5 ms·

Amazingly shameful cheap shots and mudslinging against hundreds of people from both you and @na85. Bravo.

by petetnt 11y ago

stonogo 11y ago
Those people deserve criticism, because they're making bad decisions.
- sangnoir 11y ago
  and by 'Those people', you mean the entire NodeJS community? > This is the sort of amateur behaviour that is emblematic of the entire nodejs community. This is pure mudslinging
  - akerro 11y ago
    No, I'm sure he didn't meant whole community. There was a reason why njs became so popular, and there are great people behind it, but as everything that's easy to start with, it attracts people with no skills, no experience. When learning C one of the first things you learn is how operating systems work, what memory leaks are, why they are dangerous, C, C++ have higher entry level, people who stay longer with C/C++ have very good experience, they know more about security, risks, standards, systems... When you have low entry lever, you don't even bother reading on wiki what XSS is, what .ssh folder is. We just learnt the hard way that package manager for NJS is crap, just to compare it, take a look at crates of a language that has high entry level: https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/4bm3rk/how_would_cratesio_react_in_a_case_similar_to_the/ https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/4bm3rk/how_would_crat...
  - prodigal_erik 11y ago
    If any of thousands of strangers could push a button and prevent me from deploying to production, I have made several bad decisions. This seems to apply to the majority of NPM users.
    - sangnoir 11y ago
      > If any of thousands of strangers could push a button and prevent me from deploying to production, I have made several bad decisions. That's a strange thing to say considering how insanely complex modern hardware and software are. While the NPM setup is indefensible, there are countless ways a stranger can prevent your deployment, if that stranger works at Microsoft, Intel, or the manufacturer of any production hardware component. OS bugs, driver bugs, compiler bugs, and hardware/microprocessor bugs are a thing. At any point, you are dependent on the work of many thousands of strangers, no matter how perfect your decisions are.
      - prodigal_erik 11y ago
        A proper build is hermetic. Sure we have to deal with pre-existing bugs, but nobody outside our org can make intentional changes to our build today without our actively consenting to deploy their updates after first testing them.
xredlinexx1 11y ago
Npm is the most miserable tool I've ever used. I just spent the last 30 minutes waiting for Windows (robocopy) to delete the node_modules directory. It destroys days of development.
- joshuacc 11y ago
  This problem is largely solved in npm 3.
akerro 11y ago
And it's somehow one of my most upvoted answers on HN.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

Amazingly shameful cheap shots and mudslinging against hundreds of people from both you and @na85. Bravo.

by petetnt 11y ago

Amazingly shameful cheap shots and mudslinging against hundreds of people from both you and @na85. Bravo.

stonogo 11y ago

Those people deserve criticism, because they're making bad decisions.

sangnoir 11y ago
and by 'Those people', you mean the entire NodeJS community? > This is the sort of amateur behaviour that is emblematic of the entire nodejs community. This is pure mudslinging
- akerro 11y ago
  No, I'm sure he didn't meant whole community. There was a reason why njs became so popular, and there are great people behind it, but as everything that's easy to start with, it attracts people with no skills, no experience. When learning C one of the first things you learn is how operating systems work, what memory leaks are, why they are dangerous, C, C++ have higher entry level, people who stay longer with C/C++ have very good experience, they know more about security, risks, standards, systems... When you have low entry lever, you don't even bother reading on wiki what XSS is, what .ssh folder is. We just learnt the hard way that package manager for NJS is crap, just to compare it, take a look at crates of a language that has high entry level: https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/4bm3rk/how_would_cratesio_react_in_a_case_similar_to_the/ https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/4bm3rk/how_would_crat...
- prodigal_erik 11y ago
  If any of thousands of strangers could push a button and prevent me from deploying to production, I have made several bad decisions. This seems to apply to the majority of NPM users.
  - sangnoir 11y ago
    > If any of thousands of strangers could push a button and prevent me from deploying to production, I have made several bad decisions. That's a strange thing to say considering how insanely complex modern hardware and software are. While the NPM setup is indefensible, there are countless ways a stranger can prevent your deployment, if that stranger works at Microsoft, Intel, or the manufacturer of any production hardware component. OS bugs, driver bugs, compiler bugs, and hardware/microprocessor bugs are a thing. At any point, you are dependent on the work of many thousands of strangers, no matter how perfect your decisions are.
    - prodigal_erik 11y ago
      A proper build is hermetic. Sure we have to deal with pre-existing bugs, but nobody outside our org can make intentional changes to our build today without our actively consenting to deploy their updates after first testing them.

xredlinexx1 11y ago

Npm is the most miserable tool I've ever used. I just spent the last 30 minutes waiting for Windows (robocopy) to delete the node_modules directory. It destroys days of development.

joshuacc 11y ago
This problem is largely solved in npm 3.

akerro 11y ago

And it's somehow one of my most upvoted answers on HN.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]