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Please read more about this case and inform yourself. Creating or giving that master key, Cook says, will put every device owner at risk. And given that there

Please read more about this case and inform yourself. Creating or giving that master key, Cook says, will put every device owner at risk. And given that there are millions of iPhone users worldwide, that risk is huge.

lttlrck 11y ago
I think you may have misread.
davidw 11y ago
Apple already has a master code signing key.
- studentrob 11y ago
  Yes and handing over signed code is not something Apple should be compelled to do.
  - davidw 11y ago
    My understanding is that no one is asking them to do so.
    - studentrob 11y ago
      Let me rephrase. Creating signed software that Apple feels is unsafe and not something Apple should be compelled to do. Additionally, we all know very well that eventually law enforcement will demand their own copy of the software, or find it with the help of the NSA. By the way, I'm totally with you that Apple should improve the security of their phones. But this case and that feature are separate issues. You can advocate open hardware & software and defend Apple's stand against the government compelling companies to act at the same time. Those ideas are not mutually exclusive. Hate the game not the player.
      - davidw 11y ago
        If they ask for the software, Apple should deny that request because that's very different from asking for assistance on a case-by-case basis with a court order for each one. The question reasonable, non-technical people are going to ask is: how is this different than asking to search a house. There's a court order, it's not just the FBI acting on its own. They're asking Apple to do it, and not hand over a master key, which would not be reasonable at all.
        studentrob 11y ago
        Somehow Apple has managed to keep its signing key from getting out into the wild. Only Apple knows the systems required to keep that safe. The same cannot be said of signed copies of software. > If they ask for the software, Apple should deny that request because that's very different from asking for assistance on a case-by-case basis with a court order for each one. If it comes to that, I'm sure they will put up the same fight. What's the difference to you whether they fight now or later? Must Apple act exactly as you would? > The question reasonable, non-technical people are going to ask is: how is this different than asking to search a house. There's a court order, it's not just the FBI acting on its own. They're asking Apple to do it, and not hand over a master key, which would not be reasonable at all. To those reasonable, non-technical people I would say the following: "If we create special signed software for the government for unlocking the iPhone, then terrorists will just use something else that is out of the reach of our government. We will have weakened our privacy and this will not keep us safe from terrorism. If the signed software gets into the wrong hands, it could be used by anyone in the world to hack into iPhones and get location data on your kids, your home, and other information you'd rather keep private."
        davidw 11y ago
        > Somehow Apple has managed to keep its signing key from getting out into the wild. Only Apple knows the systems required to keep that safe. > The same cannot be said of signed copies of software. Presumably, you could employ the same systems for both pieces of data, since it should all stay within Apple. > What's the difference to you whether they fight now or later? Because they should respond to the request that was made on its merits, not on "what might happen". I'm just pointing out the kinds of arguments that reasonable, non technical people are making.

lttlrck 11y ago

I think you may have misread.

davidw 11y ago

Apple already has a master code signing key.

studentrob 11y ago
Yes and handing over signed code is not something Apple should be compelled to do.
- davidw 11y ago
  My understanding is that no one is asking them to do so.
  - studentrob 11y ago
    Let me rephrase. Creating signed software that Apple feels is unsafe and not something Apple should be compelled to do. Additionally, we all know very well that eventually law enforcement will demand their own copy of the software, or find it with the help of the NSA. By the way, I'm totally with you that Apple should improve the security of their phones. But this case and that feature are separate issues. You can advocate open hardware & software and defend Apple's stand against the government compelling companies to act at the same time. Those ideas are not mutually exclusive. Hate the game not the player.
    - davidw 11y ago
      If they ask for the software, Apple should deny that request because that's very different from asking for assistance on a case-by-case basis with a court order for each one. The question reasonable, non-technical people are going to ask is: how is this different than asking to search a house. There's a court order, it's not just the FBI acting on its own. They're asking Apple to do it, and not hand over a master key, which would not be reasonable at all.
      - studentrob 11y ago
        Somehow Apple has managed to keep its signing key from getting out into the wild. Only Apple knows the systems required to keep that safe. The same cannot be said of signed copies of software. > If they ask for the software, Apple should deny that request because that's very different from asking for assistance on a case-by-case basis with a court order for each one. If it comes to that, I'm sure they will put up the same fight. What's the difference to you whether they fight now or later? Must Apple act exactly as you would? > The question reasonable, non-technical people are going to ask is: how is this different than asking to search a house. There's a court order, it's not just the FBI acting on its own. They're asking Apple to do it, and not hand over a master key, which would not be reasonable at all. To those reasonable, non-technical people I would say the following: "If we create special signed software for the government for unlocking the iPhone, then terrorists will just use something else that is out of the reach of our government. We will have weakened our privacy and this will not keep us safe from terrorism. If the signed software gets into the wrong hands, it could be used by anyone in the world to hack into iPhones and get location data on your kids, your home, and other information you'd rather keep private."
        davidw 11y ago
        > Somehow Apple has managed to keep its signing key from getting out into the wild. Only Apple knows the systems required to keep that safe. > The same cannot be said of signed copies of software. Presumably, you could employ the same systems for both pieces of data, since it should all stay within Apple. > What's the difference to you whether they fight now or later? Because they should respond to the request that was made on its merits, not on "what might happen". I'm just pointing out the kinds of arguments that reasonable, non technical people are making.