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The discussion about encryption is getting completely out of context, like 'encryption' is something magical. We're talking about cracking a 4 digit access cod

The discussion about encryption is getting completely out of context, like 'encryption' is something magical. We're talking about cracking a 4 digit access code of a phone, which is extremely easy. Apple knows this, that's why they set a digital booby trap which fires after 10 tries. So the real discussion should be, "Can the government force a company who placed a booby trap, to remove that same trap if needed?" Whether this is a digital trap, of a bomb placed on a doorknob is not important.

Piskvorrr 11y ago
What is encryption? It's a method of denying access without the correct key (for as long as it takes for the data to become worthless - not necessarily forever). Actually destroying the data is one of the ways to deny access. NB: if it were so easy, we wouldn't be having this discussion. So, apparently there are some mitigation techniques which help in case of weak passphrases, and make it not-so-easy, no?
- FrankyHollywood 11y ago
  Yes, but for Apple it is easy. Just change 1 line of code, recompile and patch the phones firmware. Than some FBI intern can try 10000 lockscreen codes and they're in. No big deal. My whole point is, this is not a technical issue. It is easy. It is a legal issue. Can the government force a company to do such a thing? Especially when the impact on society is zero. The firmware upgrade is not released outside of Apple, no other phones get it. It feels almost like a publicity stunt to me. Apple being the underdog in the fight against the big evil government. If they don't want to cooperate and there is no legal basis for doing so, than don't cooperate.
  - Piskvorrr 11y ago
    "The firmware upgrade is not released outside of Apple, no other phones get it." - that's the non-obviously haaaard part. The one that would fail, sooner or later.
acqq 11y ago
> We're talking about cracking a 4 digit access code of a phone, which is extremely easy. Technically, it's obviously not just a 4-digit access code that prevents FBI to unlock the phone, otherwise they wouldn't demand Apple to produce the whole new version of their iOS and setup them special access only to enable that. And even more important, the legal basis they claim to have is the "we can do anything" sentence from 1789: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11165699 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11165699 There's nothing about the obligation of companies to do something specific there, certainly not about changing their own products or making the new ones.

Piskvorrr 11y ago

What is encryption? It's a method of denying access without the correct key (for as long as it takes for the data to become worthless - not necessarily forever). Actually destroying the data is one of the ways to deny access. NB: if it were so easy, we wouldn't be having this discussion. So, apparently there are some mitigation techniques which help in case of weak passphrases, and make it not-so-easy, no?

FrankyHollywood 11y ago
Yes, but for Apple it is easy. Just change 1 line of code, recompile and patch the phones firmware. Than some FBI intern can try 10000 lockscreen codes and they're in. No big deal. My whole point is, this is not a technical issue. It is easy. It is a legal issue. Can the government force a company to do such a thing? Especially when the impact on society is zero. The firmware upgrade is not released outside of Apple, no other phones get it. It feels almost like a publicity stunt to me. Apple being the underdog in the fight against the big evil government. If they don't want to cooperate and there is no legal basis for doing so, than don't cooperate.
- Piskvorrr 11y ago
  "The firmware upgrade is not released outside of Apple, no other phones get it." - that's the non-obviously haaaard part. The one that would fail, sooner or later.

acqq 11y ago

> We're talking about cracking a 4 digit access code of a phone, which is extremely easy. Technically, it's obviously not just a 4-digit access code that prevents FBI to unlock the phone, otherwise they wouldn't demand Apple to produce the whole new version of their iOS and setup them special access only to enable that. And even more important, the legal basis they claim to have is the "we can do anything" sentence from 1789: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11165699 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11165699 There's nothing about the obligation of companies to do something specific there, certainly not about changing their own products or making the new ones.