5 ms·

This story struck a nerve because (in hindsight) I saw the same thing happening to my brother when he was about 19. He was suddenly interested in astrology, rei

This story struck a nerve because (in hindsight) I saw the same thing happening to my brother when he was about 19. He was suddenly interested in astrology, reiki, "tachyon energy disks", epiphanies, angels and demons, the vibrations of the universe. At the time I thought it was a phase. My mother was always talking (tongue-in-cheek?) about her "parking angel" and burning incense, so I thought he had just picked up that part of her personality. Turns out he had (and still has, many years later) schizophrenia so he was genuinely using his considerable intelligence to try and make sense of what he saw, heard and felt, drawing on any "truth" he could find. It really put me off religion and spirituality for a very long time. If these concepts weren't out there and accepted by so many people, maybe he would have been diagnosed and treated sooner and be in a better place today. I don't know. These days I do think some amount of religion/spirituality is positive, and I think in total it makes the world a better place, but if I ever felt that kind of epiphany personally I know I would head straight to the nearest mental hospital.

spaceisballer 11y ago
This article describes my brother (minus the programming experience). The hard thing is you can never make someone get help if they aren't a threat to themselves or others. Being an all around a-hole isn't sufficient to make someone admit themselves to a facility (no matter the run ins with police or the diagnosis). He's lucky he went to a facility and followed through. My brother ended up in one and I felt like I talked him into staying. Then he calls me to try and get me to lie to his social worker. Then the social worker calls me and I don't lie (he wasn't staying with me and he didn't have a job). Social worker listens but then a few days later he's out. My only hope is that now that he went out to California the system out there can make him get help.
- WiseWeasel 11y ago
  I wouldn't hold up California as an exemplar of a mental health safety net, or expect too much from the services in place in this state. A significant population walking the streets loudly rambling nonsense is largely treated as a curiosity rather than in need of help. If anything, the culture embraces mental health issues.
jdietrich 11y ago
>It really put me off religion and spirituality for a very long time. If these concepts weren't out there and accepted by so many people, maybe he would have been diagnosed and treated sooner and be in a better place today. I don't know. I'm a staunch skeptic, but I don't think there's a causal link. People suffering from psychosis invariably find something in their environment to create a contextual frame for their experiences. For example, paranoia can manifest itself as a wide range of experiences. Someone living in rural Nigeria might describe being possessed by evil spirits, someone living in 1950s America might describe being followed by KGB agents, a European Muslim in the present day might describe being targeted by spy satellites and drones. After the release of the movie The Truman Show, psychiatrists saw a sudden emergence of patients who believed they were living in a reality TV show. https://aeon.co/essays/a-culture-of-hyper-reality-made-paranoid-delusions-true https://aeon.co/essays/a-culture-of-hyper-reality-made-paran... http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/09/16/unreality-star http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/09/16/unreality-star http://news.stanford.edu/news/2014/july/voices-culture-luhrmann-071614.html http://news.stanford.edu/news/2014/july/voices-culture-luhrm... http://www.psychosocial.com/IJPR_10/Cultural_Demographic_Factors_of_Sz_Russo.html http://www.psychosocial.com/IJPR_10/Cultural_Demographic_Fac... http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/193/2/168 http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/193/2/168
kruhft 11y ago
This is an interesting read on the difference of views between the Western and African views of 'mental illness' from an African (Witch) Doctor after visiting some western mental hospitals: http://www.wakingtimes.com/2014/08/22/shaman-sees-mental-hospital/ tl;dr: Most of what we view as mental illness they view as the birth or awakening of a 'healer' and should be treated that way for proper acceptance of the person into society and eventual recoverey.
- kenneth_reitz 11y ago
  Yeah, I read that article a lot.
  - makmanalp 11y ago
    And what was your conclusion on it, now that you had an experience and came out of it safe and sound? I don't have any serious mental issues, but the thought of having any and the stigma around them honestly terrifies me. (And reading stories like yours does the opposite) And so while I'm not behind the woo woo of the article, I do like the gentler approach to treating the ill. If you're mentally ill, "oh weird, that's happening to me" seems like a better state of mind to be in than to be terrified, ashamed and dealing with the petty indignities of being a patient at a clinic. Though I guess modern mental health clinics are much more human than they used to be. Thoughts?
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- md224 11y ago
  Interesting that a patient positively responded to the Shamanic approach. Anecdotal evidence, but it makes you wonder.
anaximander 11y ago
> ... if I ever felt that kind of epiphany personally I know I would head straight to the nearest mental hospital. I can't say that you're wrong, but I would also ask you to consider that your sane and reasonable state of mind that's saying this now, is not the same state of mind that believes these delusions. What may seem right now to be a very clear and easy decision may be the last thing you would even consider in another mental state.
- tominous 11y ago
  Oh absolutely. That's why I've tried to make that decision ahead of time and plan the details so that it's almost an automatic trigger, hopefully before all insight is lost. It's hard because I'm a very independent, stubborn person who never takes anyone else's word for anything. I can't think of much worse than being locked up, forced drugs and being told what to think, like 1984. But losing touch with reality and effectively abandoning my family and friends would be worse. EDIT: I'm not saying that drugs are a panacea, BUT.. I believe mental illness often has a chemical/biological origin, which over time accumulates into physical, psychological and social damage. I think appropriate low-dose treatment at an early stage has the potential to limit this damage while avoiding the worst side-effects of higher doses.

spaceisballer 11y ago

This article describes my brother (minus the programming experience). The hard thing is you can never make someone get help if they aren't a threat to themselves or others. Being an all around a-hole isn't sufficient to make someone admit themselves to a facility (no matter the run ins with police or the diagnosis). He's lucky he went to a facility and followed through. My brother ended up in one and I felt like I talked him into staying. Then he calls me to try and get me to lie to his social worker. Then the social worker calls me and I don't lie (he wasn't staying with me and he didn't have a job). Social worker listens but then a few days later he's out. My only hope is that now that he went out to California the system out there can make him get help.

WiseWeasel 11y ago
I wouldn't hold up California as an exemplar of a mental health safety net, or expect too much from the services in place in this state. A significant population walking the streets loudly rambling nonsense is largely treated as a curiosity rather than in need of help. If anything, the culture embraces mental health issues.

jdietrich 11y ago

>It really put me off religion and spirituality for a very long time. If these concepts weren't out there and accepted by so many people, maybe he would have been diagnosed and treated sooner and be in a better place today. I don't know. I'm a staunch skeptic, but I don't think there's a causal link. People suffering from psychosis invariably find something in their environment to create a contextual frame for their experiences. For example, paranoia can manifest itself as a wide range of experiences. Someone living in rural Nigeria might describe being possessed by evil spirits, someone living in 1950s America might describe being followed by KGB agents, a European Muslim in the present day might describe being targeted by spy satellites and drones. After the release of the movie The Truman Show, psychiatrists saw a sudden emergence of patients who believed they were living in a reality TV show. https://aeon.co/essays/a-culture-of-hyper-reality-made-paranoid-delusions-true https://aeon.co/essays/a-culture-of-hyper-reality-made-paran... http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/09/16/unreality-star http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/09/16/unreality-star http://news.stanford.edu/news/2014/july/voices-culture-luhrmann-071614.html http://news.stanford.edu/news/2014/july/voices-culture-luhrm... http://www.psychosocial.com/IJPR_10/Cultural_Demographic_Factors_of_Sz_Russo.html http://www.psychosocial.com/IJPR_10/Cultural_Demographic_Fac... http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/193/2/168 http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/193/2/168

kruhft 11y ago

This is an interesting read on the difference of views between the Western and African views of 'mental illness' from an African (Witch) Doctor after visiting some western mental hospitals: http://www.wakingtimes.com/2014/08/22/shaman-sees-mental-hospital/ tl;dr: Most of what we view as mental illness they view as the birth or awakening of a 'healer' and should be treated that way for proper acceptance of the person into society and eventual recoverey.

kenneth_reitz 11y ago
Yeah, I read that article a lot.
- makmanalp 11y ago
  And what was your conclusion on it, now that you had an experience and came out of it safe and sound? I don't have any serious mental issues, but the thought of having any and the stigma around them honestly terrifies me. (And reading stories like yours does the opposite) And so while I'm not behind the woo woo of the article, I do like the gentler approach to treating the ill. If you're mentally ill, "oh weird, that's happening to me" seems like a better state of mind to be in than to be terrified, ashamed and dealing with the petty indignities of being a patient at a clinic. Though I guess modern mental health clinics are much more human than they used to be. Thoughts?
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md224 11y ago
Interesting that a patient positively responded to the Shamanic approach. Anecdotal evidence, but it makes you wonder.

anaximander 11y ago

> ... if I ever felt that kind of epiphany personally I know I would head straight to the nearest mental hospital. I can't say that you're wrong, but I would also ask you to consider that your sane and reasonable state of mind that's saying this now, is not the same state of mind that believes these delusions. What may seem right now to be a very clear and easy decision may be the last thing you would even consider in another mental state.

tominous 11y ago
Oh absolutely. That's why I've tried to make that decision ahead of time and plan the details so that it's almost an automatic trigger, hopefully before all insight is lost. It's hard because I'm a very independent, stubborn person who never takes anyone else's word for anything. I can't think of much worse than being locked up, forced drugs and being told what to think, like 1984. But losing touch with reality and effectively abandoning my family and friends would be worse. EDIT: I'm not saying that drugs are a panacea, BUT.. I believe mental illness often has a chemical/biological origin, which over time accumulates into physical, psychological and social damage. I think appropriate low-dose treatment at an early stage has the potential to limit this damage while avoiding the worst side-effects of higher doses.