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It is certainly true that a common political tactic is to attempt to convince people that there was some time in the past when they were better off than today.

It is certainly true that a common political tactic is to attempt to convince people that there was some time in the past when they were better off than today. Remarkably, people are far more willing to believe this (even in the face of all the data which inevitably shows it isn't true - in the UK we've been on a near-vertical climb for a century with even the recent economic messes being little more than a quiver), than they are willing to believe that things could be made better in the future. There are plenty of places in the world where living standards are low. The UK is not one of them. If you live here, even if you are the poorest person in the country, you are rich beyond the dreams of half the population of the world. I'm not buying into any of this "life is terrible, you should give me more" meme.

motters 11y ago
"If you live here, even if you are the poorest person in the country, you are rich beyond the dreams of half the population of the world" Really? Have you ever been in The Work Programme? Have you ever visited a food bank? Have you ever had neighbours pleading with you for food for their children because they have no money? You can prefer to live inside of a cosy bubble of ignorance if you wish, but this is the UK in 2016.
- asuffield 11y ago
  The answer to all of your questions is approximately yes (names vary). I've also done a lot of work to address these problems when they come up, and I've read the data on the current state of the economy. How many of these things have you done? Have you ever had people pleading with you for food/money and, instead of berating people on the internet, got them into the drugs treatment programme that they desperately needed? Have you ever got people to correctly file appeals when the jobcentre made a mistake and didn't give them the money they were entitled to? Have you ever taught people the skills they need to be productive members of society and provide for themselves? Because I've also done all of those things on multiple occasions, and I think I have a much better sense of the problems that we face than you do. I also think that your refusal to admit these are the real problems and put work into fixing them is one of the major reasons why we still have them. It's very easy to say "I want more, it's not fair", and much harder to figure out why things aren't working when there's plenty for everybody and get something done about that.
ZeroGravitas 11y ago
So, this is true, and after acknowledging this. I find it very hard to buy into the stuff about the 1%, because to the rest of the world I am (and my kids are) the 1%. However, having said that, I do notice the "shut up, you're doing better than before" argument is only ever used on those at the bottom of the heap asking for more equality. No one ever seems to use it to respond to people complaining about progressive tax rates on the wealthy for example, despite it being even more true for them.
- asuffield 11y ago
  I've dug into this in more detail in some past political events, and I've always found that the people making the strongest "there should be more for me" demands had incomes above the median. I never had much sympathy for them, and I do call them on it when I see them. I can't really do it here, unless people in this thread would care to share what they earn.

motters 11y ago

"If you live here, even if you are the poorest person in the country, you are rich beyond the dreams of half the population of the world" Really? Have you ever been in The Work Programme? Have you ever visited a food bank? Have you ever had neighbours pleading with you for food for their children because they have no money? You can prefer to live inside of a cosy bubble of ignorance if you wish, but this is the UK in 2016.

asuffield 11y ago
The answer to all of your questions is approximately yes (names vary). I've also done a lot of work to address these problems when they come up, and I've read the data on the current state of the economy. How many of these things have you done? Have you ever had people pleading with you for food/money and, instead of berating people on the internet, got them into the drugs treatment programme that they desperately needed? Have you ever got people to correctly file appeals when the jobcentre made a mistake and didn't give them the money they were entitled to? Have you ever taught people the skills they need to be productive members of society and provide for themselves? Because I've also done all of those things on multiple occasions, and I think I have a much better sense of the problems that we face than you do. I also think that your refusal to admit these are the real problems and put work into fixing them is one of the major reasons why we still have them. It's very easy to say "I want more, it's not fair", and much harder to figure out why things aren't working when there's plenty for everybody and get something done about that.

ZeroGravitas 11y ago

So, this is true, and after acknowledging this. I find it very hard to buy into the stuff about the 1%, because to the rest of the world I am (and my kids are) the 1%. However, having said that, I do notice the "shut up, you're doing better than before" argument is only ever used on those at the bottom of the heap asking for more equality. No one ever seems to use it to respond to people complaining about progressive tax rates on the wealthy for example, despite it being even more true for them.

asuffield 11y ago
I've dug into this in more detail in some past political events, and I've always found that the people making the strongest "there should be more for me" demands had incomes above the median. I never had much sympathy for them, and I do call them on it when I see them. I can't really do it here, unless people in this thread would care to share what they earn.