4 ms·

If they're born in the country and lived there their whole life, they're local by any non-racist definition.

pjc50 11y ago
Do they think of themselves as local?
jbmorgado 11y ago
Even when they don't speak the local language like it sometimes happens? Truth is, you can be so enclosed in a foreign culture that you will actually stay a foreigner trough all your life. P.S.: I'm not saying that was the case here, I'm just answering your broader remark.
mistermann 11y ago
That's rather disingenuous. They are second generation immigrants of a particular religion that seems to be coincidentally associated time after time in these incidents.
- ascorbic 11y ago
  Second generation immigrants don't mean this a problem with immigration. Lots of people like to link this to the current Syrian refugee crisis, but none of them are refugees. If you want to make it about immigration, make it about immigration from France's former colonies in the 1960s and 70s.
  - mistermann 11y ago
    > Second generation immigrants don't mean this a problem with immigration And that they're not first generation immigrants doesn't prove it isn't a problem with immigration either. We are still left with this recurring coincidence aren't we. I don't claim to know the absolute truth here, I'm just suggesting we honestly acknowledge reality during discussions.
    - ascorbic 11y ago
      It's not first generation immigrants or refugees doing this. It's not Syrians doing this. By what possible rationale could you say that recent immigration has anything to do with this, other than that they're Muslim?
      - mistermann 11y ago
        > By what possible rationale could you say that recent immigration has anything to do with this I didn't say it was recent immigration that caused this incident, we both know that (if they are 2nd generation, it couldn't be recent). > other than that they're Muslim You think that their religion has absolutely nothing to do with this? I mean, even unjust prejudice within their host country because of their religion could easily cause social isolation and economic disadvantage leading to anger - that seems like a perfectly reasonable explanation to me and largely places the ultimate blame on the host country.
        ascorbic 11y ago
        The original comment specified recent immigration. What gave you the impression I thought religion had nothing to do with this? Of course it does. I was talking about immigration though, and the fact they're both Muslim doesn't mean that these incidents have any connection to recent refugees from Syria, aside from the fact that the Syrians are running from these kind of people.
        ptaipale 11y ago
        Actually, two of the nine Paris attackers were (probably) from Syria and had come as refugees, as they were registered with fingerprints in Greece. A few of the others were French and were known to be in Syria, but how they came back to EU is apparently not known (could be with help from people smugglers, avoiding any registration at borders, because some of them were on wanted lists).
        ascorbic 11y ago
tobltobs 11y ago
Even if they hate the society they live in, even if they do not accept the laws, even if they do not contribute anything but demand a lot, even if they do not speak the language, even if they raise their kids to become the same religious fags, even if they support people attacking the country where they are "locals"?

pjc50 11y ago

Do they think of themselves as local?

Even when they don't speak the local language like it sometimes happens? Truth is, you can be so enclosed in a foreign culture that you will actually stay a foreigner trough all your life. P.S.: I'm not saying that was the case here, I'm just answering your broader remark.

mistermann 11y ago

That's rather disingenuous. They are second generation immigrants of a particular religion that seems to be coincidentally associated time after time in these incidents.

ascorbic 11y ago
Second generation immigrants don't mean this a problem with immigration. Lots of people like to link this to the current Syrian refugee crisis, but none of them are refugees. If you want to make it about immigration, make it about immigration from France's former colonies in the 1960s and 70s.
- mistermann 11y ago
  > Second generation immigrants don't mean this a problem with immigration And that they're not first generation immigrants doesn't prove it isn't a problem with immigration either. We are still left with this recurring coincidence aren't we. I don't claim to know the absolute truth here, I'm just suggesting we honestly acknowledge reality during discussions.
  - ascorbic 11y ago
    It's not first generation immigrants or refugees doing this. It's not Syrians doing this. By what possible rationale could you say that recent immigration has anything to do with this, other than that they're Muslim?
    - mistermann 11y ago
      > By what possible rationale could you say that recent immigration has anything to do with this I didn't say it was recent immigration that caused this incident, we both know that (if they are 2nd generation, it couldn't be recent). > other than that they're Muslim You think that their religion has absolutely nothing to do with this? I mean, even unjust prejudice within their host country because of their religion could easily cause social isolation and economic disadvantage leading to anger - that seems like a perfectly reasonable explanation to me and largely places the ultimate blame on the host country.
      - ascorbic 11y ago
        The original comment specified recent immigration. What gave you the impression I thought religion had nothing to do with this? Of course it does. I was talking about immigration though, and the fact they're both Muslim doesn't mean that these incidents have any connection to recent refugees from Syria, aside from the fact that the Syrians are running from these kind of people.
        ptaipale 11y ago
        Actually, two of the nine Paris attackers were (probably) from Syria and had come as refugees, as they were registered with fingerprints in Greece. A few of the others were French and were known to be in Syria, but how they came back to EU is apparently not known (could be with help from people smugglers, avoiding any registration at borders, because some of them were on wanted lists).
        ascorbic 11y ago

tobltobs 11y ago

Even if they hate the society they live in, even if they do not accept the laws, even if they do not contribute anything but demand a lot, even if they do not speak the language, even if they raise their kids to become the same religious fags, even if they support people attacking the country where they are "locals"?