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I like the assertion that the US has 2 economies that are lumped together for statistical purposes. I would imagine there should be some supporting artifacts o

I like the assertion that the US has 2 economies that are lumped together for statistical purposes. I would imagine there should be some supporting artifacts of this in various reports. Where would one look to see data to support this (two clustered groups experience the world significantly differently). I would imagine that publicizing this data would help people validate their concerns that no, things aren't going as well as I've been told.

maxerickson 11y ago
I don't think it's the dividing line used in the parent comment to yours, but one interesting dividing line is people employed full time with benefits vs everyone else. Maybe a slightly better line would be based on US GDP. Per capita it is ~$53,000, capturing a share of the economy larger than that can reasonably be described as doing ok (of course the line would be different for a household than an individual).
- chrstphrhrt 11y ago
  I think a lot of full time workers can still be wage slaves. Maybe a living wage is a better benchmark. The minimum required to "thrive" with a normal list of opportunities/choices that people can be expected to encounter. E.g., car required if not living in high-density urban environment, raising children, having pets, buying simple furniture, healthy food, internet access, life and house/rental insurance etc. It's all about access to thriving, not access to luxury, and in each place and circumstance that access is different, but living wages can be indexed to all these factors. The more factors included to counter the various axes of oppression the better. For example, in Canada we have the Canadian Centre for Policy alternatives which publishes living wage data/indexes every year for a number of cities. A few years back I helped cofound a programming and design worker co-op with a handful of other people and we discussed using such an index to determine salaries for members in different cities. E.g. if the Montreal team gets 4x the local living wage, then the Vancouver team also gets 4x their local living wage, even if the absolute amount appears higher.
  - maxerickson 11y ago
    I think that is another interesting earning level to look at, but what if the living wage exceeds the per capita GDP (or GDP/work force if you want to better account for children)?
  - hwstar 11y ago
    You also don't have Employment at-will and binding arbitration in Canada. The environment for workers in Canada is fairer than in the US.
venomsnake 11y ago
http://eml.berkeley.edu//~saez/saez-UStopincomes-2012.pdf http://eml.berkeley.edu//~saez/saez-UStopincomes-2012.pdf That is the first i found. But it is somewhat dated.

maxerickson 11y ago

I don't think it's the dividing line used in the parent comment to yours, but one interesting dividing line is people employed full time with benefits vs everyone else. Maybe a slightly better line would be based on US GDP. Per capita it is ~$53,000, capturing a share of the economy larger than that can reasonably be described as doing ok (of course the line would be different for a household than an individual).

chrstphrhrt 11y ago
I think a lot of full time workers can still be wage slaves. Maybe a living wage is a better benchmark. The minimum required to "thrive" with a normal list of opportunities/choices that people can be expected to encounter. E.g., car required if not living in high-density urban environment, raising children, having pets, buying simple furniture, healthy food, internet access, life and house/rental insurance etc. It's all about access to thriving, not access to luxury, and in each place and circumstance that access is different, but living wages can be indexed to all these factors. The more factors included to counter the various axes of oppression the better. For example, in Canada we have the Canadian Centre for Policy alternatives which publishes living wage data/indexes every year for a number of cities. A few years back I helped cofound a programming and design worker co-op with a handful of other people and we discussed using such an index to determine salaries for members in different cities. E.g. if the Montreal team gets 4x the local living wage, then the Vancouver team also gets 4x their local living wage, even if the absolute amount appears higher.
- maxerickson 11y ago
  I think that is another interesting earning level to look at, but what if the living wage exceeds the per capita GDP (or GDP/work force if you want to better account for children)?
- hwstar 11y ago
  You also don't have Employment at-will and binding arbitration in Canada. The environment for workers in Canada is fairer than in the US.

venomsnake 11y ago

http://eml.berkeley.edu//~saez/saez-UStopincomes-2012.pdf http://eml.berkeley.edu//~saez/saez-UStopincomes-2012.pdf That is the first i found. But it is somewhat dated.