3 ms·

"European" is a myth. It doesn't mean anything. It means what is convenient politically and economically. Sweden and Spain don't have that much in common. If Si

by msvan 11y ago

"European" is a myth. It doesn't mean anything. It means what is convenient politically and economically. Sweden and Spain don't have that much in common. If Silicon Valley were in Turkey, you'd love to call them European.

acchow 11y ago
> If Silicon Valley were in Turkey, you'd love to call them European The Bay Area isn't even considered American by Americans. They call us anti-American with our heathen, libertarian ways and alien sanctuary laws. And yet here were are, paying American taxes and anxiously following the presidential primaries.
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  > The Bay Area isn't even considered American by Americans. They call us anti-American with our heathen, libertarian ways and alien sanctuary laws. The Bay Area isn't exactly known for "libertarian ways", the issue of whether or not is considered American aside.
Grishnakh 11y ago
Turkey could never have something like Silicon Valley. Islamic culture is far too repressive for something like that to organically grow; SV was the product of a culture which rewarded individualism and free thinking, which is the antithesis of Islamic culture. There's a reason SV is located in California, and not Alabama or Mississippi, let alone the middle east. Turkey is NOT European, and it's not about geography so much as it's about culture. Spain is far more similar to Sweden than it is Turkey. Now, if Istanbul declared independence from the rest of the country which elected Erdogan, then maybe you could argue that it deserves to be in the EU as much as other places like Kosovo or Serbia. But Turkey as a whole belongs in the EU about as much as Iraq or Saudi Arabia.
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  > SV was the product of a culture which rewarded individualism and free thinking, which is the antithesis of Islamic culture. Its may be the antithesis of the reactionary Islamism which is currently ascendant in much of the Islamic world, but that's something of contrary to the historical culture of many parts of the Islamic world (whether there is such a thing as a historical "Islamic culture" rather than the very diverse cultures of various regions where Islam has been found is a different debate.) Not that Silicon Valley was really the product of a culture that rewarded individualism and free thinking. Its the product of a focus on defense and related national prestige investments, and a culture that reward success. Neither of which is foreign to any part of the Islamic world. (To the extent that a culture of individualism that rewarded free thinking evolved in the region, it was a product of the focus on success as the tech hub developed, not the reason the tech hub developed.) > There's a reason SV is located in California, and not Alabama or Mississippi, let alone the middle east. Yeah, and its mostly because of the military-industrial complex, not local culture (the technology firms gathered around the nucleus of Moffet Field NAS, which, when certain naval operations moved out, made it an attractive place for NACA -- which became NASA -- to locate operations, which continued attracting tech firms.)

by msvan 11y ago

acchow 11y ago

> If Silicon Valley were in Turkey, you'd love to call them European The Bay Area isn't even considered American by Americans. They call us anti-American with our heathen, libertarian ways and alien sanctuary laws. And yet here were are, paying American taxes and anxiously following the presidential primaries.

dragonwriter 11y ago
> The Bay Area isn't even considered American by Americans. They call us anti-American with our heathen, libertarian ways and alien sanctuary laws. The Bay Area isn't exactly known for "libertarian ways", the issue of whether or not is considered American aside.

Grishnakh 11y ago

Turkey could never have something like Silicon Valley. Islamic culture is far too repressive for something like that to organically grow; SV was the product of a culture which rewarded individualism and free thinking, which is the antithesis of Islamic culture. There's a reason SV is located in California, and not Alabama or Mississippi, let alone the middle east. Turkey is NOT European, and it's not about geography so much as it's about culture. Spain is far more similar to Sweden than it is Turkey. Now, if Istanbul declared independence from the rest of the country which elected Erdogan, then maybe you could argue that it deserves to be in the EU as much as other places like Kosovo or Serbia. But Turkey as a whole belongs in the EU about as much as Iraq or Saudi Arabia.

dragonwriter 11y ago
> SV was the product of a culture which rewarded individualism and free thinking, which is the antithesis of Islamic culture. Its may be the antithesis of the reactionary Islamism which is currently ascendant in much of the Islamic world, but that's something of contrary to the historical culture of many parts of the Islamic world (whether there is such a thing as a historical "Islamic culture" rather than the very diverse cultures of various regions where Islam has been found is a different debate.) Not that Silicon Valley was really the product of a culture that rewarded individualism and free thinking. Its the product of a focus on defense and related national prestige investments, and a culture that reward success. Neither of which is foreign to any part of the Islamic world. (To the extent that a culture of individualism that rewarded free thinking evolved in the region, it was a product of the focus on success as the tech hub developed, not the reason the tech hub developed.) > There's a reason SV is located in California, and not Alabama or Mississippi, let alone the middle east. Yeah, and its mostly because of the military-industrial complex, not local culture (the technology firms gathered around the nucleus of Moffet Field NAS, which, when certain naval operations moved out, made it an attractive place for NACA -- which became NASA -- to locate operations, which continued attracting tech firms.)