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Things I Won’t Work With: Dioxygen Difluoride (2010)

73 points by CarolineW 11y ago

CapitalistCartr 11y ago
This appears to have a three year cycle on HN. Three years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5546450 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5546450 Six years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425
- omginternets 11y ago
  This is the first time I've seen it, and I quite enjoyed it.
  - masklinn 11y ago
    If it's the first time you've seen it, I recommend going through the whole "Things I Won't Work With" archives[0]. They're a great read. "Sand Won't Save You This Time" is hilarious (from a safe distance) and where Lowe started hitting his stride. It will also (rightfully, it's fantastic) make you look for the Ignition! PDF, because it's not every day you read a paragraph introduced with: > It is, of course, extremely toxic, but that’s the least of the problem. then find out said introduction is 100% on the spot. [0] http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/category/things-i-wont-work-with http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/category/thing...
    - mstade 11y ago
      This stuff is hilarious! I know only basic high school chemistry, but I'm able to follow most of this at a sort of "I kind of get it" level – enough to get some seriously good laughs out of it. Thanks for this, I feel like someone just told me about the Yellowstone supervolcano for the first time!
    - spacehome 11y ago
      "Sand Won't Save You This Time" is the best one.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
  - CapitalistCartr 11y ago
    Yeah, its my favorite chemistry story.
  - Malic 11y ago
    If you enjoy stories of Chemicals With Alarming Properties, then be sure to check out Charles Stross's short story, "A Tall Tail." (Very Big Grin) http://www.tor.com/2012/07/20/a-tall-tail/ http://www.tor.com/2012/07/20/a-tall-tail/
    - ashmud 11y ago
      I stumbled upon this MeFi discussion when I searched for "Atom City Number Nine." http://www.metafilter.com/118133/A-Tall-Tail http://www.metafilter.com/118133/A-Tall-Tail
  - jtolmar 11y ago
    This is my favorite chemical that he's written about: http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/sand_wont_save_you_this_time http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/san...
- ufmace 11y ago
  Seen it before, still a fun read though. What else could you say about a substance that will instantly set ICE on fire?!
  - ceejayoz 11y ago
    > What else could you say about a substance that will instantly set ICE on fire?! That's nothing! From the same series: > The compound also a stronger oxidizing agent than oxygen itself, which also puts it into rare territory. That means that it can potentially go on to “burn” things that you would normally consider already burnt to hell and gone, and a practical consequence of that is that it’ll start roaring reactions with things like bricks and asbestos tile. http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/sand_wont_save_you_this_time http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/san... Yes, chlorine trifluoride will set asbestos on fire.
- wernercd 11y ago
  Obligatory: https://xkcd.com/1053/ https://xkcd.com/1053/ Not everyone knows everything :)
  - mikeash 11y ago
    I don't think that comment is criticizing the dupe, just mentioning it and providing links to earlier discussions.
  - zodPod 11y ago
    I love the lesson in the alt text, "Saying 'what kind of an idiot doesn't know about the Yellowstone supervolcano' is so much more boring than telling someone about the Yellowstone supervolcano for the first time." It's so true and it really is how we should look at life! Not knocking the original commenter either, just putting this out there!
  - tlrobinson 11y ago
    Still, it should have a "(2010)" in the title.
- meanduck 11y ago
  One more from same series. Things I Won’t Touch: Hydrofluoric Acid (2004) : https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10678571 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10678571 (81 points by networked 100 days ago | past | web | 63 comments) Google HN for intitle:"Things I Won't" : https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=site%3Anews.ycombinator.com%20%22things%20I%20won%27t%22&prmd=ivns&tbo=1&sa=X&num=100#q=site:news.ycombinator.com+intitle:%22things+I+won%27t%22 https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=site%3Anews.ycombinato... But it does not show parent's links. One more reason for a more explicit search engine.
  - chc 11y ago
    You mean like this? https://hn.algolia.com/?query=%22things%20I%20won%27t%22&sort=byPopularity&prefix&page=0&dateRange=all&type=story https://hn.algolia.com/?query=%22things%20I%20won%27t%22&sor...
lighttower 11y ago
ask about the free shipping. hilarious
pjc50 11y ago
Obligatory "you may also like" reccomendation: Ignition! by John D Clark ( http://www.sciencemadness.org/library/books/ignition.pdf http://www.sciencemadness.org/library/books/ignition.pdf ), which is an unofficial history of rocket fuel. A mixture of hard science and lab-exploding anecdotes.
- HCIdivision17 11y ago
  I really appreciate the link. Currently, Amazon has it available for sale for $20005.56 new or $2904.00 used (no typos there). Seems like the market-making bots have botched again... It's actually kinda hard to find - at least harder than I'd expect for such a well recommended book. Time to start rummaging through my local book stores :)
  - masklinn 11y ago
    Ignition! has been out of print for decades now, it was a short run and close to self-published (Rutgers University Press isn't exactly mass-market). It's possible that you'd find it at a bookstore but really doubtful, more likely to be found rummaging at book fairs or during estate sales.
    - Bjartr 11y ago
      And unfortunately if you ask Rutgers University Press about the status of Copyright on the work, they don't actually know who owns it, or so I read the last time Ignition! came up in discussion on HN.
mabbo 11y ago
"The sulfur chemistry of FOOF remains unexplored, so if you feel like whipping up a batch of Satan’s kimchi, go right ahead."
Kristine1975 11y ago
Has anybody mentioned dimethylmercury yet?
- Bjartr 11y ago
  There are articles on dimethylcadmium[1] and dimethylzinc[2] in the same series [1] http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2013/05/08/things_i_wont_work_with_dimethylcadmium http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2013/05/08/thi... [2] http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2009/10/23/things_i_wont_work_with_straight_dimethyl_zinc http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2009/10/23/thi...
tobltobs 11y ago
The part about Hangzhou is interesting. > But I do note that if you run the structure through SciFinder, it comes out with a most unexpected icon that indicates a commercial supplier. > That would be the Hangzhou Sage Chemical Company. They offer it in 100g, 500g, and 1 kilo amounts, which is interesting, because I don’t think a kilo of dioxygen difluoride has ever existed.
- dalke 11y ago
  The lesson is that some companies will offer to sell you something just to get your order. It doesn't cost much, or anything, to advertise. If you send a request, they are 1/2way to making a deal. Only then do they need to decide if they can actually make it, and do so profitably.
mchahn 11y ago
I used to work in a semiconductor processing facility many years ago. There were workers who worked with hydrofluoric acid at benches. That stuff was nasty. If it got on your skin it would rapidly dissolve your body down to the bone. They had their elbows attached to cords. If they jerked their arms back quickly they would be flooded with water from overhead. There were showers with pull cords along the wall that would dump a tremendous amount of water then the cord was pulled. I assume this ridiculous practice isn't used any more.
- totony 11y ago
  It technically goes through the skin and the gloves which is why it attacks bone. Water doesn't solve the problem so I am curious as to why their workspace would be like that, you need a CaCO3 paste if i remember correctly and then head to hospital.
  - mchahn 11y ago
    My memory could easily be wrong. It was 40 years ago. I've told the story so many times it could have "evolved" over the years. (grin) Maybe something other than water was dumped. You really have to be careful about technical details here on HN. Edit: And maybe water would make a difference before it started eating through the gloves, hence the elbow trick. The showers might have been for other situations.

73 points by CarolineW 11y ago

This appears to have a three year cycle on HN. Three years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5546450 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5546450 Six years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425

omginternets 11y ago
This is the first time I've seen it, and I quite enjoyed it.
- masklinn 11y ago
  If it's the first time you've seen it, I recommend going through the whole "Things I Won't Work With" archives[0]. They're a great read. "Sand Won't Save You This Time" is hilarious (from a safe distance) and where Lowe started hitting his stride. It will also (rightfully, it's fantastic) make you look for the Ignition! PDF, because it's not every day you read a paragraph introduced with: > It is, of course, extremely toxic, but that’s the least of the problem. then find out said introduction is 100% on the spot. [0] http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/category/things-i-wont-work-with http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/category/thing...
  - mstade 11y ago
    This stuff is hilarious! I know only basic high school chemistry, but I'm able to follow most of this at a sort of "I kind of get it" level – enough to get some seriously good laughs out of it. Thanks for this, I feel like someone just told me about the Yellowstone supervolcano for the first time!
  - spacehome 11y ago
    "Sand Won't Save You This Time" is the best one.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- CapitalistCartr 11y ago
  Yeah, its my favorite chemistry story.
- Malic 11y ago
  If you enjoy stories of Chemicals With Alarming Properties, then be sure to check out Charles Stross's short story, "A Tall Tail." (Very Big Grin) http://www.tor.com/2012/07/20/a-tall-tail/ http://www.tor.com/2012/07/20/a-tall-tail/
  - ashmud 11y ago
    I stumbled upon this MeFi discussion when I searched for "Atom City Number Nine." http://www.metafilter.com/118133/A-Tall-Tail http://www.metafilter.com/118133/A-Tall-Tail
- jtolmar 11y ago
  This is my favorite chemical that he's written about: http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/sand_wont_save_you_this_time http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/san...
ufmace 11y ago
Seen it before, still a fun read though. What else could you say about a substance that will instantly set ICE on fire?!
- ceejayoz 11y ago
  > What else could you say about a substance that will instantly set ICE on fire?! That's nothing! From the same series: > The compound also a stronger oxidizing agent than oxygen itself, which also puts it into rare territory. That means that it can potentially go on to “burn” things that you would normally consider already burnt to hell and gone, and a practical consequence of that is that it’ll start roaring reactions with things like bricks and asbestos tile. http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/sand_wont_save_you_this_time http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2008/02/26/san... Yes, chlorine trifluoride will set asbestos on fire.
wernercd 11y ago
Obligatory: https://xkcd.com/1053/ https://xkcd.com/1053/ Not everyone knows everything :)
- mikeash 11y ago
  I don't think that comment is criticizing the dupe, just mentioning it and providing links to earlier discussions.
- zodPod 11y ago
  I love the lesson in the alt text, "Saying 'what kind of an idiot doesn't know about the Yellowstone supervolcano' is so much more boring than telling someone about the Yellowstone supervolcano for the first time." It's so true and it really is how we should look at life! Not knocking the original commenter either, just putting this out there!
- tlrobinson 11y ago
  Still, it should have a "(2010)" in the title.
meanduck 11y ago
One more from same series. Things I Won’t Touch: Hydrofluoric Acid (2004) : https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10678571 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10678571 (81 points by networked 100 days ago | past | web | 63 comments) Google HN for intitle:"Things I Won't" : https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=site%3Anews.ycombinator.com%20%22things%20I%20won%27t%22&prmd=ivns&tbo=1&sa=X&num=100#q=site:news.ycombinator.com+intitle:%22things+I+won%27t%22 https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=site%3Anews.ycombinato... But it does not show parent's links. One more reason for a more explicit search engine.
- chc 11y ago
  You mean like this? https://hn.algolia.com/?query=%22things%20I%20won%27t%22&sort=byPopularity&prefix&page=0&dateRange=all&type=story https://hn.algolia.com/?query=%22things%20I%20won%27t%22&sor...

lighttower 11y ago

ask about the free shipping. hilarious

pjc50 11y ago

Obligatory "you may also like" reccomendation: Ignition! by John D Clark ( http://www.sciencemadness.org/library/books/ignition.pdf http://www.sciencemadness.org/library/books/ignition.pdf ), which is an unofficial history of rocket fuel. A mixture of hard science and lab-exploding anecdotes.

HCIdivision17 11y ago
I really appreciate the link. Currently, Amazon has it available for sale for $20005.56 new or $2904.00 used (no typos there). Seems like the market-making bots have botched again... It's actually kinda hard to find - at least harder than I'd expect for such a well recommended book. Time to start rummaging through my local book stores :)
- masklinn 11y ago
  Ignition! has been out of print for decades now, it was a short run and close to self-published (Rutgers University Press isn't exactly mass-market). It's possible that you'd find it at a bookstore but really doubtful, more likely to be found rummaging at book fairs or during estate sales.
  - Bjartr 11y ago
    And unfortunately if you ask Rutgers University Press about the status of Copyright on the work, they don't actually know who owns it, or so I read the last time Ignition! came up in discussion on HN.

mabbo 11y ago

"The sulfur chemistry of FOOF remains unexplored, so if you feel like whipping up a batch of Satan’s kimchi, go right ahead."

Kristine1975 11y ago

Has anybody mentioned dimethylmercury yet?

Bjartr 11y ago
There are articles on dimethylcadmium[1] and dimethylzinc[2] in the same series [1] http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2013/05/08/things_i_wont_work_with_dimethylcadmium http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2013/05/08/thi... [2] http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2009/10/23/things_i_wont_work_with_straight_dimethyl_zinc http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2009/10/23/thi...

tobltobs 11y ago

The part about Hangzhou is interesting. > But I do note that if you run the structure through SciFinder, it comes out with a most unexpected icon that indicates a commercial supplier. > That would be the Hangzhou Sage Chemical Company. They offer it in 100g, 500g, and 1 kilo amounts, which is interesting, because I don’t think a kilo of dioxygen difluoride has ever existed.

dalke 11y ago
The lesson is that some companies will offer to sell you something just to get your order. It doesn't cost much, or anything, to advertise. If you send a request, they are 1/2way to making a deal. Only then do they need to decide if they can actually make it, and do so profitably.

mchahn 11y ago

I used to work in a semiconductor processing facility many years ago. There were workers who worked with hydrofluoric acid at benches. That stuff was nasty. If it got on your skin it would rapidly dissolve your body down to the bone. They had their elbows attached to cords. If they jerked their arms back quickly they would be flooded with water from overhead. There were showers with pull cords along the wall that would dump a tremendous amount of water then the cord was pulled. I assume this ridiculous practice isn't used any more.

totony 11y ago
It technically goes through the skin and the gloves which is why it attacks bone. Water doesn't solve the problem so I am curious as to why their workspace would be like that, you need a CaCO3 paste if i remember correctly and then head to hospital.
- mchahn 11y ago
  My memory could easily be wrong. It was 40 years ago. I've told the story so many times it could have "evolved" over the years. (grin) Maybe something other than water was dumped. You really have to be careful about technical details here on HN. Edit: And maybe water would make a difference before it started eating through the gloves, hence the elbow trick. The showers might have been for other situations.