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This is a strong indicator that socialization has a strong influence in what makes people become terrorists. We see one of the memes that have a positive corre

by madez 11y ago

This is a strong indicator that socialization has a strong influence in what makes people become terrorists. We see one of the memes that have a positive correlation with terrorism very clearly; it's islam. People have reflexive denial when one points this out. You can spot this when they don't react to your arguments in a logical manner. If we finally accepted that islam is among other things a facist authoritarian political ideology, then we could eventually say "no" to Saudi Arabia building and controlling mosques in our countries. I wonder why people internalized political correctness as if it were a totalitarian ideology.

zdkl 11y ago
I always take issue with the "become terrorist" line of thinking. What's saying there's a personal progression with an associated change of state? It might be more helpful to view these as events, brought upon by a continuous influence; the specifics of who acts out or why matter little when you consider the consequences, what matters could be to identify what environmental conditions are exploited to influence people towards these positions and affect that. This isn't intended as a defense for the choices or judgements of any party involved, I just wonder why we collectively cling to the notion of 'turning evil'. Pretty much any form of social-building construct is/has been construed as a fascist authoritarian political ideology, so how about abstracting that part of the debate and focusing on who's using which of these ideological tools? Your argument could be made about the US, does that mean you equate both organisations? Their differences may lie more in the intentions of the deciders than in the methods each use to advance their agendas. All parties have different means and unkown goals in so making informed guesses as to the why of it all seems a bit futile.
DanBC 11y ago
> This is a strong indicator that socialization has a strong influence in what makes people become terrorists. You appear to be ignoring the socialisation that happens before radicalisation. > We see one of the memes that have a positive correlation with terrorism very clearly; it's islam. You appear to be ignoring other forms of radicalisation. If I point to department stores that have been fire-bombed by animal rights extremists and then say "Vegetarianism is a radical extremist ideology" I hope people would point out my error. If I point to the bombings of abortion clinics and death threats made to doctors; and the promotion of violence against the child by some Christian extremists and I say "Christianity is a radical extremist ideology, driven by a brutal paternalism" I hope people would point out my error. It's weird that HN fails so hard the "All boobaks are red; are all red things boobaks?" thing that we expect 11 year olds to understand.
- zdkl 11y ago
  The counterpoint to this is that conventional wisdom follows sterotypes, and by playing into these sterotypes each group named above adds a little truth to what you call errors
- madez 11y ago
  The thing that makes the claim regarding vegetarianism wrong but correct with regards to islam is that the foundational book of islam portraits a mass murderer as an idol. Furthermore it proclaims totalitarian authority in some political matters. Ever heard of sharia courts? That sets islam apart from vegetarianism, which we also expect a 11 year old to understand. In fact, I also see similiar dangerous tendencies in christianity. However, these days it leads to comparatively few problems when compared to islam and thus doesn't need as much attention.

by madez 11y ago

zdkl 11y ago

I always take issue with the "become terrorist" line of thinking. What's saying there's a personal progression with an associated change of state? It might be more helpful to view these as events, brought upon by a continuous influence; the specifics of who acts out or why matter little when you consider the consequences, what matters could be to identify what environmental conditions are exploited to influence people towards these positions and affect that. This isn't intended as a defense for the choices or judgements of any party involved, I just wonder why we collectively cling to the notion of 'turning evil'. Pretty much any form of social-building construct is/has been construed as a fascist authoritarian political ideology, so how about abstracting that part of the debate and focusing on who's using which of these ideological tools? Your argument could be made about the US, does that mean you equate both organisations? Their differences may lie more in the intentions of the deciders than in the methods each use to advance their agendas. All parties have different means and unkown goals in so making informed guesses as to the why of it all seems a bit futile.

DanBC 11y ago

> This is a strong indicator that socialization has a strong influence in what makes people become terrorists. You appear to be ignoring the socialisation that happens before radicalisation. > We see one of the memes that have a positive correlation with terrorism very clearly; it's islam. You appear to be ignoring other forms of radicalisation. If I point to department stores that have been fire-bombed by animal rights extremists and then say "Vegetarianism is a radical extremist ideology" I hope people would point out my error. If I point to the bombings of abortion clinics and death threats made to doctors; and the promotion of violence against the child by some Christian extremists and I say "Christianity is a radical extremist ideology, driven by a brutal paternalism" I hope people would point out my error. It's weird that HN fails so hard the "All boobaks are red; are all red things boobaks?" thing that we expect 11 year olds to understand.

zdkl 11y ago
The counterpoint to this is that conventional wisdom follows sterotypes, and by playing into these sterotypes each group named above adds a little truth to what you call errors
madez 11y ago
The thing that makes the claim regarding vegetarianism wrong but correct with regards to islam is that the foundational book of islam portraits a mass murderer as an idol. Furthermore it proclaims totalitarian authority in some political matters. Ever heard of sharia courts? That sets islam apart from vegetarianism, which we also expect a 11 year old to understand. In fact, I also see similiar dangerous tendencies in christianity. However, these days it leads to comparatively few problems when compared to islam and thus doesn't need as much attention.