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I don't understand why our society thinks its ok to treat people this way just because they've been convicted of a crime. Being removed from society and put in

by joesmo 11y ago

I don't understand why our society thinks its ok to treat people this way just because they've been convicted of a crime. Being removed from society and put in jail IS the punishment. Why does society suddenly see these people as no longer human, trash that can be dealt with any way, packed like sardines, left helpless to be raped and murdered? Yes, some of these people have done unspeakable things, but they are being punished already. Does society itself need to continue to do unspeakable things to those convicted? Honestly, I thought we were beyond that, but I guess not. Is it any wonder that we accept torture of foreigners now when we've always accepted torture of citizens?

llamataboot 11y ago
I agree with this, but arguably jail itself is an unreasonable punishment for many/most crimes, especially under the guise of rehabilitation, which it absolutely isn't designed for. Many countries have figured out how to balance public safety, restitution/punishment, and rehabilitation in ways that are empirically more effective on all fronts than the US good-ole-boy culture of "lock em up and let God sort em out". The Scandinavian countries especially come to mind.
- joesmo 11y ago
  Of course. Putting non-violent offenders in jail doesn't even make sense when you have options like house arrest, especially jailing them before trial. I agree though, the US has an extremely cruel culture that's always, since before its creation, been based on oppression and enslavement, and it really shows up in the way it treats its citizens and others throughout the world.
neffy 11y ago
Society doesn't think like that. What US society thought, was that everything should be determined by free markets. This is what happens when you put the prison service out to the lowest bidder. And lets not even get into the part where the private companies running the prisons now have a vested interest in hiring lobbyists to provoke tougher sentencing. But perhaps it would be easier simply to stop at Society doesn't think.
- briandear 11y ago
  Have you been in La Sante prison in France? How about any Central, South American or Asian prisons? This has nothing to do with prison privatization and it's clear many don't have a clue of the conditions outside of a few newsworthy European prisons. Talk to a US consular officer who's been at the job more than five minutes, then we can make some comparisons. Blaming privatization is a red herring.. Venenzuela prisons aren't a place I even want to spend five minutes as a visitor.
  - neffy 11y ago
    By all accounts the (state run) Russian Gulags weren't much fun either. But do you really want to compare your country with the third world, or the first?
ljf 11y ago
Way I heard it described before is that in Europe we put people in jail AS punishment, in the US you put people in jail FOR punishment...

by joesmo 11y ago

llamataboot 11y ago

I agree with this, but arguably jail itself is an unreasonable punishment for many/most crimes, especially under the guise of rehabilitation, which it absolutely isn't designed for. Many countries have figured out how to balance public safety, restitution/punishment, and rehabilitation in ways that are empirically more effective on all fronts than the US good-ole-boy culture of "lock em up and let God sort em out". The Scandinavian countries especially come to mind.

joesmo 11y ago
Of course. Putting non-violent offenders in jail doesn't even make sense when you have options like house arrest, especially jailing them before trial. I agree though, the US has an extremely cruel culture that's always, since before its creation, been based on oppression and enslavement, and it really shows up in the way it treats its citizens and others throughout the world.

neffy 11y ago

Society doesn't think like that. What US society thought, was that everything should be determined by free markets. This is what happens when you put the prison service out to the lowest bidder. And lets not even get into the part where the private companies running the prisons now have a vested interest in hiring lobbyists to provoke tougher sentencing. But perhaps it would be easier simply to stop at Society doesn't think.

briandear 11y ago
Have you been in La Sante prison in France? How about any Central, South American or Asian prisons? This has nothing to do with prison privatization and it's clear many don't have a clue of the conditions outside of a few newsworthy European prisons. Talk to a US consular officer who's been at the job more than five minutes, then we can make some comparisons. Blaming privatization is a red herring.. Venenzuela prisons aren't a place I even want to spend five minutes as a visitor.
- neffy 11y ago
  By all accounts the (state run) Russian Gulags weren't much fun either. But do you really want to compare your country with the third world, or the first?

ljf 11y ago

Way I heard it described before is that in Europe we put people in jail AS punishment, in the US you put people in jail FOR punishment...