8 ms·

I'm a Gen Y living in Sydney - I've been planning to leave for a while because of the adverse conditions for young people here. Rent is very high, everything i

I'm a Gen Y living in Sydney - I've been planning to leave for a while because of the adverse conditions for young people here. Rent is very high, everything is expensive, you get fines all the time for silly stuff like parking your car facing the 'wrong' way, staying in a parking spot for 10 minutes too long or not waiting for a full '3 seconds' at a stop sign, etc... Also, in some parks, you can get fined for having a picnic without a permit. I had to pay a $300 traffic fine for driving in a 'bus-only lane' once. It's a police state. Also, the tax system is complicated and favours people who own houses (In Australia, you get tax deductions if you lose money on a rental property which you own). There are actually a lot of (older) people in Australia who own like 10+ houses (with 10 mortgages) and rent them out to young people and get huge tax deductions (and capital growth). Older people own everything. To make it worse, the older generation in Australia doesn't really want to invest in technology - They prefer just investing their money into real estate (which has been growing an an impressive rate year-over-year for the past 20 years or so). The idea of 'investing in yourself' is mostly a foreign concept in Australia - The only thing worthwhile investing in is a block of land with bricks and concrete on top. There are many people who dropped out of school, became construction workers and bought a house on a mortgage and are now wealthier than most university-educated students thanks to the insane real-estate growth and labour shortage (due in part to tough immigration laws). Some recent changes in laws suggest that conditions might be improving but it's too late for me. I'm looking forward to living in San Francisco - Yes the rent will also be high; but at least it seems that everything else is cheaper, taxes are lower and it's generally a good place to build a career in technology.

tunichtgut 11y ago
My advise is dont leave for germany. Here you will be sucked dry by the social security payments and taxes for old pp, too. Im planning long term to move into the US with mountain states and midwest as the most favored locations.
- patrickk 11y ago
  Not sure I agree. Good things about Germany: - Great job opportunities, even if you only speak English (less jobs than if you speak German, but with EU orgs, international companies, etc its possible) - Rent is not cheap in the more attractive cities with good jobs (Hamburg, Frankfurt and Munich), but it's not that expensive either compared to say Paris or London - No out-of-control housing market, as Germans don't have the same lust for owning property and property speculation that you see in much of the English speaking world - Cost of living (food, drink) compared to wages is really good, compared to much of Europe - Amazing cheap beer, great festival culture. The food here is seriously underrated, Schweinbraten, etc is amazing. Yes it's not pretentious like e.g. some French food, but it's no-nonsense and delicious, especially in Bavaria. Even the weather compared to the British Isles is decent. - Low cost university - A culture of paying for things upfront (e.g. Energiewiende and pensions for old population), hence high taxes but not kicking the can down the road is obviously the best thing in the long run (although it's not much comfort to young workers) - Soaks up talent from the rest of Europe, you can move with no visa from other EU countries Regarding taxes, t's possible to get a contracting job, where you are paid as a freelancer and certain social contributions are waived for a period of time. I also know that's it's possible to earn as a contractor, trading as a company from another EU country (earn German wages, pay Greek/Maltese/Irish corp taxes). You need a good tax advisor, but I've seen first hand that it's possible. Source: expat working in Germany.
elthran 11y ago
>I had to pay a $300 traffic fine for driving in a 'bus-only lane' once I wouldn't say that's evidence of a police state - plenty of other countries have bus lanes, and you'll be fined for driving in them - would you expect otherwise?
- mikeash 11y ago
  I'd certainly expect a fine, but $300 seems way excessive. On the other hand, so does the phrase "police state."
  - elthran 11y ago
    On the topic of excessive fines - If a fine is meant as a deterrent, surely a large, but not plainly ridiculous fine is a significant deterrent? I think they need to be small enough that people can feasibly pay them, but large enough that they can't just shrug it off
    - mikeash 11y ago
      The problem is that one man's "shrug it off" is another man's "we can't afford to eat this month." And while you want to deter people, it's unfair to punish someone severely for an innocent mistake that doesn't hurt anybody. There was a lot of reporting on this sort of thing in the St. Louis area following recent events in Ferguson. Poor people get ticketed for some minor violation. They can't afford the fine when it comes due. The fine snowballs with late fees and court costs, and soon they're facing jail time because they committed some minor infraction, like failing to signal a turn, that half the people on the road commit every day. I think the proper answer is to adjust fines according to the person's income. It's ridiculous to me that a person making $200,000/year will pay the same fine for speeding as someone working minimum wage. Or, really, that the person working minimum wage will likely pay more, because the fees compound if you can't pay right away.
      - jwhitlark 11y ago
        I think it was Sweden that scales fines based on annual income.
dalke 11y ago
> parking your car facing the 'wrong' way In the US you get fines for that too. (I learned this after I moved from places without curbs, where everyone parks on the verge rather than the street, to a town with curbs and therefore on-street parking.) > staying in a parking spot for 10 minutes too long Also in the US. > I'm looking forward to living in San Francisco Do you think the parking will be easier and driving will incur fewer fines?
- theandrewbailey 11y ago
  What makes him think SF rents are the same? http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=United+States&country2=Australia&city1=San+Francisco%2C+CA&city2=Sydney&tracking=getDispatchComparison http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?coun...
jld89 11y ago
Then don't leave for France either, here you would get fines for all those violations. And some would get your points substracted. (In France you have 12 Driver's license points. At 0 your license is revoked.)
theandrewbailey 11y ago
Bus lanes are pretty well marked where I live. It's especially evident when the street is marked as 'one way', but there's clearly a single lane marked otherwise: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4437917,-79.9556978,3a,79.6y,107.56h,91.55t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQITQULm578Q3PLd5Ok90TA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4437917,-79.9556978,3a,79.6y... On the parkway, I've seen people use the exit specifically designated for buses that leads to a busway. I've seen two pull in as I went by once! If they charged $300 each time (and posted it), that would stop pretty fast. They are usually pretty nice cars, so I imagine that those are douche bag executives that don't give a damn.
masonic 11y ago
parking your car facing the 'wrong' way ... leaves conclusive evidence of two moving violations (driving on the wrong side of the street twice). You could do worse than one parking ticket.

tunichtgut 11y ago

My advise is dont leave for germany. Here you will be sucked dry by the social security payments and taxes for old pp, too. Im planning long term to move into the US with mountain states and midwest as the most favored locations.

patrickk 11y ago
Not sure I agree. Good things about Germany: - Great job opportunities, even if you only speak English (less jobs than if you speak German, but with EU orgs, international companies, etc its possible) - Rent is not cheap in the more attractive cities with good jobs (Hamburg, Frankfurt and Munich), but it's not that expensive either compared to say Paris or London - No out-of-control housing market, as Germans don't have the same lust for owning property and property speculation that you see in much of the English speaking world - Cost of living (food, drink) compared to wages is really good, compared to much of Europe - Amazing cheap beer, great festival culture. The food here is seriously underrated, Schweinbraten, etc is amazing. Yes it's not pretentious like e.g. some French food, but it's no-nonsense and delicious, especially in Bavaria. Even the weather compared to the British Isles is decent. - Low cost university - A culture of paying for things upfront (e.g. Energiewiende and pensions for old population), hence high taxes but not kicking the can down the road is obviously the best thing in the long run (although it's not much comfort to young workers) - Soaks up talent from the rest of Europe, you can move with no visa from other EU countries Regarding taxes, t's possible to get a contracting job, where you are paid as a freelancer and certain social contributions are waived for a period of time. I also know that's it's possible to earn as a contractor, trading as a company from another EU country (earn German wages, pay Greek/Maltese/Irish corp taxes). You need a good tax advisor, but I've seen first hand that it's possible. Source: expat working in Germany.

elthran 11y ago

>I had to pay a $300 traffic fine for driving in a 'bus-only lane' once I wouldn't say that's evidence of a police state - plenty of other countries have bus lanes, and you'll be fined for driving in them - would you expect otherwise?

mikeash 11y ago
I'd certainly expect a fine, but $300 seems way excessive. On the other hand, so does the phrase "police state."
- elthran 11y ago
  On the topic of excessive fines - If a fine is meant as a deterrent, surely a large, but not plainly ridiculous fine is a significant deterrent? I think they need to be small enough that people can feasibly pay them, but large enough that they can't just shrug it off
  - mikeash 11y ago
    The problem is that one man's "shrug it off" is another man's "we can't afford to eat this month." And while you want to deter people, it's unfair to punish someone severely for an innocent mistake that doesn't hurt anybody. There was a lot of reporting on this sort of thing in the St. Louis area following recent events in Ferguson. Poor people get ticketed for some minor violation. They can't afford the fine when it comes due. The fine snowballs with late fees and court costs, and soon they're facing jail time because they committed some minor infraction, like failing to signal a turn, that half the people on the road commit every day. I think the proper answer is to adjust fines according to the person's income. It's ridiculous to me that a person making $200,000/year will pay the same fine for speeding as someone working minimum wage. Or, really, that the person working minimum wage will likely pay more, because the fees compound if you can't pay right away.
    - jwhitlark 11y ago
      I think it was Sweden that scales fines based on annual income.

dalke 11y ago

> parking your car facing the 'wrong' way In the US you get fines for that too. (I learned this after I moved from places without curbs, where everyone parks on the verge rather than the street, to a town with curbs and therefore on-street parking.) > staying in a parking spot for 10 minutes too long Also in the US. > I'm looking forward to living in San Francisco Do you think the parking will be easier and driving will incur fewer fines?

theandrewbailey 11y ago
What makes him think SF rents are the same? http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=United+States&country2=Australia&city1=San+Francisco%2C+CA&city2=Sydney&tracking=getDispatchComparison http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?coun...

jld89 11y ago

Then don't leave for France either, here you would get fines for all those violations. And some would get your points substracted. (In France you have 12 Driver's license points. At 0 your license is revoked.)

theandrewbailey 11y ago

Bus lanes are pretty well marked where I live. It's especially evident when the street is marked as 'one way', but there's clearly a single lane marked otherwise: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4437917,-79.9556978,3a,79.6y,107.56h,91.55t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQITQULm578Q3PLd5Ok90TA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4437917,-79.9556978,3a,79.6y... On the parkway, I've seen people use the exit specifically designated for buses that leads to a busway. I've seen two pull in as I went by once! If they charged $300 each time (and posted it), that would stop pretty fast. They are usually pretty nice cars, so I imagine that those are douche bag executives that don't give a damn.

masonic 11y ago

parking your car facing the 'wrong' way ... leaves conclusive evidence of two moving violations (driving on the wrong side of the street twice). You could do worse than one parking ticket.