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> I've been giving it some thought. When I was learning to play Go as a teenager in China, I followed a fairly standard, classical learning path. First I learne
by jonahx 11y ago
> I've been giving it some thought. When I was learning to play Go as a teenager in China, I followed a fairly standard, classical learning path. First I learned the rules, then progressively I learn the more abstract theories and tactics. Many of these theories, as I see them now, draw analogies from the physical world, and are used as tools to hide the underlying complexity (chunking), and enable the players to think at a higher level.
The excellent point you're making applies in general to nearly every type of human thinking.
The way we think about other people, our intuitions about probabilities, our predictions about politics, and so on -- all are based on our peculiarly effective, yet woefully approximate, analogy based reasoning.
It shouldn't be surprising in the least when commonly accepted "expert" heuristics are proved wrong by AIs that actually search the space of possibilities with orders of magnitude more depth than we can. What's surprising -- and I think still a mystery -- is how human heuristics are able to perform so well to begin with.
I'm not a Go player, but I saw this same phenomenon as poker bots have surpassed humans in ability. As with AlphaGo, they make plays that fly in the face of years of "expert" wisdom. Of course, as with any revolutionary thinking, some of the new strategies are "obvious" in hindsight, and experts now use them. Others seem to require the computational precision of a computer to be effective in practice, and so can't be co-opted. That is, we can't extract a new human-compatible "heuristic" from them -- the complexity is just irreducible.
- netheril96 11y ago> all are based on our peculiarly effective They are peculiarly effective only because of lack of comparison. Humans have been the most intelligent species on this planet for millennia, where no other species come even close. We don't know how ineffective those strategies are seen by a more advanced species. Well, until now.
- jonahx 11y agoThis is a good point. I was coming from the point of view that we've had powerful computers for a while, and yet humans were still dominating them, at least until recently, in games like Go, poker, and many visual and language tasks. Of course, the counterpoint could be that it's only the case because humans, with their laughable reasoning abilities, are the ones programming those computers.
- apag 11y agoIt was not a good point. AlphaGo can’t decide that it’s bored and go skydiving. Humans aren’t merely capable of playing Go. And when they do it, they can also pace around the table, and drink something, all at the same time, on a ridiculously low energy budget. Or they can decide never to learn Go in the first place but to master an equally difficult other discipline. They continuously decide what out of all of this to do at any given moment. AlphaGo was built by humans, for a purpose selected by humans, out of algorithms designed by humans. It is not a more advanced species. It’s not even a general intelligence. Your own original point was much better than the one made in response.