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> Any thoughts on why we, a subset of the population that tends to be defined by priding itself on its intelligence and rationality, can be so egregiously head-
by joslin01 11y ago
> Any thoughts on why we, a subset of the population that tends to be defined by priding itself on its intelligence and rationality, can be so egregiously head-up-its-own-ass like this?
Hi, I think about this sort of thing often and have come to the personal conclusion that humans' chief vice is stubbornness. Please allow me to explain because the stubbornness is more of an effect than a cause.
Humans couple identity & belief very tightly. For example, people say things like "I am Republican", which doesn't imply that there is a subspecies of humans called Republican as an alien might think, but rather that they generally believe in the republican party's views. This is the start of it.
Somewhere along the line of growing up, identity becomes a very big deal and puberty hits you with "Shutup mom & dad, I believe in [this] stuff cause that's who I am!" This is actually rather healthy as the teenager is becoming autonomous and self-reliant, but is accompanied by the damaging effect of My Beliefs = Who I am. For a teenager that does not know not to believe in self-debilitating thoughts, they can quickly wind up on the road down to depression.
Furthermore in this world, specialness is generally coveted. A lot of the nerds around here might know Enders Game in which a kid kills a civilization that is arguably more peaceful than our own -- the society worked like a bee hive and did not understand personal dogmas or behavior that centered around the individual. While it's scary to imagine a queen bee ruling over all of us, there's still something to be said about if we focused on working together.
However, that's not this world so what you end up with is people equating their specialness (and therefore value, and therefore self-value, and therefore self-esteem) with their identity, which is defined by their beliefs & physical appearance. If they only could stop caring so much about special, it wouldn't matter if you were right or wrong because you would be on a natural hunt for goodness and knowledge in all its forms. Yet, from the competition to be special comes this behavior.
It's not that people want to be stubborn, but in linking their identity with their belief & thought, they now feel literally attacked if they are wrong. Nerds, who many already suffer with self-esteem issues, thus feel good to be a mental champion because it reinvigorates their self-esteem.
For some of us, we hold our identity in spirit and therefore feel detached from the human existence and do not let it bind us in this manner. I'm not perfect and saying everyone should follow me, but generally speaking, I do believe if people truly evaluated where they get their feelings of self-esteem from, they might be a little startled to see how much of it revolves around petty things like the need to be right.
- joepvd 11y agoInteresting and well formulated words that are worth being said. But you are addressing (western?) humanity in general, and not the nerd group GP was wondering about. Do you see an emprical link between nerds and stubborness as GP does? If so, I would be interested in your thoughts.
- joslin01 11y agoDo you think nerds is a special subset of humans? ;) Believe me, it's practically the same conversations on HN as a bunch of guys at the bar arguing over who the best player is in the NFL. Nerds are generally proud of their mental dexterity and cunningness, so this is what they feel defines them. In regular life, they generally are the smartest in a room, so overtime they learn to teach themselves: well hey, I might not be the coolest or X, but everyone knows I'm really smart so I'm gonna be that. They learn how to be the "alpha intelligence" so to speak, and quickly dismiss foolish ideas. This ensures their status as alpha and also increases their pride. How could you believe that?! they think to themselves and chuckle with a hint (or more) of schadenfreude. Now they bring all this behavior to HN, but HN has some pretty smart people so they are a bit more tame. However, you'll always see in "New Product Released" something along these lines: "Well sure, it's great, but X, Y, Z." This is them just doing what they know how to do best -- poke holes. Also, this is HN and not only is it nerds, but hackers. Hackers are fully trained and employed at being master logicians. We are paid at work to poke holes. After all, it's a real waste of time to code it X way when you shoulda just had the foresight to know Y was going to be a problem! To try and roughly summarize these rough thoughts: -- Nerds link their intelligence to their identity more strongly than others -- Nerds enjoy this kind of conversation because it's stimulating. It's the thrill of the battle especially when one wins it. -- Nerds might spend too much time in this mode of conversation and just learn to talk that way. Some are really not trying to be jerks at all, but just feel that's the way you talk.
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- nefitty 11y ago