5 ms·

Flattr: Social Micro Payments. Pirate Bay-guy one of founders.

33 points by erikstarck 17y ago

andrewcooke 17y ago
why the flat rate? i can see how it works for the business (people pay a regular, fixed amount; fees are less obvious), but i don't think it will be attractive to users - if i want to give something to someone i want to decide how much to give / know how much i am giving.
- yungchin 17y ago
  Clay Shirky wrote about this, see eg [1]. The idea is that you need to minimise the number of decisions people have to make, or they won't use the service much. You don't want to cause "decision friction" on every site and every month again. Kachingle [2] and Sprinklepenny [3] apply pretty much the same rules that are outlined in this video - it seems a point of convergence for this type of service... [1]: http://www.shirky.com/writings/fame_vs_fortune.html http://www.shirky.com/writings/fame_vs_fortune.html [2]: http://kachingle.com/ http://kachingle.com/ [3]: http://sprinklepenny.com/ http://sprinklepenny.com/
  - houseabsolute 17y ago
    If I were to use this system, I would probably write a userscript to search for a flattr connection on pages that I visit that would remind me to pay if I liked what I got.
makmanalp 17y ago
What is the revenue model for the company? percentage off of the monthly flat rate I assume?
vinhboy 17y ago
Thats an awesome idea. I would use it.
billclerico 17y ago
sounds like TipJoy (former YC company)...
labria 17y ago
This one could work. Or fail like the previous attempts. But I do like the flat rate idea. The only question I have: Can I give twice to the same provider? Like if I liked the video he did twice as much as another one, I would really like to be able to give him twice the money...
cameron7 17y ago
The piece this is missing (at least in the presentation) is that this concept needs to make it simple for people to find other people like the ones they want to contribute to. Similar to Amazon's "Other people who purchased this also purchased..."
wgj 17y ago
Another question is what happens if you don't "flattr" anyone within a month. Does the money roll over to the next month, or is it lost to the house?
- labria 17y ago
  Just flattr yourself each month, to be sure =)
patio11 17y ago
This is Contenture, with an extra barrier to conversion for each micropayment (clicking the Flattr button). It has every issue that makes Contenture a bad idea, squared. See here: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=607937 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=607937
- gojomo 17y ago
  This thread has a better point-counterpoint on the model: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=627679 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=627679 Obviously, Contenture got it wrong. I agree Flattr's required-clicks are wrong, too. I only heard about Kachingle and Sprinklepenny via this thread. Kachingle's limited-info flash-intro isn't confidence-inspiring. Sprinklepenny seems to understand more of what could appeal to readers (reallocate/retract funds) and publishers (detailed reporting). But I don't see any reference to creating a gradient to reward subscribers -- for example skipping a Salon-style interstitial -- and extra rewards for the sites that get people signed up. That's likely the key problem to solve to bootstrap a self-reinforcing cycle of site and reader enrollment.
deleted 17y ago
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33 points by erikstarck 17y ago

why the flat rate? i can see how it works for the business (people pay a regular, fixed amount; fees are less obvious), but i don't think it will be attractive to users - if i want to give something to someone i want to decide how much to give / know how much i am giving.

yungchin 17y ago
Clay Shirky wrote about this, see eg [1]. The idea is that you need to minimise the number of decisions people have to make, or they won't use the service much. You don't want to cause "decision friction" on every site and every month again. Kachingle [2] and Sprinklepenny [3] apply pretty much the same rules that are outlined in this video - it seems a point of convergence for this type of service... [1]: http://www.shirky.com/writings/fame_vs_fortune.html http://www.shirky.com/writings/fame_vs_fortune.html [2]: http://kachingle.com/ http://kachingle.com/ [3]: http://sprinklepenny.com/ http://sprinklepenny.com/
- houseabsolute 17y ago
  If I were to use this system, I would probably write a userscript to search for a flattr connection on pages that I visit that would remind me to pay if I liked what I got.

makmanalp 17y ago

What is the revenue model for the company? percentage off of the monthly flat rate I assume?

vinhboy 17y ago

Thats an awesome idea. I would use it.

billclerico 17y ago

sounds like TipJoy (former YC company)...

labria 17y ago

This one could work. Or fail like the previous attempts. But I do like the flat rate idea. The only question I have: Can I give twice to the same provider? Like if I liked the video he did twice as much as another one, I would really like to be able to give him twice the money...

cameron7 17y ago

The piece this is missing (at least in the presentation) is that this concept needs to make it simple for people to find other people like the ones they want to contribute to. Similar to Amazon's "Other people who purchased this also purchased..."

wgj 17y ago

Another question is what happens if you don't "flattr" anyone within a month. Does the money roll over to the next month, or is it lost to the house?

labria 17y ago
Just flattr yourself each month, to be sure =)

patio11 17y ago

This is Contenture, with an extra barrier to conversion for each micropayment (clicking the Flattr button). It has every issue that makes Contenture a bad idea, squared. See here: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=607937 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=607937

gojomo 17y ago
This thread has a better point-counterpoint on the model: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=627679 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=627679 Obviously, Contenture got it wrong. I agree Flattr's required-clicks are wrong, too. I only heard about Kachingle and Sprinklepenny via this thread. Kachingle's limited-info flash-intro isn't confidence-inspiring. Sprinklepenny seems to understand more of what could appeal to readers (reallocate/retract funds) and publishers (detailed reporting). But I don't see any reference to creating a gradient to reward subscribers -- for example skipping a Salon-style interstitial -- and extra rewards for the sites that get people signed up. That's likely the key problem to solve to bootstrap a self-reinforcing cycle of site and reader enrollment.

deleted 17y ago

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