6 ms·

Microsoft: Skimpy schoolgirls dancing for nerds at an Xbox party

38 points by aceperry 11y ago

mootothemax 11y ago
I'm a guy, and you want to appeal to me? The best you can come up with is this? Scantily clad girls? Really? It's just so insulting - like, the only possibly worthwhile aspect of my personality comes about through strippers, well thanks for that. Let alone the other, multiple issues to take with this.
- rewqfdsa 11y ago
  I'm a guy, and I like seeing pretty girls dance. Most guys do. Most "nerds" are guys. Is there really something wrong with any of this? I'm sick of living in a culture that denies basic facts about human nature.
  - dsr_ 11y ago
    Some percentage of your coworkers would prefer to see handsome men dance. But it doesn't matter, because the big problem here is treating people as sexual objects in the context of a non-sexual business. Do whatever you like on your own time.
    - caminante 11y ago
      > in the context of a non-sexual business I think this is in the context of an "after party" where people are NOT forced to attend -- i.e. they're on their own time. A bar with house music and alcohol (forget about the dancers) doesn't readily mesh with "business appropriate" conventions. Also, I could be mistaken, but I'm guessing the parent wouldn't mind "handsome men" dancing at a party. I'm not seeing how your comment goes against his stance.
  - ZanyProgrammer 11y ago
    Its not about denying anything-its about the inappropriate time and place for it.
nobodyshere 11y ago
Should they have also hired male dancers for equality, or what is exactly the point in being angry with MS here? After all, MS gave them a paid job. How come a girl seeing dancing girls immediately feels unwelcome?
- drcongo 11y ago
  I think you have some reading to do to catch up with last century.
  - rewqfdsa 11y ago
    Is this the new "it's not my job to educate you" SJW cliche?
- mackwic 11y ago
  I think you highlighted the main issue: it's not sexism, it's simply misplaced. Would it be 4 women and 4 men, it would still be out of context and not right. I don't know if it's more jackass or more redneck, anyway it's not something that should be encouraged.
  - caminante 11y ago
    It's tricky for corporates to host an uptempo afterparty. "Booth babes" demoing products are OK during the day, but if you dim the lights, perceptions change.
    - robin_reala 11y ago
      They’re not OK. Why are they OK?
      - caminante 11y ago
        GDC -- the conference -- is NOT a Microsoft event. During the day, many exhibitors have "booth babes" running around exhibits and demo'ing games. [1] Were you not aware of that? [1] http://icanwritefunny.blogspot.com/2012/03/gdc-2012-booth-babes.html http://icanwritefunny.blogspot.com/2012/03/gdc-2012-booth-ba...
imchillyb 11y ago
Screw the Harpies. What they did, is not equality. Their actions state that their small minority is more important than the vast majority. Equality is asking for similar treatment, not banning someone else's fun. I reiterate, fk them. You want equality? No problem. You want preferential -special snowflake- treatment? Hell no.
titanix2 11y ago
I really don't understand how this can lead to hateful tweets like this one: "Fuck you xbox & your fucking "dancing" girls who are here to talk to the boys (You're not men if you buy into that act) #GDC16". Some girls are here paid to dance and to visually please men like in a lot of clubs but I don't think they will go as far as not talking to other girls. Not to mention the idea of speaking in this kind of club setting seems quite goofy. Also: "I don't want to talk to anyone here in case they're those shitty little boys enjoying the attention from the "dancing" women" I find it very paradoxal to pretend being for inclusion while refusing to speak to people of another sex and wanting some people to be out of the party because of their sex and their outfit.
- KON_Air 11y ago
  Maybe because it has nothing to do with sexism and it is all about attention-gathering.
- ZanyProgrammer 11y ago
  I don't think it has to do with any of that. Its just inappropriate for a professional software conference? (and at the risk of sounding like a Tumblr EssJayDoubleU, assumes that everyone there is a horny hetero dude).
- ZanyProgrammer 11y ago
  "SJWs are the TRUE fascists/censors/prudes, amirate?"
geomark 11y ago
Would people's reaction be different if the dancers were dressed differently?
empath75 11y ago
I sort of think this is overblown. I suspect that they booked the dance club for the after party and the dance club just always has dancers there. That's sort of standard for a lot of clubs like that. It's definitely gross for a business event, but I don't think Microsoft went out of their way to have dancing school girls there.
- akavi 11y ago
  That looks like DNA lounge, which definitely does not have go-go dancers by default. If so, it's pretty likely the Microsoft event organizers specifically requested/hired them.
nmbr213 11y ago
> Slutwalk > How dare you tell me how to dress! > Some party > How dare these women dress the way I don't like! Please make up your minds.
- heartsucker 11y ago
  There's a difference between accepting that other people dress in "slutty" outfits and making it ok, and not wanting sexuality jammed down your throat at a technology event.
  - rewqfdsa 11y ago
    It was an optional afterparty at a dance club.
    - tptacek 11y ago
      The whole conference is "optional".
      - heartsucker 11y ago
        Most decisions in life are optional. Getting a driver's license is optional, so if women complained about go-go dancers in the DMV making them feel uncomfortable, would you tell them "driver's licenses are optional, so don't get one?"
        tptacek 11y ago
        What?
        heartsucker 11y ago
        Your parent comment is flagged and shows no text, so I think I mistook the tone of your response. Disregard my previous comment.
tptacek 11y ago
It seems we're going to go through with the Kabuki Dance version of this HN thread, with the attendant gaslighting comments wondering how anyone could have a problem with this, &c. In reality, this happened a week ago, and Microsoft got a small avalanche of bad press despite apologizing immediately (the event was handled by an event planning contractor, not the company itself). There is not in fact a live controversy about whether what happened was OK for a conference event: outside of venues like HN and Reddit, we're all pretty clear that it is not.
- MrUnderhill 11y ago
  It's reminiscent of NDC 2012 (Norwegian Developer Conference), where also the event planning contractor arranged similar 'entertainment' (although more awkward than offensive, really), and Microsoft apologized afterwards [1]. [1] http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringeworthy-penis-song-at-ndc-2012/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringe...
- stillsut 11y ago
  I just feel bad for the event planning company: "They didn't like the dancers?" "Nope" "But the vacuum guys like them, so did insurance guys, hell even the mortician convention liked them. Are these the same dancers?" "Yep, but this is...technology. These people consider themselves different than everyone else in the world. They get offended when someone wears a suit to meet with them." "OK, give me the heads up next time we deal with these people, I'll get them some wookies to walk around their party, or whatever the hell they like"
  - craigvn 11y ago
    I am sure some people at those companies would not like them as well, but they are not one of the biggest and most well know companies in the world.
heartsucker 11y ago
Shit, I'm an engineer who moonlights in the porn industry, and even I think this was in poor taste. Not everything has to be about sex, especially what appears to be a tech conference in an industry that admits to having a problem with being open towards women/trans/etc.
cauterized 11y ago
HN appears to be just about the only place on the internet where a majority (or at least a very vocal minority) thinks this was OK and feels the need to defend it. I think that's telling about our industry and the startup portion of it in particular.
- rewqfdsa 11y ago
  On the contrary, outside the bay area and a few SJW outposts, you'll be hard-pressed to see much outrage.
  - cauterized 11y ago
    Have you read ANY of the (abundant) mainstream media reporting on the topic? Because that doesn't in the least correspond with what I was seeing written all weekend.
    - rewqfdsa 11y ago
      The media (especially the tech media) are not the country. Ask real people.
      - GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago
        What is a 'real person' by your definition.
      - tptacek 11y ago
        You mean go out in this great country of ours, skipping the lamestream media and talking to great red, white, and blue, through and through, the real people of America, you know, people of faith and the Constitution, and tell those liberals and media elites they can go pound sand, I tell ya?
- spriggan3 11y ago
  > HN appears to be just about the only place on the internet where a majority (or at least a very vocal minority) thinks this was OK and feels the need to defend it. I think that's telling about our industry and the startup portion of it in particular. Nobody's defending anything. The faux outrage on the other hand is just ridiculous. Most people outraged by that weren't even at the event. On the other hand given how packed the venue was, clearly people enjoyed it. Good for them.
beeboop 11y ago
Previous discussion https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11318461 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11318461
- tptacek 11y ago
  Best part of that discussion was the dude saying that the dancers were dressed like schoolgirls because dancing is hard work and that was just athletic wear. Like, if they wore turtlenecks, they'd get all sweaty!
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

38 points by aceperry 11y ago

I'm a guy, and you want to appeal to me? The best you can come up with is this? Scantily clad girls? Really? It's just so insulting - like, the only possibly worthwhile aspect of my personality comes about through strippers, well thanks for that. Let alone the other, multiple issues to take with this.

rewqfdsa 11y ago
I'm a guy, and I like seeing pretty girls dance. Most guys do. Most "nerds" are guys. Is there really something wrong with any of this? I'm sick of living in a culture that denies basic facts about human nature.
- dsr_ 11y ago
  Some percentage of your coworkers would prefer to see handsome men dance. But it doesn't matter, because the big problem here is treating people as sexual objects in the context of a non-sexual business. Do whatever you like on your own time.
  - caminante 11y ago
    > in the context of a non-sexual business I think this is in the context of an "after party" where people are NOT forced to attend -- i.e. they're on their own time. A bar with house music and alcohol (forget about the dancers) doesn't readily mesh with "business appropriate" conventions. Also, I could be mistaken, but I'm guessing the parent wouldn't mind "handsome men" dancing at a party. I'm not seeing how your comment goes against his stance.
- ZanyProgrammer 11y ago
  Its not about denying anything-its about the inappropriate time and place for it.

nobodyshere 11y ago

Should they have also hired male dancers for equality, or what is exactly the point in being angry with MS here? After all, MS gave them a paid job. How come a girl seeing dancing girls immediately feels unwelcome?

drcongo 11y ago
I think you have some reading to do to catch up with last century.
- rewqfdsa 11y ago
  Is this the new "it's not my job to educate you" SJW cliche?
mackwic 11y ago
I think you highlighted the main issue: it's not sexism, it's simply misplaced. Would it be 4 women and 4 men, it would still be out of context and not right. I don't know if it's more jackass or more redneck, anyway it's not something that should be encouraged.
- caminante 11y ago
  It's tricky for corporates to host an uptempo afterparty. "Booth babes" demoing products are OK during the day, but if you dim the lights, perceptions change.
  - robin_reala 11y ago
    They’re not OK. Why are they OK?
    - caminante 11y ago
      GDC -- the conference -- is NOT a Microsoft event. During the day, many exhibitors have "booth babes" running around exhibits and demo'ing games. [1] Were you not aware of that? [1] http://icanwritefunny.blogspot.com/2012/03/gdc-2012-booth-babes.html http://icanwritefunny.blogspot.com/2012/03/gdc-2012-booth-ba...

imchillyb 11y ago

Screw the Harpies. What they did, is not equality. Their actions state that their small minority is more important than the vast majority. Equality is asking for similar treatment, not banning someone else's fun. I reiterate, fk them. You want equality? No problem. You want preferential -special snowflake- treatment? Hell no.

titanix2 11y ago

I really don't understand how this can lead to hateful tweets like this one: "Fuck you xbox & your fucking "dancing" girls who are here to talk to the boys (You're not men if you buy into that act) #GDC16". Some girls are here paid to dance and to visually please men like in a lot of clubs but I don't think they will go as far as not talking to other girls. Not to mention the idea of speaking in this kind of club setting seems quite goofy. Also: "I don't want to talk to anyone here in case they're those shitty little boys enjoying the attention from the "dancing" women" I find it very paradoxal to pretend being for inclusion while refusing to speak to people of another sex and wanting some people to be out of the party because of their sex and their outfit.

KON_Air 11y ago
Maybe because it has nothing to do with sexism and it is all about attention-gathering.
ZanyProgrammer 11y ago
I don't think it has to do with any of that. Its just inappropriate for a professional software conference? (and at the risk of sounding like a Tumblr EssJayDoubleU, assumes that everyone there is a horny hetero dude).
ZanyProgrammer 11y ago
"SJWs are the TRUE fascists/censors/prudes, amirate?"

geomark 11y ago

Would people's reaction be different if the dancers were dressed differently?

empath75 11y ago

I sort of think this is overblown. I suspect that they booked the dance club for the after party and the dance club just always has dancers there. That's sort of standard for a lot of clubs like that. It's definitely gross for a business event, but I don't think Microsoft went out of their way to have dancing school girls there.

akavi 11y ago
That looks like DNA lounge, which definitely does not have go-go dancers by default. If so, it's pretty likely the Microsoft event organizers specifically requested/hired them.

nmbr213 11y ago

> Slutwalk > How dare you tell me how to dress! > Some party > How dare these women dress the way I don't like! Please make up your minds.

heartsucker 11y ago
There's a difference between accepting that other people dress in "slutty" outfits and making it ok, and not wanting sexuality jammed down your throat at a technology event.
- rewqfdsa 11y ago
  It was an optional afterparty at a dance club.
  - tptacek 11y ago
    The whole conference is "optional".
    - heartsucker 11y ago
      Most decisions in life are optional. Getting a driver's license is optional, so if women complained about go-go dancers in the DMV making them feel uncomfortable, would you tell them "driver's licenses are optional, so don't get one?"
      - tptacek 11y ago
        What?
        heartsucker 11y ago
        Your parent comment is flagged and shows no text, so I think I mistook the tone of your response. Disregard my previous comment.

tptacek 11y ago

It seems we're going to go through with the Kabuki Dance version of this HN thread, with the attendant gaslighting comments wondering how anyone could have a problem with this, &c. In reality, this happened a week ago, and Microsoft got a small avalanche of bad press despite apologizing immediately (the event was handled by an event planning contractor, not the company itself). There is not in fact a live controversy about whether what happened was OK for a conference event: outside of venues like HN and Reddit, we're all pretty clear that it is not.

MrUnderhill 11y ago
It's reminiscent of NDC 2012 (Norwegian Developer Conference), where also the event planning contractor arranged similar 'entertainment' (although more awkward than offensive, really), and Microsoft apologized afterwards [1]. [1] http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringeworthy-penis-song-at-ndc-2012/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringe...
stillsut 11y ago
I just feel bad for the event planning company: "They didn't like the dancers?" "Nope" "But the vacuum guys like them, so did insurance guys, hell even the mortician convention liked them. Are these the same dancers?" "Yep, but this is...technology. These people consider themselves different than everyone else in the world. They get offended when someone wears a suit to meet with them." "OK, give me the heads up next time we deal with these people, I'll get them some wookies to walk around their party, or whatever the hell they like"
- craigvn 11y ago
  I am sure some people at those companies would not like them as well, but they are not one of the biggest and most well know companies in the world.

heartsucker 11y ago

Shit, I'm an engineer who moonlights in the porn industry, and even I think this was in poor taste. Not everything has to be about sex, especially what appears to be a tech conference in an industry that admits to having a problem with being open towards women/trans/etc.

cauterized 11y ago

HN appears to be just about the only place on the internet where a majority (or at least a very vocal minority) thinks this was OK and feels the need to defend it. I think that's telling about our industry and the startup portion of it in particular.

rewqfdsa 11y ago
On the contrary, outside the bay area and a few SJW outposts, you'll be hard-pressed to see much outrage.
- cauterized 11y ago
  Have you read ANY of the (abundant) mainstream media reporting on the topic? Because that doesn't in the least correspond with what I was seeing written all weekend.
  - rewqfdsa 11y ago
    The media (especially the tech media) are not the country. Ask real people.
    - GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago
      What is a 'real person' by your definition.
    - tptacek 11y ago
      You mean go out in this great country of ours, skipping the lamestream media and talking to great red, white, and blue, through and through, the real people of America, you know, people of faith and the Constitution, and tell those liberals and media elites they can go pound sand, I tell ya?
spriggan3 11y ago
> HN appears to be just about the only place on the internet where a majority (or at least a very vocal minority) thinks this was OK and feels the need to defend it. I think that's telling about our industry and the startup portion of it in particular. Nobody's defending anything. The faux outrage on the other hand is just ridiculous. Most people outraged by that weren't even at the event. On the other hand given how packed the venue was, clearly people enjoyed it. Good for them.

beeboop 11y ago

Previous discussion https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11318461 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11318461

tptacek 11y ago
Best part of that discussion was the dude saying that the dancers were dressed like schoolgirls because dancing is hard work and that was just athletic wear. Like, if they wore turtlenecks, they'd get all sweaty!

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]