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> put things in perspective ... risk 7 billions lives and the lives of their children for centuries? You and I have very different ideas of perspective. I don'

by philh 11y ago

> put things in perspective ... risk 7 billions lives and the lives of their children for centuries? You and I have very different ideas of perspective. I don't want the FBI to win here, but it wouldn't be that bad.

MacsHeadroom 11y ago
This isn't Apple vs the FBI. It's Humanity vs Unprecidented Surveillance. It will be precisely that bad.
- philh 11y ago
  This is one battle in that war. It's not the whole war. How will this affect the average citizen of China? Indonesia? Namibia? If Apple loses, will they be immediately forbidden from creating devices such that they'd be unable to comply with similar future demands? The war is important, but getting confused between the war and a battle seems like a failure of perspective.
  - saganus 11y ago
    > How will this affect the average citizen of China? Indonesia? Namibia? Not sure about those specific countries you mentioned, but I can tell you that the result of this will indeed have far more overreaching implications than a lot of people think about. Just as an example, where I live there are a ton of laws that get passed that are just copies of what the US is currently doing with their laws. Pretty much a copy/paste operation, except that it's adapted to our own national laws. For example, anti-bullying laws, as soon as they started having some media attention in the US, the media also focused on that same subject over here. Also with marijuana legalization laws, some Internet copyright ones, etc. The US likes to project its legal agenda to the rest of the world via TPP and such, but also there's this other effect where legislators from other countries try to emulate the current "trends" in lawmaking in the US, so to speak. In that context I think it's very likely that there will indeed be serious side effects to the citizens of other countries, whether their governments are on board with it or not.
    - philh 11y ago
      I'm quite sure there will be serious side effects in other countries. I'm also confident that they won't be "risk 7 billions lives and the lives of their children for centuries" serious.

by philh 11y ago

MacsHeadroom 11y ago

This isn't Apple vs the FBI. It's Humanity vs Unprecidented Surveillance. It will be precisely that bad.

philh 11y ago
This is one battle in that war. It's not the whole war. How will this affect the average citizen of China? Indonesia? Namibia? If Apple loses, will they be immediately forbidden from creating devices such that they'd be unable to comply with similar future demands? The war is important, but getting confused between the war and a battle seems like a failure of perspective.
- saganus 11y ago
  > How will this affect the average citizen of China? Indonesia? Namibia? Not sure about those specific countries you mentioned, but I can tell you that the result of this will indeed have far more overreaching implications than a lot of people think about. Just as an example, where I live there are a ton of laws that get passed that are just copies of what the US is currently doing with their laws. Pretty much a copy/paste operation, except that it's adapted to our own national laws. For example, anti-bullying laws, as soon as they started having some media attention in the US, the media also focused on that same subject over here. Also with marijuana legalization laws, some Internet copyright ones, etc. The US likes to project its legal agenda to the rest of the world via TPP and such, but also there's this other effect where legislators from other countries try to emulate the current "trends" in lawmaking in the US, so to speak. In that context I think it's very likely that there will indeed be serious side effects to the citizens of other countries, whether their governments are on board with it or not.
  - philh 11y ago
    I'm quite sure there will be serious side effects in other countries. I'm also confident that they won't be "risk 7 billions lives and the lives of their children for centuries" serious.