4 ms·

It's the users. Facebook's value isn't going to vary any unless there is some migration from Facebook to Buzz. What exactly does Buzz offer that Facebook doesn

by mr_eel 17y ago

It's the users. Facebook's value isn't going to vary any unless there is some migration from Facebook to Buzz. What exactly does Buzz offer that Facebook doesn't? What kind of recognition will it have? This is all very interesting, but it's _far_ too early for this kind of hyperbole.

tokenadult 17y ago
Facebook's value isn't going to vary any unless there is some migration from Facebook to Buzz. It has been done before. Do you remember Prodigy? CompuServe? AOL? MySpace? For that matter, how often do you use the search engines Excite, Lycos, AltaVista, or whatever Microsoft's search engine was before Bing? Users go where the user experience is pleasant. Advertisers look for click-throughs, and try to estimate eyeball-minutes for the major sites, and Google has a fair chance of beating Facebook with Buzz. Not overnight, but steadily. Many of my Facebook friends haven't seen the Google Buzz roll-out yet, but they have seen the new Facebook homepage roll-out, and they don't like it. AFTER EDIT: And it occurs to me that Calacanis's main statement, that Facebook lost value, is hard to test while Facebook is not publicly traded. But Google's value is easy to track in the stock market. If this move looks stupid to Google investors, their behavior will show that.
- waterlesscloud 17y ago
  The cost of leaving facebook is higher than it was for leaving any of those other platforms. People have their social graphs well-established on Facebook now. Not a bad guess at their desired graph, as Buzz provides, but a graph they've shaped themselves over the course of a year or more. Me-too or even evolutionary won't cut it for draining Facebook of its users. It's got to provide signficantly more value immediately upon signing up. So far, it doesn't.
  - marciovm123 17y ago
    I think you have to think of this utility in terms of how the two social graphs are different. The Facebook social graph is established by people you meet in person and who decide later to send you a friend invite, or people you knew at some point who saw your picture on someone else's friends list. The strength of the connection is determined by Facebook based on how often you interact with or stalk that person. The Gmail social graph is people you actually communicate with, and is more dynamic in the sense that you probably communicate with more people on a day-to-day basis then you interact/stalk with on Fb. The question is, which of these makes for a more relevant following system, and for what kind of user? Perhaps one way to think of it is that people who are all about sharing pictures will prefer Fb, but those who are all about sharing ideas will prefer Buzz. Which target demographic has more income?
    - tokenadult 17y ago
      Perhaps one way to think of it is that people who are all about sharing pictures will prefer Fb, but those who are all about sharing ideas will prefer Buzz. Which target demographic has more income? A very good question. That's about what I'm thinking as I consider making Buzz my primary channel for interacting with my friends. I'm considering "ideas" more than "income," but I'm not looking for games or cute pictures. AFTER EDIT: As I just posted on Facebook, in a thread discussing the New York Times article about Buzz, "rebuilding a whole social graph is a bother. But MIGRATING a social graph to a site that is at least as useful and less annoying might be something much easier to do. I am glad to see some thoughtful competition in this space, the better to kee Facebook honest." I see some other comments on my Facebook threads and here on HN along the lines of using Facebook to first establish a network of friends, and then using the Next Great Thing in Social Networking to winnow that group of friends to get a dense network of closest friends. That might work for me.
    - HelenL14 17y ago
      That's an interesting way of looking at it, but you're still talking about "preference" of one over the other. Unless there's a new tool out there that can integrate everything for me, (even if I prefer FB/Buzz/Twitter/etc.) I'll still probably use all of them for those precise separate reasons. I think it'd be interesting to see how many NEW social network users Buzz will bring in, just because of the simple fact that it makes setting up a brand new network easy as pie (vs FB and having to build up to a nice little community of friends).
- adam-_- 17y ago
  Not many people in my "social circle" use gmail [that I know of] where as _everyone_ uses facebook... Also, in general, no one ever likes facebook UI updates, yet they never leave.
  - robryan 17y ago
    I think for some people they have opposed so many UI updates on facebook that they no longer remember which UI they considered good.
- mr_eel 17y ago
  "It has been done before. Do you remember Prodigy? CompuServe? AOL? MySpace?" Yeah. Or Friendster. Of course it could happen, but my point is that it is too early to tell what impact Buzz will have. "Google has a fair chance of beating Facebook with Buzz" Agreed. But that time is not now and the hyperbole is unwarranted. As you say, steady gains are a possible -- and most likely -- way for Buzz to unseat Facebook.
rudin 17y ago
I am trying to migrate from Facebook to Buzz. From the look of things it suits me better. I never enjoyed Facebook that much as it seems there is a race to get the most friends and I find all the photo sharing a little disturbing.

by mr_eel 17y ago

tokenadult 17y ago

Facebook's value isn't going to vary any unless there is some migration from Facebook to Buzz. It has been done before. Do you remember Prodigy? CompuServe? AOL? MySpace? For that matter, how often do you use the search engines Excite, Lycos, AltaVista, or whatever Microsoft's search engine was before Bing? Users go where the user experience is pleasant. Advertisers look for click-throughs, and try to estimate eyeball-minutes for the major sites, and Google has a fair chance of beating Facebook with Buzz. Not overnight, but steadily. Many of my Facebook friends haven't seen the Google Buzz roll-out yet, but they have seen the new Facebook homepage roll-out, and they don't like it. AFTER EDIT: And it occurs to me that Calacanis's main statement, that Facebook lost value, is hard to test while Facebook is not publicly traded. But Google's value is easy to track in the stock market. If this move looks stupid to Google investors, their behavior will show that.

waterlesscloud 17y ago
The cost of leaving facebook is higher than it was for leaving any of those other platforms. People have their social graphs well-established on Facebook now. Not a bad guess at their desired graph, as Buzz provides, but a graph they've shaped themselves over the course of a year or more. Me-too or even evolutionary won't cut it for draining Facebook of its users. It's got to provide signficantly more value immediately upon signing up. So far, it doesn't.
- marciovm123 17y ago
  I think you have to think of this utility in terms of how the two social graphs are different. The Facebook social graph is established by people you meet in person and who decide later to send you a friend invite, or people you knew at some point who saw your picture on someone else's friends list. The strength of the connection is determined by Facebook based on how often you interact with or stalk that person. The Gmail social graph is people you actually communicate with, and is more dynamic in the sense that you probably communicate with more people on a day-to-day basis then you interact/stalk with on Fb. The question is, which of these makes for a more relevant following system, and for what kind of user? Perhaps one way to think of it is that people who are all about sharing pictures will prefer Fb, but those who are all about sharing ideas will prefer Buzz. Which target demographic has more income?
  - tokenadult 17y ago
    Perhaps one way to think of it is that people who are all about sharing pictures will prefer Fb, but those who are all about sharing ideas will prefer Buzz. Which target demographic has more income? A very good question. That's about what I'm thinking as I consider making Buzz my primary channel for interacting with my friends. I'm considering "ideas" more than "income," but I'm not looking for games or cute pictures. AFTER EDIT: As I just posted on Facebook, in a thread discussing the New York Times article about Buzz, "rebuilding a whole social graph is a bother. But MIGRATING a social graph to a site that is at least as useful and less annoying might be something much easier to do. I am glad to see some thoughtful competition in this space, the better to kee Facebook honest." I see some other comments on my Facebook threads and here on HN along the lines of using Facebook to first establish a network of friends, and then using the Next Great Thing in Social Networking to winnow that group of friends to get a dense network of closest friends. That might work for me.
  - HelenL14 17y ago
    That's an interesting way of looking at it, but you're still talking about "preference" of one over the other. Unless there's a new tool out there that can integrate everything for me, (even if I prefer FB/Buzz/Twitter/etc.) I'll still probably use all of them for those precise separate reasons. I think it'd be interesting to see how many NEW social network users Buzz will bring in, just because of the simple fact that it makes setting up a brand new network easy as pie (vs FB and having to build up to a nice little community of friends).
adam-_- 17y ago
Not many people in my "social circle" use gmail [that I know of] where as _everyone_ uses facebook... Also, in general, no one ever likes facebook UI updates, yet they never leave.
- robryan 17y ago
  I think for some people they have opposed so many UI updates on facebook that they no longer remember which UI they considered good.
mr_eel 17y ago
"It has been done before. Do you remember Prodigy? CompuServe? AOL? MySpace?" Yeah. Or Friendster. Of course it could happen, but my point is that it is too early to tell what impact Buzz will have. "Google has a fair chance of beating Facebook with Buzz" Agreed. But that time is not now and the hyperbole is unwarranted. As you say, steady gains are a possible -- and most likely -- way for Buzz to unseat Facebook.

rudin 17y ago

I am trying to migrate from Facebook to Buzz. From the look of things it suits me better. I never enjoyed Facebook that much as it seems there is a race to get the most friends and I find all the photo sharing a little disturbing.