7 ms·

Actually if you are a firefighter in San Francisco, you can qualify for a special downpayment assistance loan of up to $200,000 that requires no payments for 30

by kqr2 11y ago

Actually if you are a firefighter in San Francisco, you can qualify for a special downpayment assistance loan of up to $200,000 that requires no payments for 30 years http://sfmohcd.org/first-responders-down-payment-assistance-loan-program-frdalp http://sfmohcd.org/first-responders-down-payment-assistance-... Also starting salary for SFFD is from $72,670.00 - 112,190.00/year which doesn't include overtime. https://www.jobaps.com/SF/sup/bulpreview.asp?R1=CCT&R2=H002&R3=900310 https://www.jobaps.com/SF/sup/bulpreview.asp?R1=CCT&R2=H002&... Firefighters are actually some of the highest paid city workers. In 2013, 31 of the top 50 earners were from the SFFD. http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/S-F-Fire-Dept-dominates-list-of-highest-paid-5085237.php http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/S-F-Fire-Dept-dominate...

EliRivers 11y ago
Strong unions negotiate good wages. Good for them.
- unpopularop 11y ago
  Good for them. Bad for the taxpayer.
  - EliRivers 11y ago
    Strong unions are symptoms, not causes. Blaming unions because rich/powerful people have a tendency to fuck over the powerless is exactly what the rich/powerful want you to do. The rich and powerful benefit far more from low taxes than the stereotypical "tax payer". Addendum: for God's sake, your precious karma score is a number on a website. If it matters to you so much that you create new accounts to say something people might not like, you need to take a long hard look at yourself.
    - pessimizer 11y ago
      Reply to addendum: Pseudonymity is not anonymity - a lot of people post here under a handle known to friends and/or coworkers (or generally prefer to post without hiding their identities.) They may be posting under throwaways in order not to be judged for their opinions IRL (or fired for them.) So it's not all magic internet points.
  - JulianMorrison 11y ago
    The taxpayer ought to be ashamed of short changing people. They also ought to have the common sense that it's better to pay a living wage, than pick up the bill in welfare.
    - sbank 11y ago
      Fire service could be privatized and government provided welfare does not have to exist to begin with.
      - JulianMorrison 11y ago
        Result, slums, city destroying fires, people dying in the street. You do realize also, that chronically sick malnourished sweatshop serfs do awful work? It's a dystopian hell only a libertarian could love.
        jschwartzi 11y ago
        It's not a libertarian ideal. It's more of an Anarcho-syndicalist ideal.
      - toomuchtodo 11y ago
        I'm always shocked when such terrible ideas are put forth for consideration in a public forum. Privatize essential life safety services? Because that has worked oh so well for healthcare.
        Shivetya 11y ago
        healthcare is the state it is in because of government interference in the insurance markets at Federal and State levels. When you cannot cross state lines to offer competing insurance how can anyone expect a good system. Before anyone points to government run healthcare in the US being good please explain away the VA The standard line always is, "we will do it better than X" - well fix current government run healthcare first
  - mathgeek 11y ago
    Always remember that public employees are taxpayers, too.
- marincounty 11y ago
  Why is he being downvoted? I don't get this site sometimes. San Francisco is a union town--get used to it. (It might be the last union town.) Yes--firefigheters, electricians, plumbers, cops, etc. make a very livable wage. I've been in a San Francisco union, and never felt so--what's the word--protected. No--I didn't like the fact that everyone was paid the same, but in retrospect I was wrong. There will be a day where you are not the best in the room. You won't be the Rock Star. You will thank the socialists for that union. To be honest, I think certain sectors of tech would benefit from a union. So many of you go to that fun place. You get free food. You get free sodas. You get the fun office hootenannies. And a salary that's barely livable. We're still in a bull market in tech. All the Ayn Rand/Rebublican mantra will get very old when it gamblers decide to pull that money back in. Sorry, I'm a fan of unions. Worked too many non-union jobs; jobs that were worse than not working. For some reason, owners only like to pay just what they get away with.
  - Shivetya 11y ago
    Because public sector unions are not bargaining on the same footing or with similar power that private unions do. They have an undue influence over local elections and in effect can hold local politicians hostage by it. There have been many documented cases where said unions used intimidation to include billboards and the like against any politician trying to reign in retirement and similar benefits back to reasonable levels.
    - crimsonalucard 11y ago
      Corporations do the same shit from an opposite angle. You need opposing groups to form a balance; unfortunately in our society, things are heavily weighted towards corporate power.
    - tamana 11y ago
      How do public unions get more influence?
      - dragonwriter 11y ago
TuringNYC 11y ago
I was surprised to see that as well. Forget about highest-paid -- just the stability of a government job allows one to afford homes. I might make more as a developer, but i have no idea when i'll be laid-off and how long i might be out of work. That forces me to stretch far less than a firefighter or teacher.
- tolle 11y ago
  Finance. Or rather working at a large bank, also comes with great job stability. If you are a developer on one of the core systems you are basically set for life.
- davidiach 11y ago
  You need to take into account that firefighters sometimes get injured and even die doing their jobs. Getting laid off isn't the only way to lose their job.
  - JupiterMoon 11y ago
    Insurance?
  - true_religion 11y ago
    Don't they get compensation for that, which should still enable them to keep up with mortage payments?
  - runamok 11y ago
    Very true. Here is a long treatise on the subject with some sources. http://www.iaff1775.org/the-truth-about-firefighter-retirement-and-pensions http://www.iaff1775.org/the-truth-about-firefighter-retireme... Clearly it is not a balanced article (since it comes from a FireFighters Union) but it definitely made some good points.
whyenot 11y ago
Good for them. Emergency workers should be paid a living wage, and for SF $72k-$112k seems completely reasonable. > Firefighters are actually some of the highest paid city workers. In 2013, 31 of the top 50 earners were from the SFFD. as the article you linked to mentions, this is largely due to one time payments due to people cashing out unused vacation and sick days when they retire.
- MisterBastahrd 11y ago
  Whoever does emergency work for only a "living wage" is more of a saint than Mother Theresa. They deserve at least mid-range for their locale.

by kqr2 11y ago

EliRivers 11y ago

Strong unions negotiate good wages. Good for them.

unpopularop 11y ago
Good for them. Bad for the taxpayer.
- EliRivers 11y ago
  Strong unions are symptoms, not causes. Blaming unions because rich/powerful people have a tendency to fuck over the powerless is exactly what the rich/powerful want you to do. The rich and powerful benefit far more from low taxes than the stereotypical "tax payer". Addendum: for God's sake, your precious karma score is a number on a website. If it matters to you so much that you create new accounts to say something people might not like, you need to take a long hard look at yourself.
  - pessimizer 11y ago
    Reply to addendum: Pseudonymity is not anonymity - a lot of people post here under a handle known to friends and/or coworkers (or generally prefer to post without hiding their identities.) They may be posting under throwaways in order not to be judged for their opinions IRL (or fired for them.) So it's not all magic internet points.
- JulianMorrison 11y ago
  The taxpayer ought to be ashamed of short changing people. They also ought to have the common sense that it's better to pay a living wage, than pick up the bill in welfare.
  - sbank 11y ago
    Fire service could be privatized and government provided welfare does not have to exist to begin with.
    - JulianMorrison 11y ago
      Result, slums, city destroying fires, people dying in the street. You do realize also, that chronically sick malnourished sweatshop serfs do awful work? It's a dystopian hell only a libertarian could love.
      - jschwartzi 11y ago
        It's not a libertarian ideal. It's more of an Anarcho-syndicalist ideal.
    - toomuchtodo 11y ago
      I'm always shocked when such terrible ideas are put forth for consideration in a public forum. Privatize essential life safety services? Because that has worked oh so well for healthcare.
      - Shivetya 11y ago
        healthcare is the state it is in because of government interference in the insurance markets at Federal and State levels. When you cannot cross state lines to offer competing insurance how can anyone expect a good system. Before anyone points to government run healthcare in the US being good please explain away the VA The standard line always is, "we will do it better than X" - well fix current government run healthcare first
- mathgeek 11y ago
  Always remember that public employees are taxpayers, too.
marincounty 11y ago
Why is he being downvoted? I don't get this site sometimes. San Francisco is a union town--get used to it. (It might be the last union town.) Yes--firefigheters, electricians, plumbers, cops, etc. make a very livable wage. I've been in a San Francisco union, and never felt so--what's the word--protected. No--I didn't like the fact that everyone was paid the same, but in retrospect I was wrong. There will be a day where you are not the best in the room. You won't be the Rock Star. You will thank the socialists for that union. To be honest, I think certain sectors of tech would benefit from a union. So many of you go to that fun place. You get free food. You get free sodas. You get the fun office hootenannies. And a salary that's barely livable. We're still in a bull market in tech. All the Ayn Rand/Rebublican mantra will get very old when it gamblers decide to pull that money back in. Sorry, I'm a fan of unions. Worked too many non-union jobs; jobs that were worse than not working. For some reason, owners only like to pay just what they get away with.
- Shivetya 11y ago
  Because public sector unions are not bargaining on the same footing or with similar power that private unions do. They have an undue influence over local elections and in effect can hold local politicians hostage by it. There have been many documented cases where said unions used intimidation to include billboards and the like against any politician trying to reign in retirement and similar benefits back to reasonable levels.
  - crimsonalucard 11y ago
    Corporations do the same shit from an opposite angle. You need opposing groups to form a balance; unfortunately in our society, things are heavily weighted towards corporate power.
  - tamana 11y ago
    How do public unions get more influence?
    - dragonwriter 11y ago

TuringNYC 11y ago

I was surprised to see that as well. Forget about highest-paid -- just the stability of a government job allows one to afford homes. I might make more as a developer, but i have no idea when i'll be laid-off and how long i might be out of work. That forces me to stretch far less than a firefighter or teacher.

tolle 11y ago
Finance. Or rather working at a large bank, also comes with great job stability. If you are a developer on one of the core systems you are basically set for life.
davidiach 11y ago
You need to take into account that firefighters sometimes get injured and even die doing their jobs. Getting laid off isn't the only way to lose their job.
- JupiterMoon 11y ago
  Insurance?
- true_religion 11y ago
  Don't they get compensation for that, which should still enable them to keep up with mortage payments?
- runamok 11y ago
  Very true. Here is a long treatise on the subject with some sources. http://www.iaff1775.org/the-truth-about-firefighter-retirement-and-pensions http://www.iaff1775.org/the-truth-about-firefighter-retireme... Clearly it is not a balanced article (since it comes from a FireFighters Union) but it definitely made some good points.

whyenot 11y ago

Good for them. Emergency workers should be paid a living wage, and for SF $72k-$112k seems completely reasonable. > Firefighters are actually some of the highest paid city workers. In 2013, 31 of the top 50 earners were from the SFFD. as the article you linked to mentions, this is largely due to one time payments due to people cashing out unused vacation and sick days when they retire.

MisterBastahrd 11y ago
Whoever does emergency work for only a "living wage" is more of a saint than Mother Theresa. They deserve at least mid-range for their locale.