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The thing I think should be emphasized is that while the majority of the people may now trust the FBI, the NSA, and the US Government in general to do the right
by KMag 11y ago
The thing I think should be emphasized is that while the majority of the people may now trust the FBI, the NSA, and the US Government in general to do the right thing, this is the same FBI that just a generation ago investigated Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. as a <strike>terrorist</strike> communist and apparently tried blackmailing him into committing suicide[0]. (The communist threat at that time filled the same place in the American psyche as does the terrorist threat today.) The NSA recently spied on their congressional oversight committee. Without strong controls on government investigative powers, we're just one Herbert Hoover away from a completely unchecked and out of control security apparatus.
It's not about trusting the American government to do the right thing. It's about trusting this government and all future American governments to do the right thing.
EDIT: Also, at least one legal expert estimates that the average American accidentally commits three felonies per day, meaning that most of us are mistaken when we think we don't have anything to hide.[1]
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvey_A._Silverglate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvey_A._Silverglate
- _rknLA 11y agoTo add onto this, in addition to the governmental threat, another point that Cook is trying to make is that security is hard. It's hard for the government, which he backs up by citing breaches, and it's hard for Apple (which he omits, but remember those iCloud breaches?). I completely agree with your point about future governments and unchecked power, but there is also the point that, if Apple creates it, there is the possibility that organizations (or even just normal people) besides these anointed three-letter agencies may also have the same power to access a good chunk of your entire digital life (and the locations of your friends and family who use Find My Friends) if you were to lose your phone.
- KMag 11y agoGood point. The thing Cook can't say publicly is that once Apple creates FBiOS, every government around the world, especially the most oppressive regimes, will block imports of iPhones until Apple gives them a copy or they steal it from the FBI. I believe the FBI is asking for FBiOS to refuse to run if the IMEI doesn't match a compiled-in whitelist, but my understanding is that phone thieves routinely desolder a chip to change the IMEI on a stolen phone. The FBiOS is for use when they have physical access to the phone, so I don't believe the IMEI whitelist is a large hurdle to get over.
- rhino369 11y ago>It's not about trusting the American government to do the right thing. It's about trusting this government and all future American governments to do the right thing. But you don't have to trust the FBI or today or tomorrow. The court order doesn't require the FBI have access to the modified software. Apple doesn't have to trust the FBI at all.
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- KMag 11y agoI'm not particularly concerned about FBiOS for the pre-Secure Enclave iPhones. I'm concerned about the precedent of allowing the security apparatus to demand the creation of new surveillance/investigative tools, as long as they whisper the magic word "terrorist" 3 times before asking.
- outworlder 11y agoWhat's preventing them (or other government organization) from issuing a second court order to obtain the software?
- rhino369 11y ago1) They'd still need the Apple signing key otherwise you can't update the phone. The software, without the key, is totally useless. 2) The same thing that prevents the FBI from subpoenaing Apple's key. There isn't a good legal basis for it. It's almost definitely unduly burdensome for apple to give out their key. If the FBI were to win a case like that, it doesn't matter what happens in this situation.
- sjburt 11y agoNot only that, but how can Apple say yes to the U.S. government and not say yes to the Chinese government or anyone else?
- ionised 11y agoThe lesson to take away from current events, and from the history of the FBI, NSA and CIA is that none of the them ever be trusted, with anything. They have wilfully and repeatedly acted against the interests of freedom and liberty and the progression of civilised society. They will keep doing it. Resisting change, even positive change is core to what they are.
- abandonliberty 11y ago>EDIT: Also, at least one legal expert estimates that the average American accidentally commits three felonies per day, meaning that most of us are mistaken when we think we don't have anything to hide.[1] Sadly beyond the title "Three felonies a day" apparently he does not back up these claims or mention them at all: http://www.amazon.com/review/R11HC7ZWMQV2QY/ref=cm_cr_dp_cmt?ie=UTF8&ASIN=1594032556&channel=detail-glance&nodeID=283155&store=books http://www.amazon.com/review/R11HC7ZWMQV2QY/ref=cm_cr_dp_cmt... http://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/22530/does-the-average-american-unwittingly-commit-three-felonies-a-day http://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/22530/does-the-a...