4 ms·

>Dogs and cats are unique amongst animals. These animals have guarded our doors since before we had doors to guard. Their language is universally understood. Pl

by gozur88 11y ago

>Dogs and cats are unique amongst animals. These animals have guarded our doors since before we had doors to guard. Their language is universally understood. Play a bark to a person in china or france, everyone understands dog. It's in our genes. Mistreatment is bad, but eating is something worse. Those who turn on dogs turn their backs on humanity. Nonsense. That is 100% specific to your culture. In a lot of places dogs are livestock. In others people revile you for eating beef. Or pork.

sandworm101 11y ago
Dogs we with us before the concept of culture, possibly before what we know as language. Cats joined us with the birth of agriculture. Pigs and cows have never been partners in the way that dogs and cats have. "New research shows babies have a handle on the meaning of different dog barks – despite little or no previous exposure to dogs." https://news.byu.edu/news/babies-understand-dog-speak-byu-study-finds https://news.byu.edu/news/babies-understand-dog-speak-byu-st... I've seen this effect demonstrated amongst people on opposite sides of the planet, with totally different languages and cultures. We can all understand the mood and intent of a dog's bark. You don't even need to be a dog person.
- gozur88 11y ago
  Which is all sort of unrelated to the point. Sure, in some cultures dogs are working animals. In others they're pets. That doesn't mean it's somehow wrong that yet other people see them as livestock.
- Nutmog 11y ago
  There's a missing part in your reasoning. Why does a history of people understanding dogs imply that we shouldn't eat them? Should we never eat animals (or plants?) that people in many cultures and times could understand? What connects understanding and eating? Is it OK for other animals to eat them? Even if we feed the dogs to those other animals? Don't chickens fall into the same category as dogs? People everywhere live with them wandering around their house, then from time to time they eat one. Ignoring any other factors, would it be OK to eat a person or dog who had some brain damage so that nobody could understand the mood or intent of anything they communicated? Would it be OK for a person with an inability to understand dogs' (or people's) moods to eat them? What if a new breed of cow was developed that could get along with people the way dogs do. Would that elevate it to the status of being un-eatable, or not because it doesn't have the long history of people understanding it like dogs do? These might sound like snarky questions, but their answers would help paint a clearer picture of your idea which, as you've presented it, doesn't make sense to me. Personally, I wouldn't eat dog because I can imagine all the dogs I've met and feel some emotional connection with. But that's just my personal history. If I was the only one like that, I still wouldn't eat them. You seem to be saying that if you (or your culture) were the only person/culture who had dogs as pets, then you would be willing to eat dogs. You also implied that it's OK to kill humans ("no sympathy"). Is it OK to kill dogs too as long as we don't eat them?
- fractallyte 11y ago
  What your detractors (and downvoters) seem to miss is that dogs occupy a unique position of partnership alongside humans - and have done, as you say, since pre-history. That's most certainly not the same thing as 'livestock'. Treating a companion-in-survival as food is taboo in every sense of the word. It's emotionally tantamount to cannibalism. That's why it's unacceptable, and rightfully reviled.
hanniabu 11y ago
Using them as livestock is fine, but I can't stand how dogs are skinned alive. That action has no place anywhere. Sometimes I wish I had no future so I could dedicate life to stopping the people that do those kind of things and kindly repaying them in a reciprocal manner.
- Pinckney 11y ago
  You're going to need to provide citations for that. A quick google search turns up a Daily Mail article; a video titled "Skinned alive in China" that does not, in fact, show any animals being skinned alive; and other similarly dubious articles.
  - vogt 11y ago
    The skinning and boiling of live dogs is nothing secret. In Yulin, crispy dog skin is a specialty. Boiling is how they prepare it. Even beyond that, the person you were replying to has a point: dogs being raised as livestock is one thing, but the systematic torture they endure in countries like China, South Korea and Vietnam is an entirely different (and wholly deplorable) point altogether. In the rare event that a factory is discovered in the US torturing and abusing livestock, the public outcry is usually enough to shut that facility down and cut off their supply chain. In places like Vietnam (as the article describes) it's merely brushed off as a shameful-yet-ultimately-permissible tradition.
  - DanBC 11y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat > Since 2009,[58] Yulin, Guangxi has held an annual festival of eating dog meat. This purportedly celebrates the summer solstice, however, in 2014, the municipal government published a statement that the festival is not a cultural tradition, rather, a commercial event held by restaurants and the public.[59] Various dog meat dishes (and more recently, cats) are eaten, washed down by lychees wine. The festival in 2011 spanned 10 days, during which 15,000 dogs were consumed.[60] Estimates of the number of dogs eaten during the festival range between 10[46][61] and 15 thousand.[62] Festival organisers say that only dogs bred specifically for consumption are used, however, there are claims that some of the dogs purchased for slaughter and consumption are strays or stolen pets, as evidenced by their wearing collars.[45] Some of the dogs eaten at the festival are burnt or boiled alive[63] and there are reports that the dogs are sometimes clubbed[46] or beaten to death in the belief that the increased adrenalin circulating in the dog's body adds to the flavour of the meat.[45] > Opponents of dog meat consumption in South Korea are critical of the eating of dog meat, as some dogs are beaten, burnt or hanged to make their meat more tender.[104] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat_consumption_in_South_Korea#Controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat_consumption_in_South_... > The controversy over dog meat consumption often centers on the slaughtering methods employed, which include electrocution, strangulation by hanging, and physically beating the dog to death. Some dogs are still alive when they are blow-torched or thrown into boiling water to remove their fur.[20] http://askakorean.blogspot.co.uk/2009/08/dog-its-whats-for-dinner.html http://askakorean.blogspot.co.uk/2009/08/dog-its-whats-for-d... > Q: Is it true that the dogs are tortured before they are killed? > A: Again, because Livestock Processing Act does not cover dog meat, there is no restriction about how to kill a dog for meat. At the meat market, the need to slaughter the dogs quickly usually means dogs are electrocuted, similar to cattle. However, especially in rural areas where people slaughter dogs to cook and eat on their own, the common method is to hang the dog and beat it to death, in an attempt to tenderize the meat. (This, however, may be counterproductive; while beating the meat does tenderize it, an animal that dies in a stressed state generally produces tougher and less tasty meat.) A figurative expression in Korean for a severe beating is “like beating a dog on bok day.”

by gozur88 11y ago

sandworm101 11y ago

Dogs we with us before the concept of culture, possibly before what we know as language. Cats joined us with the birth of agriculture. Pigs and cows have never been partners in the way that dogs and cats have. "New research shows babies have a handle on the meaning of different dog barks – despite little or no previous exposure to dogs." https://news.byu.edu/news/babies-understand-dog-speak-byu-study-finds https://news.byu.edu/news/babies-understand-dog-speak-byu-st... I've seen this effect demonstrated amongst people on opposite sides of the planet, with totally different languages and cultures. We can all understand the mood and intent of a dog's bark. You don't even need to be a dog person.

gozur88 11y ago
Which is all sort of unrelated to the point. Sure, in some cultures dogs are working animals. In others they're pets. That doesn't mean it's somehow wrong that yet other people see them as livestock.
Nutmog 11y ago
There's a missing part in your reasoning. Why does a history of people understanding dogs imply that we shouldn't eat them? Should we never eat animals (or plants?) that people in many cultures and times could understand? What connects understanding and eating? Is it OK for other animals to eat them? Even if we feed the dogs to those other animals? Don't chickens fall into the same category as dogs? People everywhere live with them wandering around their house, then from time to time they eat one. Ignoring any other factors, would it be OK to eat a person or dog who had some brain damage so that nobody could understand the mood or intent of anything they communicated? Would it be OK for a person with an inability to understand dogs' (or people's) moods to eat them? What if a new breed of cow was developed that could get along with people the way dogs do. Would that elevate it to the status of being un-eatable, or not because it doesn't have the long history of people understanding it like dogs do? These might sound like snarky questions, but their answers would help paint a clearer picture of your idea which, as you've presented it, doesn't make sense to me. Personally, I wouldn't eat dog because I can imagine all the dogs I've met and feel some emotional connection with. But that's just my personal history. If I was the only one like that, I still wouldn't eat them. You seem to be saying that if you (or your culture) were the only person/culture who had dogs as pets, then you would be willing to eat dogs. You also implied that it's OK to kill humans ("no sympathy"). Is it OK to kill dogs too as long as we don't eat them?
fractallyte 11y ago
What your detractors (and downvoters) seem to miss is that dogs occupy a unique position of partnership alongside humans - and have done, as you say, since pre-history. That's most certainly not the same thing as 'livestock'. Treating a companion-in-survival as food is taboo in every sense of the word. It's emotionally tantamount to cannibalism. That's why it's unacceptable, and rightfully reviled.

hanniabu 11y ago

Using them as livestock is fine, but I can't stand how dogs are skinned alive. That action has no place anywhere. Sometimes I wish I had no future so I could dedicate life to stopping the people that do those kind of things and kindly repaying them in a reciprocal manner.

Pinckney 11y ago
You're going to need to provide citations for that. A quick google search turns up a Daily Mail article; a video titled "Skinned alive in China" that does not, in fact, show any animals being skinned alive; and other similarly dubious articles.
- vogt 11y ago
  The skinning and boiling of live dogs is nothing secret. In Yulin, crispy dog skin is a specialty. Boiling is how they prepare it. Even beyond that, the person you were replying to has a point: dogs being raised as livestock is one thing, but the systematic torture they endure in countries like China, South Korea and Vietnam is an entirely different (and wholly deplorable) point altogether. In the rare event that a factory is discovered in the US torturing and abusing livestock, the public outcry is usually enough to shut that facility down and cut off their supply chain. In places like Vietnam (as the article describes) it's merely brushed off as a shameful-yet-ultimately-permissible tradition.
- DanBC 11y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat > Since 2009,[58] Yulin, Guangxi has held an annual festival of eating dog meat. This purportedly celebrates the summer solstice, however, in 2014, the municipal government published a statement that the festival is not a cultural tradition, rather, a commercial event held by restaurants and the public.[59] Various dog meat dishes (and more recently, cats) are eaten, washed down by lychees wine. The festival in 2011 spanned 10 days, during which 15,000 dogs were consumed.[60] Estimates of the number of dogs eaten during the festival range between 10[46][61] and 15 thousand.[62] Festival organisers say that only dogs bred specifically for consumption are used, however, there are claims that some of the dogs purchased for slaughter and consumption are strays or stolen pets, as evidenced by their wearing collars.[45] Some of the dogs eaten at the festival are burnt or boiled alive[63] and there are reports that the dogs are sometimes clubbed[46] or beaten to death in the belief that the increased adrenalin circulating in the dog's body adds to the flavour of the meat.[45] > Opponents of dog meat consumption in South Korea are critical of the eating of dog meat, as some dogs are beaten, burnt or hanged to make their meat more tender.[104] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat_consumption_in_South_Korea#Controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_meat_consumption_in_South_... > The controversy over dog meat consumption often centers on the slaughtering methods employed, which include electrocution, strangulation by hanging, and physically beating the dog to death. Some dogs are still alive when they are blow-torched or thrown into boiling water to remove their fur.[20] http://askakorean.blogspot.co.uk/2009/08/dog-its-whats-for-dinner.html http://askakorean.blogspot.co.uk/2009/08/dog-its-whats-for-d... > Q: Is it true that the dogs are tortured before they are killed? > A: Again, because Livestock Processing Act does not cover dog meat, there is no restriction about how to kill a dog for meat. At the meat market, the need to slaughter the dogs quickly usually means dogs are electrocuted, similar to cattle. However, especially in rural areas where people slaughter dogs to cook and eat on their own, the common method is to hang the dog and beat it to death, in an attempt to tenderize the meat. (This, however, may be counterproductive; while beating the meat does tenderize it, an animal that dies in a stressed state generally produces tougher and less tasty meat.) A figurative expression in Korean for a severe beating is “like beating a dog on bok day.”