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I'm not an America, but I understand that there are always independent candidates. Maybe you don't notice them because they aren't buying so much advertising. T

by Nutmog 11y ago

I'm not an America, but I understand that there are always independent candidates. Maybe you don't notice them because they aren't buying so much advertising. Try voting according to your own research instead of what the paid advertisements tell you to. Many people who would support an independent presidential candidate decide not to because the thing they want the most, above all else, is to keep their pet enemy party out of power. They'll even vote against their own interests and politics to try to achieve that. Yet their pet enemy party (democrat or republican) always wins every now and then regardless. So it's a futile effort with no long term value.

madaxe_again 11y ago
This is the UK. Independent candidates tend to get nowhere fast. Main parties all oppose change. Greens oppose nuclear and have a weird political agenda bolted on to their environmental policies. Tell me about that realistic alternative again?
- Nutmog 11y ago
  Don't you currently have some power sharing with a new 3rd party (liberal democrats)? Besides that, what makes you think you can't for for a party that isn't "realistic"? Do you only want to vote for a party that will probably win? Then it's not really you voting on your own preference, you're instead acting as an amplifier for what other people want. It's a misconception people have assuming their vote is wasted on a minor candidate and somehow contributes to the success of a major one. A single person's vote is negligible no matter who they vote for. When all the people who want candidate X vote for candidate Y instead, then there's a failure of the system.
  - madaxe_again 11y ago
    No, that ended - purely Conservative government now. The electoral system here is really broken, from the gerrymandered constituencies to the FPTP voting system. On the note of FPTP we had a referendum to vote for STV - and propaganda successfully convinced the voters to stick with broken but known. Part of the reason I am so sure we will end up voting to leave the EU. Independent candidates very occasionally win a seat but the deck is so severely stacked against them they may as well not exist. UKIP, who I do not support, are the most successful "outsider" party that has arisen in recent years - and despite a substantial share of the popular vote were decimated in the election. We are seeing a rise in voting for outsider candidates, but at the current scale it actually helps the incumbent powers, as the opposition vote ends up fragmented. If we want to save humanity we may need to completely rethink governance, as the current incestuous relationship between powerful governments and powerful interests is literally killing us.

by Nutmog 11y ago

madaxe_again 11y ago

This is the UK. Independent candidates tend to get nowhere fast. Main parties all oppose change. Greens oppose nuclear and have a weird political agenda bolted on to their environmental policies. Tell me about that realistic alternative again?

Nutmog 11y ago
Don't you currently have some power sharing with a new 3rd party (liberal democrats)? Besides that, what makes you think you can't for for a party that isn't "realistic"? Do you only want to vote for a party that will probably win? Then it's not really you voting on your own preference, you're instead acting as an amplifier for what other people want. It's a misconception people have assuming their vote is wasted on a minor candidate and somehow contributes to the success of a major one. A single person's vote is negligible no matter who they vote for. When all the people who want candidate X vote for candidate Y instead, then there's a failure of the system.
- madaxe_again 11y ago
  No, that ended - purely Conservative government now. The electoral system here is really broken, from the gerrymandered constituencies to the FPTP voting system. On the note of FPTP we had a referendum to vote for STV - and propaganda successfully convinced the voters to stick with broken but known. Part of the reason I am so sure we will end up voting to leave the EU. Independent candidates very occasionally win a seat but the deck is so severely stacked against them they may as well not exist. UKIP, who I do not support, are the most successful "outsider" party that has arisen in recent years - and despite a substantial share of the popular vote were decimated in the election. We are seeing a rise in voting for outsider candidates, but at the current scale it actually helps the incumbent powers, as the opposition vote ends up fragmented. If we want to save humanity we may need to completely rethink governance, as the current incestuous relationship between powerful governments and powerful interests is literally killing us.