfaces to the same data is very useful. I suspect Apple was thinking along the same terms when they introduced the "All My Files" shortcut in the Finder. But I'm sure they realized that the majority of their customers (who are barely able to use their computers; more or less computer illiterate) are just not ready to move beyond the "Desktop" / "Filing Cabinet" metaphor. Actually, I've been thinking about this a lot recently, and I just started using the OS X universal Help menu feature [0] to take actions in complicated applications like Photoshop. Full-text search over all possible menu commands in any application? Yes, please. I really miss being able to do this when I'm in my Debian or Windows environments. [0]: described here http://lifehacker.com/5592856/use-os-xs-application-help-menu-as-a-keyboard-friendly-action-launcher http://lifehacker.com/5592856/use-os-xs-application-help-men...

Razengan 11y ago

> and the common "solution" with tagging/labels are just single-level folders in disguise.... Tags are best when used to complement the hierarchical-folder-based system; as an extra layer of organization, not as a replacement. Tags effectively let you keep a single file in multiple "folders", because the reason you're looking for a particular file is not always the same. For example, my girlfriend is a concept artist and we're both fans of anime, so we trade a lot of reference and "reaction" images back and forth. Without tags, we'd be limited to keeping each file in a single folder, usually the name of the series OR a single character, but we're often looking for images depicting specific emotions, such as "Happy", "Shocked" and so on, and most images usually have multiple characters. With tags I can just save the image under the folder for a particular show, and just tag it with the characters' names and emotions. Keeps everything tidy for the OCD in me and makes searching for anything a snap as well. :)