9 ms·

Volvo recalls 59,000 cars over software fault

64 points by temp 11y ago

FreedomToCreate 11y ago
With cars essentially becoming computers that hold your life in there hands, its going to be interesting seeing how software development strategies evolve to build software rapidly but without the fall back of knowing you can simply send out a large firmware update to fix an issue. Cars can't afford to be stuck parked because someone made a small coding issue that got pushed before it was caught.
- digi_owl 11y ago
  https://boingboing.net/2012/08/23/civilwar.html https://boingboing.net/2012/08/23/civilwar.html And so far car manufacturers have done a piss poor job. Hell, they are even insisting on using dbus for IPC as they replace QNX with Linux.
- knappe 11y ago
  The space industry has been doing this for decades. NASA published 'The Power of Ten' with some guidelines. http://pixelscommander.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/P10.pdf http://pixelscommander.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/P10.pd... This was published _20_ years ago. http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff
benaston 11y ago
I'd double check the emissions readings before and after this "bug fix".
andreif 11y ago
We had a similar issue about half a year ago while driving 2016 XC60 D4 (i.e. 4 cylinders) on a highway. I guess they'll have more cars to recall.
- augustl 11y ago
  The D4 actually have 5 cylinders. All the DX motors on the XC60 has, the difference is in the cc.
pmarreck 11y ago
I'm sure the dealers are excited as hell about this (and non-software-updatable-over-the-air cars in general)
- newjersey 11y ago
  At least one of the configurations of the 2012 Ford Focus/Fiesta transmission had issues. The mechanic at the dealer agreed it was a problem. Ford never acknowledged their fault as far as I know. A firmware update about a year later seemingly fixed the issue. Why wouldn't they acknowledge the issue and tell people they're working on it? Liability issue?
  - nommm-nommm 11y ago
    >Ford never acknowledged their fault as far as I know. Yes they did, they sent letters out and and they extended the warranty on the transmission. Twice. http://www.mcall.com/news/local/watchdog/mc-ford-fiesta-transmission-lemon-law-watchdog-20150506-column.html http://www.mcall.com/news/local/watchdog/mc-ford-fiesta-tran... "Ford has acknowledged the potential for transmission problems in letters to owners and dealers. It has extended the warranty but has not recalled the vehicle."
- quicklyfrozen 11y ago
  I'm sure they are -- it's a nice little profit center for them (without even requiring any inventory).
swiley 11y ago
Critical firmware must be open source and public by law. Especially as it continues to take over more control of things like cars.
rogeryu 11y ago
>> The glitch had been reported by drivers of new Volvos who said the engine could cut out without warning, creating a brief absence of steering and braking. Created by Volvo - who wants to be death proof by 2020... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3409102/Volvo-promises-DEATHPROOF-cars-2020-Company-says-s-confident-technology-eradicate-fatal-crashes.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3409102/Volvo...
- Avshalom 11y ago
  Yes, that why they are recalling it.
k-mcgrady 11y ago
>> ">> The glitch had been reported by drivers of new Volvos who said the engine could cut out without warning, creating a brief absence of steering and braking." Do they just mean the power steering cuts out and brakes lose hydraulics? Because there's a pretty huge difference between that and 'a brief absence of steering and braking'.
- sbd01 11y ago
  Still, losing those functions is an issue. When it rains, my old Town & Country's power steering stops working and turns become difficult. I would hate to be driving and suddenly have it cut out on me, say, when I'm making a turn, or even just switching a few lanes.
- grogers 11y ago
  My power steering went out once. The car was drivable, but just barely. Likewise if you've ever pumped the brakes while the engine is off, you know that braking power drops to almost nothing. If that happened suddenly on the road 'loss of steering and brakes' is exactly how I would describe it. Sure it might not be completely accurate, but it is definitely a dangerous situation whatever you call it.
  - jacobreg 11y ago
    Eh, my car has a finicky engine and I've learned that it's perfectly drivable without power steering or brakes. I've lost power while taking tight turns, and while it was a bit surprising the first time or two I had no trouble keeping it under control. Unless the driver has significantly less strength than the average person, or is unwilling to drop whatever might be in their off hand to get it too the wheel, I'd say it's more scary than dangerous. That being said, I certainly wouldn't be happy if my new volvo did that; they should definitely be held to higher standards than my $500 beater.
    - Tiksi 11y ago
      Newer cars generally have a much lower steering ratio (forgot the actual term for it) so steering without the power assist is a lot more difficult since turning the wheel fully in one direction might be only 1 full rotation of the wheel on a newer car vs 3-4 on an older one. Newer cars are also generally heavier making it even more difficult to steer.
superuser2 11y ago
Why don't any of the luxury car brands (other than Lexus) focus on reliability? It seems so strange that the market is willing to pay ~$40-$80k for a car totally indifferent to its engineering quality. If I were to own a luxury car, I'd want to know its engineering is rock-solid first and foremost. I'd want to be proud of it as a machine not just a symbol. Maybe that's just a techie thing, though. Volvo has been notorious for extremely difficult-to-diagnose and expensive-to-repair electrical system problems for at least a decade.
- frik 11y ago
  > Why don't any of the luxury car brands (other than Lexus) focus on reliability The Mercedes-Benz/Puch G-Class hasn't changed that much since 1979. It's a mid-size four-wheel drive luxury SUV, a real cross country vehicle. Deer hunters, various military, VIPs, presidents and the pope, many use the G-Class. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_G-Class https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_G-Class
  - obelisk_ 11y ago
    I went and found a few images of this car and variations of it. http://blog.caranddriver.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/2015-Mercedes-Benz-G550-35th-Anniversary-Edition-PLACEMENT-626x382.jpg http://blog.caranddriver.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/2015... http://www.benzworld.org/forums/attachments/g-class/209746d1229037598-6x6-g-wagen-info-planning-possible-g-wagen-6x6-photo-3.jpg http://www.benzworld.org/forums/attachments/g-class/209746d1... http://olive-drab.com/images/id_mb_gclass_03_700.jpg http://olive-drab.com/images/id_mb_gclass_03_700.jpg http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--qAO8Ma4i--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18rhjuyh9idiqjpg.jpg http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--qAO8Ma4i... http://spintires-mods.lt/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Mercedes-Benz-Gelenwagen-63-6x6.jpg http://spintires-mods.lt/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Mercedes... (CGI) http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_DobFdTEMh3Y/TDoii7WEbZI/AAAAAAAABBQ/EB9q9IuwpSE/s1600/4.jpeg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_DobFdTEMh3Y/TDoii7WEbZI/AAAAAAAABB... http://cars-pics-db.com/pics/steyr-puch/steyr-puch-g-290/steyr-puch-g-290-07.jpg http://cars-pics-db.com/pics/steyr-puch/steyr-puch-g-290/ste... http://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/testdrive/gallery/1080/mercedes-benz-g-class-cabriolet-review-2013-1080p-3.jpg http://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/testdrive/gallery/108... http://car-from-uk.com/ebay/carphotos/full/ebay141670236996969.jpg http://car-from-uk.com/ebay/carphotos/full/ebay1416702369969... https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/4a/bc/16/4abc163c1e0ab31bbd8f4bf4d2cf18aa.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/4a/bc/16/4abc163c1... http://www.papercraftsquare.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Dubai-Police-Mercedes-Benz-G-Class-SUV-Vehicle-Paper-Model.jpg http://www.papercraftsquare.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/D... (Paper Model) https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/3d/84/04/3d84040cc82ac3262a60d95c7393484a.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/3d/84/04/3d84040cc... http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s---M1k3rjO--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18rhjuql33mr5jpg.jpg http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s---M1k3rjO...
cmurf 11y ago
Buy used. If you have a healthy budget, give it to a shop for an overhaul/rebuild, new upholstery, paint, etc. That'll still cost less than new, and no computer b.s.
- mikeash 11y ago
  No computer BS, and none of the safety improvements made in the intervening time. I don't understand why some people say that they prefer older cars because they're afraid the computers in newer ones will get them killed. Cars are overall much safer. Buy your older car, and sure, the computers won't kill you, but if and when you do crash it may well kill you where you could have walked away from it in a newer car.
  - cmurf 11y ago
    I'm not afraid the computer will get me killed. I'm also not afraid other drivers are going to get me killed. I agree the cars a much safer than 30 years ago. By older car I'm thinking something 15 years old or newer, so they still have computers in them, they still have most modern safety features, but they don't have full blown OS's with the most craptastic manufacturer proprietary UI's known to man that never get updated and never will be updated.
    - mikeash 11y ago
      OK, given the context of a safety recall I thought you were making a statement about safety.
      - cmurf 11y ago
        The safety potential, I recognize. In this case it's an inconvenience. And this transitional period we're in right now where cars can have major bugs like this, but still aren't autonomous (probably a good thing, in the context of this particular flaw) is something I personally don't want to be involved in. I understand the process won't be free of flaws, and good that Volvo isn't downplaying or hiding the issue. When the software is mature enough that it's not needing constant updates, and we're not concerned about needing an SLA for 10 or 20 or 30 years to keep car computers secure... OK fuck, I'm screwed it's going to be a long time before I can get a new car.
y04nn 11y ago
Is there any coding standards like in aviation (DO-178) for cars?
- reportingsjr 11y ago
  Yes. Check out MISRA: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Industry_Software_Reliability_Association https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Industry_Software_Reliab...
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- airplane 11y ago
  I don't know too much about vehicle side of things but my understanding is the following: MISRA is not on the same level as DO-178. DO-178 covers a lot of ground, from testing, documentation, requirements, that sort of thing, and it's made by a government agency which enforces it during certification, where every single hardware and software component in the aircraft related to flight operations is certified individually. So you will actually have engineers from the FAA sit down and look at code coverage, how requirements are written, how they map to tests, see if the tests cover a lot of cases in your requirements, see if the code implements the requirements, that sort of thing. MISRA on the other hand are treated like guidelines that car manufacturers generally want you to meet when you deliver them a vehicle component. There is the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards you have to meet on a vehicle as a whole, but I do not know if they have to prove that they meet the following during a formal certification process. http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/FMVSS/ http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/FMVSS/ So as far as I know, there's big approval process at the end for vehicles, while there's a formal certification process for all components in an aircraft, as well as a big approval process at the end for aircraft. Someone please correct and fill in the blanks for the vehicle side of things.
- cju 11y ago
  The scope is not the same as DO-178 but the nearest would be the Function Safety norm ISO 26262.
hyperpallium 11y ago
I have a theory that software is so hard, that internet startups win simply because they can actually do software, and thereby obtain its benefits. It's not that the start ups have such disruptive business models; but simply that software is great, and incumbents can't do it. Web startups are good at software because that's what they focus on, and are selected for. So we're in this strange situation where getting software to do it is more important than doing it. It's the flexibility. I'm afraid even my anecdatum is scanty: taxi calling is terrible. Uber could only be better.
tehlike 11y ago
Surprising that OTA is not gaining adoption in the automative industry.
kmeanscluster 11y ago
volvo pls
Animats 11y ago
Jeep had a very similar recall. I have a 2007 Jeep Wrangler, the first year of the major redesign. This was the first Wrangler with modern electronics, including stability control. In the first year, there were three recalls for software updates. The worst one was a tendency for the system to crash while going uphill at slow speed in hot weather. The crash caused the engine to quit and restart, the dashboard would blank, light up for self-test, and reset, the transmission would downshift, and the CD player would stop. However, everything did recover within one second. That sounds very similar to Volvo's problem.
mstade 11y ago
I've rented a Volvo V70 for the weekend that sounds like it's just the model that they're recalling. So far, no issues, and given the ice patches on the road today I'd hope it stays that way. It's a pretty cool car otherwise, lots of nifty features to make driving easier and safer, like adaptive cruise control, lane warnings, dead angle warnings, automatic break (at low speeds) when detecting obstacles, like a car suddenly stopping ahead. If this thing would steer by itself I wouldn't have to do anything – if this is the way of the future then sign me up!
- mstade 11y ago
  Update: I'm still alive, and the car returned. Never had an issue, so I guess the model wasn't affected or its not easily reproduced in the kind of casual cross country driving I did. Regardless – great car, 10/10 would rent again.
tonyferguson742 11y ago
How is this possible? How can such a massive car company make a mistake like this ..

64 points by temp 11y ago

With cars essentially becoming computers that hold your life in there hands, its going to be interesting seeing how software development strategies evolve to build software rapidly but without the fall back of knowing you can simply send out a large firmware update to fix an issue. Cars can't afford to be stuck parked because someone made a small coding issue that got pushed before it was caught.

digi_owl 11y ago
https://boingboing.net/2012/08/23/civilwar.html https://boingboing.net/2012/08/23/civilwar.html And so far car manufacturers have done a piss poor job. Hell, they are even insisting on using dbus for IPC as they replace QNX with Linux.
knappe 11y ago
The space industry has been doing this for decades. NASA published 'The Power of Ten' with some guidelines. http://pixelscommander.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/P10.pdf http://pixelscommander.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/P10.pd... This was published _20_ years ago. http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff http://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff

benaston 11y ago

I'd double check the emissions readings before and after this "bug fix".

andreif 11y ago

We had a similar issue about half a year ago while driving 2016 XC60 D4 (i.e. 4 cylinders) on a highway. I guess they'll have more cars to recall.

augustl 11y ago
The D4 actually have 5 cylinders. All the DX motors on the XC60 has, the difference is in the cc.

pmarreck 11y ago

I'm sure the dealers are excited as hell about this (and non-software-updatable-over-the-air cars in general)

newjersey 11y ago
At least one of the configurations of the 2012 Ford Focus/Fiesta transmission had issues. The mechanic at the dealer agreed it was a problem. Ford never acknowledged their fault as far as I know. A firmware update about a year later seemingly fixed the issue. Why wouldn't they acknowledge the issue and tell people they're working on it? Liability issue?
- nommm-nommm 11y ago
  >Ford never acknowledged their fault as far as I know. Yes they did, they sent letters out and and they extended the warranty on the transmission. Twice. http://www.mcall.com/news/local/watchdog/mc-ford-fiesta-transmission-lemon-law-watchdog-20150506-column.html http://www.mcall.com/news/local/watchdog/mc-ford-fiesta-tran... "Ford has acknowledged the potential for transmission problems in letters to owners and dealers. It has extended the warranty but has not recalled the vehicle."
quicklyfrozen 11y ago
I'm sure they are -- it's a nice little profit center for them (without even requiring any inventory).

swiley 11y ago

Critical firmware must be open source and public by law. Especially as it continues to take over more control of things like cars.

rogeryu 11y ago

>> The glitch had been reported by drivers of new Volvos who said the engine could cut out without warning, creating a brief absence of steering and braking. Created by Volvo - who wants to be death proof by 2020... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3409102/Volvo-promises-DEATHPROOF-cars-2020-Company-says-s-confident-technology-eradicate-fatal-crashes.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3409102/Volvo...

Avshalom 11y ago
Yes, that why they are recalling it.

k-mcgrady 11y ago

>> ">> The glitch had been reported by drivers of new Volvos who said the engine could cut out without warning, creating a brief absence of steering and braking." Do they just mean the power steering cuts out and brakes lose hydraulics? Because there's a pretty huge difference between that and 'a brief absence of steering and braking'.

sbd01 11y ago
Still, losing those functions is an issue. When it rains, my old Town & Country's power steering stops working and turns become difficult. I would hate to be driving and suddenly have it cut out on me, say, when I'm making a turn, or even just switching a few lanes.
grogers 11y ago
My power steering went out once. The car was drivable, but just barely. Likewise if you've ever pumped the brakes while the engine is off, you know that braking power drops to almost nothing. If that happened suddenly on the road 'loss of steering and brakes' is exactly how I would describe it. Sure it might not be completely accurate, but it is definitely a dangerous situation whatever you call it.
- jacobreg 11y ago
  Eh, my car has a finicky engine and I've learned that it's perfectly drivable without power steering or brakes. I've lost power while taking tight turns, and while it was a bit surprising the first time or two I had no trouble keeping it under control. Unless the driver has significantly less strength than the average person, or is unwilling to drop whatever might be in their off hand to get it too the wheel, I'd say it's more scary than dangerous. That being said, I certainly wouldn't be happy if my new volvo did that; they should definitely be held to higher standards than my $500 beater.
  - Tiksi 11y ago
    Newer cars generally have a much lower steering ratio (forgot the actual term for it) so steering without the power assist is a lot more difficult since turning the wheel fully in one direction might be only 1 full rotation of the wheel on a newer car vs 3-4 on an older one. Newer cars are also generally heavier making it even more difficult to steer.

superuser2 11y ago

Why don't any of the luxury car brands (other than Lexus) focus on reliability? It seems so strange that the market is willing to pay ~$40-$80k for a car totally indifferent to its engineering quality. If I were to own a luxury car, I'd want to know its engineering is rock-solid first and foremost. I'd want to be proud of it as a machine not just a symbol. Maybe that's just a techie thing, though. Volvo has been notorious for extremely difficult-to-diagnose and expensive-to-repair electrical system problems for at least a decade.

frik 11y ago
> Why don't any of the luxury car brands (other than Lexus) focus on reliability The Mercedes-Benz/Puch G-Class hasn't changed that much since 1979. It's a mid-size four-wheel drive luxury SUV, a real cross country vehicle. Deer hunters, various military, VIPs, presidents and the pope, many use the G-Class. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_G-Class https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_G-Class
- obelisk_ 11y ago
  I went and found a few images of this car and variations of it. http://blog.caranddriver.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/2015-Mercedes-Benz-G550-35th-Anniversary-Edition-PLACEMENT-626x382.jpg http://blog.caranddriver.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/2015... http://www.benzworld.org/forums/attachments/g-class/209746d1229037598-6x6-g-wagen-info-planning-possible-g-wagen-6x6-photo-3.jpg http://www.benzworld.org/forums/attachments/g-class/209746d1... http://olive-drab.com/images/id_mb_gclass_03_700.jpg http://olive-drab.com/images/id_mb_gclass_03_700.jpg http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--qAO8Ma4i--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18rhjuyh9idiqjpg.jpg http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--qAO8Ma4i... http://spintires-mods.lt/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Mercedes-Benz-Gelenwagen-63-6x6.jpg http://spintires-mods.lt/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Mercedes... (CGI) http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_DobFdTEMh3Y/TDoii7WEbZI/AAAAAAAABBQ/EB9q9IuwpSE/s1600/4.jpeg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_DobFdTEMh3Y/TDoii7WEbZI/AAAAAAAABB... http://cars-pics-db.com/pics/steyr-puch/steyr-puch-g-290/steyr-puch-g-290-07.jpg http://cars-pics-db.com/pics/steyr-puch/steyr-puch-g-290/ste... http://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/testdrive/gallery/1080/mercedes-benz-g-class-cabriolet-review-2013-1080p-3.jpg http://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/images/testdrive/gallery/108... http://car-from-uk.com/ebay/carphotos/full/ebay141670236996969.jpg http://car-from-uk.com/ebay/carphotos/full/ebay1416702369969... https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/4a/bc/16/4abc163c1e0ab31bbd8f4bf4d2cf18aa.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/4a/bc/16/4abc163c1... http://www.papercraftsquare.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Dubai-Police-Mercedes-Benz-G-Class-SUV-Vehicle-Paper-Model.jpg http://www.papercraftsquare.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/D... (Paper Model) https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/3d/84/04/3d84040cc82ac3262a60d95c7393484a.jpg https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/3d/84/04/3d84040cc... http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s---M1k3rjO--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/18rhjuql33mr5jpg.jpg http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s---M1k3rjO...

cmurf 11y ago

Buy used. If you have a healthy budget, give it to a shop for an overhaul/rebuild, new upholstery, paint, etc. That'll still cost less than new, and no computer b.s.

mikeash 11y ago
No computer BS, and none of the safety improvements made in the intervening time. I don't understand why some people say that they prefer older cars because they're afraid the computers in newer ones will get them killed. Cars are overall much safer. Buy your older car, and sure, the computers won't kill you, but if and when you do crash it may well kill you where you could have walked away from it in a newer car.
- cmurf 11y ago
  I'm not afraid the computer will get me killed. I'm also not afraid other drivers are going to get me killed. I agree the cars a much safer than 30 years ago. By older car I'm thinking something 15 years old or newer, so they still have computers in them, they still have most modern safety features, but they don't have full blown OS's with the most craptastic manufacturer proprietary UI's known to man that never get updated and never will be updated.
  - mikeash 11y ago
    OK, given the context of a safety recall I thought you were making a statement about safety.
    - cmurf 11y ago
      The safety potential, I recognize. In this case it's an inconvenience. And this transitional period we're in right now where cars can have major bugs like this, but still aren't autonomous (probably a good thing, in the context of this particular flaw) is something I personally don't want to be involved in. I understand the process won't be free of flaws, and good that Volvo isn't downplaying or hiding the issue. When the software is mature enough that it's not needing constant updates, and we're not concerned about needing an SLA for 10 or 20 or 30 years to keep car computers secure... OK fuck, I'm screwed it's going to be a long time before I can get a new car.

y04nn 11y ago

Is there any coding standards like in aviation (DO-178) for cars?

reportingsjr 11y ago
Yes. Check out MISRA: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Industry_Software_Reliability_Association https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Industry_Software_Reliab...
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
airplane 11y ago
I don't know too much about vehicle side of things but my understanding is the following: MISRA is not on the same level as DO-178. DO-178 covers a lot of ground, from testing, documentation, requirements, that sort of thing, and it's made by a government agency which enforces it during certification, where every single hardware and software component in the aircraft related to flight operations is certified individually. So you will actually have engineers from the FAA sit down and look at code coverage, how requirements are written, how they map to tests, see if the tests cover a lot of cases in your requirements, see if the code implements the requirements, that sort of thing. MISRA on the other hand are treated like guidelines that car manufacturers generally want you to meet when you deliver them a vehicle component. There is the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards you have to meet on a vehicle as a whole, but I do not know if they have to prove that they meet the following during a formal certification process. http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/FMVSS/ http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/FMVSS/ So as far as I know, there's big approval process at the end for vehicles, while there's a formal certification process for all components in an aircraft, as well as a big approval process at the end for aircraft. Someone please correct and fill in the blanks for the vehicle side of things.
cju 11y ago
The scope is not the same as DO-178 but the nearest would be the Function Safety norm ISO 26262.

hyperpallium 11y ago

I have a theory that software is so hard, that internet startups win simply because they can actually do software, and thereby obtain its benefits. It's not that the start ups have such disruptive business models; but simply that software is great, and incumbents can't do it. Web startups are good at software because that's what they focus on, and are selected for. So we're in this strange situation where getting software to do it is more important than doing it. It's the flexibility. I'm afraid even my anecdatum is scanty: taxi calling is terrible. Uber could only be better.

tehlike 11y ago

Surprising that OTA is not gaining adoption in the automative industry.

kmeanscluster 11y ago

volvo pls

Animats 11y ago

Jeep had a very similar recall. I have a 2007 Jeep Wrangler, the first year of the major redesign. This was the first Wrangler with modern electronics, including stability control. In the first year, there were three recalls for software updates. The worst one was a tendency for the system to crash while going uphill at slow speed in hot weather. The crash caused the engine to quit and restart, the dashboard would blank, light up for self-test, and reset, the transmission would downshift, and the CD player would stop. However, everything did recover within one second. That sounds very similar to Volvo's problem.

mstade 11y ago

I've rented a Volvo V70 for the weekend that sounds like it's just the model that they're recalling. So far, no issues, and given the ice patches on the road today I'd hope it stays that way. It's a pretty cool car otherwise, lots of nifty features to make driving easier and safer, like adaptive cruise control, lane warnings, dead angle warnings, automatic break (at low speeds) when detecting obstacles, like a car suddenly stopping ahead. If this thing would steer by itself I wouldn't have to do anything – if this is the way of the future then sign me up!

mstade 11y ago
Update: I'm still alive, and the car returned. Never had an issue, so I guess the model wasn't affected or its not easily reproduced in the kind of casual cross country driving I did. Regardless – great car, 10/10 would rent again.

tonyferguson742 11y ago

How is this possible? How can such a massive car company make a mistake like this ..