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So from what I read (thanks ot this submission) about terminally ill people killing themselves the consensus for people to kill themselves would be some kind of

So from what I read (thanks ot this submission) about terminally ill people killing themselves the consensus for people to kill themselves would be some kind of morphine/opiate overdose. Sounds like a decent way to go. I always thought I should get a gun (Possession of firearms is largely illegal where I live so this would involve some shady dealings and a lot of money) if I am ever diagnosed with something painful and/or terminal. As a programmer who is used to working with his mind I am horrified at the thought of staying physically alive but slowly losing my mind. Getting enough morphine to overdose should be easier than buying a gun from a criminal. Damned if I'll stay alive in constant pain just so some religious nuts can feel elevated.

andrew1 17y ago
I think a preferred option for many people in this situation would be to go to an assisted suicide clinic like Dignitas in Switzerland where you can choose to die at a time of your choosing, without pain, surrounded by your loved ones, with the 'operation' performed by a medical professional. A problem with trying to kill yourself is the risk of getting it wrong - shooting yourself in the head but not managing to kill yourself, not taking enough of your drug of choice - and leading to a possibly lengthy agonising death, or permanent coma etc. The problem people in the UK have with going to somewhere like Dignitas is that the law around assisting someone with suicide is vague, so if someone's family goes with them to Dignitas, they risk arrest when returning to the UK. In practise I think prosecution has never happened, but people have certainly been arrested on returning to the country. Personally I think assisted suicide should be legal (although not as something that can be a spur of the moment decision) so that people can choose to take their own life, without the risk of pain or error, and with the support of their families.
- pyre 17y ago
  > I think prosecution has never happened, but people have certainly been arrested on returning to the country. How would they know why you left/re-entered the country unless you told them? Do the UK authorities track anyone the enters/exits a Dignitas facility?
  - andrew1 17y ago
    I presume it comes about through reporting the fact that the person has died. 'arrested on returning to the country' probably should have been 'arrested after reporting the suicide and having stated their own whereabouts at the time of death'. There's an example of it happening here: http://www.lists.opn.org/pipermail/right-to-die_lists.opn.org/2009-July/003495.html http://www.lists.opn.org/pipermail/right-to-die_lists.opn.or...
holygoat 17y ago
Don't use a gun. Human beings are really hard to kill, and messing up a gunshot suicide is reportedly very easy. You're liable to end up with a big chunk of cheek or jaw missing, but not dead. Unpleasant. Someone also has to clean up your mess...
- electromagnetic 17y ago
  Biologically speaking it is very hard to kill a human, at least to kill yourself. Through the mouth the bullet is likely to bounce off the hard palette, any further back and it's exiting the back of your neck and unless you get really lucky and hit the right bit of your spinal cord to stop your heart and lungs, you'll be in extreme pain. Gun against forehead, poor angle to hold the gun at and potential ricochet again. Holding at the temple is a good way for the bullet to penetrate, however the bullet isn't likely to cause catastrophic damage to the areas of the brain you want. From what I've read the best place is actually above the rear of the ear (where the elf-ear spike would be). Most people get a pretty good angle, which means the bullet is likely to penetrate, also the bone isn't quite as thick as everywhere else and also if you're using hollow-points you've got a high chance you'll hit the centres of the brain you want to hit. If you're going to end yourself by a gun, get a shotgun, use buckshot and build a rig so that you can get it to impact your skull from the rear. It guarantees virtually everything, you'd also be able to arrange it so that your family isn't the first to find you by calling the emergency services first. Also shotguns are typically legal in most countries with limited restrictions placed on their ownership. However, if you're going this route you might as well go down to a street corner in a shady area and buy a huge wack of heroin and have an illegal opiate overdose. If you want to guarantee the end, ingest a large quantity of rat poison pellets (preferably encase them in gel capsules) before you shoot up and you'll be a gone long before you re-enter comprehension. Suicide is a messy business, and it appears as though the human body is designed to be incapable of offing itself easily as the weak-parts on our skull (top and back) can only be self-hit using the elbow joints for force and not the stronger shoulder muscles. Although I've read that an aluminum baseball bat has a higher success rate than gunshot. However, it's hard to beat a rope and a fast stop for the most effective method of death (over 3-feet has a good chance of snapping the spine causing cessation of heart and lung function, so over 6-feet of drop would likely guarantee it with a sturdy rope).
dkersten 17y ago
I used to think that a shotgun shell to the brainstem was the quickest and most painless way to die - but then I saw a photo of someone who survived it somehow and... well, theres some things that once seen, can't be unseen. Now I would never want to die through a firearm wound - the chances of surviving in a worse state than you were in before is what scares me.

andrew1 17y ago

I think a preferred option for many people in this situation would be to go to an assisted suicide clinic like Dignitas in Switzerland where you can choose to die at a time of your choosing, without pain, surrounded by your loved ones, with the 'operation' performed by a medical professional. A problem with trying to kill yourself is the risk of getting it wrong - shooting yourself in the head but not managing to kill yourself, not taking enough of your drug of choice - and leading to a possibly lengthy agonising death, or permanent coma etc. The problem people in the UK have with going to somewhere like Dignitas is that the law around assisting someone with suicide is vague, so if someone's family goes with them to Dignitas, they risk arrest when returning to the UK. In practise I think prosecution has never happened, but people have certainly been arrested on returning to the country. Personally I think assisted suicide should be legal (although not as something that can be a spur of the moment decision) so that people can choose to take their own life, without the risk of pain or error, and with the support of their families.

pyre 17y ago
> I think prosecution has never happened, but people have certainly been arrested on returning to the country. How would they know why you left/re-entered the country unless you told them? Do the UK authorities track anyone the enters/exits a Dignitas facility?
- andrew1 17y ago
  I presume it comes about through reporting the fact that the person has died. 'arrested on returning to the country' probably should have been 'arrested after reporting the suicide and having stated their own whereabouts at the time of death'. There's an example of it happening here: http://www.lists.opn.org/pipermail/right-to-die_lists.opn.org/2009-July/003495.html http://www.lists.opn.org/pipermail/right-to-die_lists.opn.or...

holygoat 17y ago

Don't use a gun. Human beings are really hard to kill, and messing up a gunshot suicide is reportedly very easy. You're liable to end up with a big chunk of cheek or jaw missing, but not dead. Unpleasant. Someone also has to clean up your mess...

electromagnetic 17y ago
Biologically speaking it is very hard to kill a human, at least to kill yourself. Through the mouth the bullet is likely to bounce off the hard palette, any further back and it's exiting the back of your neck and unless you get really lucky and hit the right bit of your spinal cord to stop your heart and lungs, you'll be in extreme pain. Gun against forehead, poor angle to hold the gun at and potential ricochet again. Holding at the temple is a good way for the bullet to penetrate, however the bullet isn't likely to cause catastrophic damage to the areas of the brain you want. From what I've read the best place is actually above the rear of the ear (where the elf-ear spike would be). Most people get a pretty good angle, which means the bullet is likely to penetrate, also the bone isn't quite as thick as everywhere else and also if you're using hollow-points you've got a high chance you'll hit the centres of the brain you want to hit. If you're going to end yourself by a gun, get a shotgun, use buckshot and build a rig so that you can get it to impact your skull from the rear. It guarantees virtually everything, you'd also be able to arrange it so that your family isn't the first to find you by calling the emergency services first. Also shotguns are typically legal in most countries with limited restrictions placed on their ownership. However, if you're going this route you might as well go down to a street corner in a shady area and buy a huge wack of heroin and have an illegal opiate overdose. If you want to guarantee the end, ingest a large quantity of rat poison pellets (preferably encase them in gel capsules) before you shoot up and you'll be a gone long before you re-enter comprehension. Suicide is a messy business, and it appears as though the human body is designed to be incapable of offing itself easily as the weak-parts on our skull (top and back) can only be self-hit using the elbow joints for force and not the stronger shoulder muscles. Although I've read that an aluminum baseball bat has a higher success rate than gunshot. However, it's hard to beat a rope and a fast stop for the most effective method of death (over 3-feet has a good chance of snapping the spine causing cessation of heart and lung function, so over 6-feet of drop would likely guarantee it with a sturdy rope).

dkersten 17y ago

I used to think that a shotgun shell to the brainstem was the quickest and most painless way to die - but then I saw a photo of someone who survived it somehow and... well, theres some things that once seen, can't be unseen. Now I would never want to die through a firearm wound - the chances of surviving in a worse state than you were in before is what scares me.