5 ms·

People are secretive so they can avoid the likes of a Marc Andreeson or a Mark Zuckerburg. As you can plainly see, despite all the talk of "honor" and "our rep

by NSX2 19y ago

People are secretive so they can avoid the likes of a Marc Andreeson or a Mark Zuckerburg. As you can plainly see, despite all the talk of "honor" and "our reputation is the basis for our business" and not dealing with companies that are being sued under suspicious circumstances, etc., even "top-tier" VC firms will put their stated ethics aside and jump into bed with the money makers, regardless of how they came to be that way. Who the heck wants to go around for the rest of their life wondering "what could have been" if they kept their mouths shut. And here's a little clue - just because VCs tell you they think you're a noob for using NDAs, doesn't mean they respect you for mindlessly taking their advice. Learn to think for yourself. What would you rather invest in, as a VC - a guy who's taken measures to ensure that everyone who knows about the idea is either part of it or prevented from copying it, or a guy who spoke about the idea with 100 programmers who may very well be trying to secretly implement it behind his back even though they pretended not to be intested? It's called control, and when you're starting up, it's one of the few things that are actually "in your control".

theoneill 19y ago
I know what Zuckerberg is supposed to have done, but what did Pmarca do that was iffy?
- NSX2 19y ago
  Well, he was a student, one of quite a few, working on the base code of what became Netscape Navigator. One weekend when nobody was around he decided he wanted more out of the project than research credit, so he let himself into the research lab when nobody was around, copied everyone else's code and took off to get VC funding. Later he would dismiss the whole thing in typicall dirtbag fashion, ie, "Well, you know, it's hard to recall who wrote what code, and what counts was I got it out to market first, etc." So basically he stole somebody else's work, took credit for it, and then hid behind the legitimacy that financial success brings in this country.
  - pg 19y ago
    This sounds fishy to me. If he was collaborating with other people on Mozilla he wouldn't have needed to "let himself into" (= "walk into" + furtive spin) any physical place to get code. Surely he would have had access via a network. And since Mozilla was open source, wasn't he within his rights to use this code in a product? Edit: I meant Mosaic, not Mozilla.
    - NSX2 19y ago
      I don't recall all the details since this was about a decade ago, but as far as I can recall, Netscape got sued by the U. of Illinois & they wound up settling out of court for millions. In addition, as for the open-source thing, I believe it wasn't totally open-source originally which is what caused the lawsuit when Netscape distributed the browser for free. Anyway these points are off-track; in conclusion startups are secretive because while execution may be crucial, so is being realistic enough to realize you're not in the best position to execute properly and that it's best to keep your mouth shut until you are, lest someone who is in a better position to execute than you are run off with "your thing." And there are plenty of people who can/would run off with your thing, take the credit for it and not think twice about what happens to you as a result of their behavior.
      - wallflower 19y ago
        Marc deserves credit for proposing IMG. http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.html http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.ht... "I'd like to propose a new, optional HTML tag: IMG Required argument is SRC="url". This names a bitmap or pixmap file for the browser to attempt to pull over the network and interpret as an image, to be embedded in the text at the point of the tag's occurrence."
      - brlewis 19y ago
        When you make accusations you should not go on recollection. Mosaic was open source from its earliest days. Marc was not just one of many students working on it, he was the most prominent developer on the project. That's my recollection, but it's also what I find when I look for sources to cite: http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0262.html http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0262.ht...

by NSX2 19y ago

theoneill 19y ago

I know what Zuckerberg is supposed to have done, but what did Pmarca do that was iffy?

NSX2 19y ago
Well, he was a student, one of quite a few, working on the base code of what became Netscape Navigator. One weekend when nobody was around he decided he wanted more out of the project than research credit, so he let himself into the research lab when nobody was around, copied everyone else's code and took off to get VC funding. Later he would dismiss the whole thing in typicall dirtbag fashion, ie, "Well, you know, it's hard to recall who wrote what code, and what counts was I got it out to market first, etc." So basically he stole somebody else's work, took credit for it, and then hid behind the legitimacy that financial success brings in this country.
- pg 19y ago
  This sounds fishy to me. If he was collaborating with other people on Mozilla he wouldn't have needed to "let himself into" (= "walk into" + furtive spin) any physical place to get code. Surely he would have had access via a network. And since Mozilla was open source, wasn't he within his rights to use this code in a product? Edit: I meant Mosaic, not Mozilla.
  - NSX2 19y ago
    I don't recall all the details since this was about a decade ago, but as far as I can recall, Netscape got sued by the U. of Illinois & they wound up settling out of court for millions. In addition, as for the open-source thing, I believe it wasn't totally open-source originally which is what caused the lawsuit when Netscape distributed the browser for free. Anyway these points are off-track; in conclusion startups are secretive because while execution may be crucial, so is being realistic enough to realize you're not in the best position to execute properly and that it's best to keep your mouth shut until you are, lest someone who is in a better position to execute than you are run off with "your thing." And there are plenty of people who can/would run off with your thing, take the credit for it and not think twice about what happens to you as a result of their behavior.
    - wallflower 19y ago
      Marc deserves credit for proposing IMG. http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.html http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.ht... "I'd like to propose a new, optional HTML tag: IMG Required argument is SRC="url". This names a bitmap or pixmap file for the browser to attempt to pull over the network and interpret as an image, to be embedded in the text at the point of the tag's occurrence."
    - brlewis 19y ago
      When you make accusations you should not go on recollection. Mosaic was open source from its earliest days. Marc was not just one of many students working on it, he was the most prominent developer on the project. That's my recollection, but it's also what I find when I look for sources to cite: http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0262.html http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0262.ht...