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This happens on Shopify all the time now. Since we moved our servers to the United States we are being hit with DMCA related infringements almost weekly. If we
by xal 17y ago
This happens on Shopify all the time now. Since we moved our servers to the United States we are being hit with DMCA related infringements almost weekly.
If we get normal trademark disputes they are usually easy to deal with: we simply put the two parties into direct contact and they can figure it out. However, if the requester uses the DMCA method everything changes: We get an ultimatum from our hosting company (Rackspace) to resolve the conflict within 7 days or they will unplug our servers, which would disconnect many thousands of e-commerce stores and millions of sales. Obviously we cannot allow this to happen. Rackspace does this because they need to stay a "safe harbor" under the DMCA and this is how they pass the buck to us.
Luckily there have been precedents where false DMCA claims have lead to hundreds of thousands of dollar in damages to the plaintiffs. Our only recurse is to point this out to the originator of the claim before forwarding it to the affected store. In most cases this leads to them dropping the complaint and/or pursuing the (correct) copyright/trademark avenue instead.
- drusenko 17y agoTo post up a counter-perspective here: From our perspective (Weebly) the DMCA is quite convenient for us. We turn away any DMCA complaint not related to copyright (like trademark infringement). Other than invalid complaints (did not meet the requirements for a complaint, was not a copyright complaint, etc) we have never had an abusive DMCA notice -- 100% of our notices (and we usually get a couple per day) have been valid. We don't have the issue with our host being able to unplug us that easily (we manage our own network) but we do have the issue of liability, which the DMCA solves for providers like us. Also -- I'd definitely be interested in the cases you're referring to, where false DMCA claims have resulted in major damages.
- l0stman 17y agoCould you explain why have you decided to manage your own network. If I remember correctly, that wasn't the case in the early days of Weebly.
- drusenko 17y agoFor many reasons, including: - We already have the expertise to do so, so the cost to us is much smaller - We can ensure a much higher level of service by making sure every component along the line is up to par (you'd cry if you heard what some colo providers do) - We can fix problems in-line with our priorities, since we're the ones that fix them (like keeping published sites up, even if the editor is down, for example) - We can set up and manage geographically redundant datacenters - And finally, we're able to do so extremely cheaply It's definitely something to consider when you reach a certain scale, and especially if you have the know-how to get it done. We've calculated that for every server we purchase, we'd pay that cost every 2-3 months on AWS, for perspective.
- bbatsell 17y ago> (you'd cry if you heard what some colo providers do) I'd love to hear more, if you're at liberty to share.
- drusenko 17y agono ddos protection, lousy routers, single points of failure everywhere (on old servers that are about to die), running their racks very near electrical capacity (too many servers load up at once, breaker trips), way oversubscribing bandwidth, not doing appropriate preventative maintenance, downtime because some tech slips up when editing routing configuration, downtime because some tech trips over your power chords (honestly, a top cause of downtime), downtime because another customer in a shared-colo environment trips over your power chords, etc. the list goes on and on and on. and, worst of all, you're at their whim -- if they decide, for whatever reason, to unplug you, that's it. we prefer to eliminate anyone who has the ability to take our service down :)
- DanBlake 17y agoJust because they do a DMCA request doesnt mean you have to hand it over. Allow the other participant to submit a counter notice if they choose, which puts it out of your hands.
- ube 17y agoCan you elaborate on the type of documentation you use false DCMA claims?
- adrianscott 17y agoTime to find a new hosting solution, IMHO.
- chaqke 17y agoPretty much all hosting solutions in the United States will fall under the "safe harbor" clause of the DMCA. This law makes any noncompliant service a "publisher", liable for all content on the site - unless you follow the DMCA. Upon receiving a takedown notice, the service provider must take down content immediately, and issue a notice to the supposed actual content owner. Content owner has a short period in which he can file a counter claim and keep the content up for a little bit while the two sides argue. Service provider becomes a publisher, liable for your potentially illegal content (trademark/copyright infringement, slander, libel, child pornography, etc) if they do not comply. Rackspace is not the problem - the 105th Congress was the problem.
- ajross 17y agoThat's overstating the case. The DMCA doesn't require instant take-down, it promises the converse: if you take it down in a timely manner upon receipt of a complaint, you cannot be held liable. The hosting provider is allowed to make its own determination about the validity of the claim, and in fact most do.
- oneplusone 17y agoWhy did you guys move your servers to the US and do you think it was worth it with the additional cost of dealing with DMCA?
- drusenko 17y agoI would assume the reduced latency for a predominantly US-customer base would be well worth it. The cost of dealing with the DMCA is minimal (and other countries have much less liability protection, anyway)
- xal 17y agoIt was worth it because Rackspace is a much better host. We used to run our own data center in toronto before this. The DMCA is a major annoyance but doesn't really factor into the bottom line.