5 ms·

I'd disagree on that last part - I'd say that if you're not making a crazy salary his advice is even more valuable. Most people spend an obscene amount of money

by kdamken 11y ago

I'd disagree on that last part - I'd say that if you're not making a crazy salary his advice is even more valuable. Most people spend an obscene amount of money on things they don't actually really need. Some classic examples: A $3 coffee everyday adds up to about $90 a month, when you can usually just drink free coffee from your office or buy some cheap pre-ground stuff. Spending $5-6 for lunch each day at work can easily add up to another $100+ dollars a month, when you could just make a bunch of peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and spend a fraction of that. So there's close to $200 a month, right there. If you're trying to retire early, it's definitely way tougher on a lower salary. But improving your spending habits is an important skill for everyone, especially for those making less.

charlesdm 11y ago
This is the best way to get depressed. It's always significantly easier to negotiate a $1k raise than it is to reduce your spending on basic stuff by $1k. Focus on earning more, not saving (on useless expenses).
- kdamken 11y ago
  I like buying stuff as much as the next guy, but if not buying things you don't need would make you depressed, you probably have deeper issues that need addressing.
  - charlesdm 11y ago
    If you want to save money, do it on large purchases. Buying a $30k car? Negotiate aggressively so you can buy it for $23-25k. Anything above a few $100 is worth haggling over. Do you know how many people pay the listing price of a car, yet cut coupons to save a few euros/dollars? A lot. It's ridiculous. Some of the joys in life are simple things, such as drinking a $2-3 coffee or having a cocktail in a nice bar, etc.
    - Ocerge 11y ago
      Absolutely. I fully recognize my $2.50 americano every morning could be a couple of cups of free office coffee, but I look forward to it every single day. I also drive a 10-year-old but reliable car, so I don't have any huge monthly expenditures outside of rent and my $150 student loan payment. I'll take the $100 or so hit every month in exchange for me starting my mornings on a positive note. It's not going to positively change my life enough to not have that americano every morning.
      - kdamken 11y ago
        Playing devils advocate here: you're spending $1200 a year on coffee. With that money you could not only buy a really nice coffee machine and make it yourself every morning, but also have a bunch of money leftover to put towards your loans, invest, put towards a nice vacation, etc. The idea is that those small daily expenses tend to add up, and there may be a lot more of them than you realized.
        joverholt 11y ago
        Also, buy a coffee roaster and roast your own beans. There are lots of ways to get started on the cheap (popcorn air roaster), and unroasted coffee is around $5-$6 a pound. It's a very rewarding hobby. http://sweetmarias.com http://sweetmarias.com is a great place to get started.
        billmalarky 11y ago
        Reminds me of the old joke: "If you had stopped smoking 10 years ago you could afford to be driving around in a Ferrari right now." "Do you smoke?" "No." "Then where's your Ferrari?" Point is don't sweat the small things. Sure they add up, but you should dedicate a portion of your cash flow towards investments at the start of the pay cycle, not "what's left at the end." Then the rest can be spent on anything arbitrarily with a clear conscious.
- bwbmr 11y ago
  I'm reminded of http://www.theonion.com/article/man-brings-lunch-from-home-to-cut-down-on-small-jo-37912 http://www.theonion.com/article/man-brings-lunch-from-home-t...
- phamilton 11y ago
  Or both. The MMM philosophy isn't to deprive yourself. It's to learn to find satisfaction without the high cost. Personally, I hate eating out every day. Packing a tupperware with leftovers is much more my style. I save about a thousand a year because of this, but I don't feel deprived at all.
- ohitsdom 11y ago
  If you don't have any sort of budget, making more won't solve your problems.
- kamaal 11y ago
  >>This is the best way to get depressed. It's always significantly easier to negotiate a $1k raise than it is to reduce your spending on basic stuff by $1k. Ideally. But in reality with bad habits you will spend that extra $1K you started earning. >>Focus on earning more, not saving (on useless expenses). Both. Without discipline its all useless. Why else do you think so many athletes or lottery winners lose those millions?
- dublidu 11y ago
  For an average American with household income $50k, getting a $1k raise (after tax) is probably not trivial. For techies in SF, definitely spend time on building your career, negotiating compensation, and try to save on rent.

by kdamken 11y ago

charlesdm 11y ago

This is the best way to get depressed. It's always significantly easier to negotiate a $1k raise than it is to reduce your spending on basic stuff by $1k. Focus on earning more, not saving (on useless expenses).

kdamken 11y ago
I like buying stuff as much as the next guy, but if not buying things you don't need would make you depressed, you probably have deeper issues that need addressing.
- charlesdm 11y ago
  If you want to save money, do it on large purchases. Buying a $30k car? Negotiate aggressively so you can buy it for $23-25k. Anything above a few $100 is worth haggling over. Do you know how many people pay the listing price of a car, yet cut coupons to save a few euros/dollars? A lot. It's ridiculous. Some of the joys in life are simple things, such as drinking a $2-3 coffee or having a cocktail in a nice bar, etc.
  - Ocerge 11y ago
    Absolutely. I fully recognize my $2.50 americano every morning could be a couple of cups of free office coffee, but I look forward to it every single day. I also drive a 10-year-old but reliable car, so I don't have any huge monthly expenditures outside of rent and my $150 student loan payment. I'll take the $100 or so hit every month in exchange for me starting my mornings on a positive note. It's not going to positively change my life enough to not have that americano every morning.
    - kdamken 11y ago
      Playing devils advocate here: you're spending $1200 a year on coffee. With that money you could not only buy a really nice coffee machine and make it yourself every morning, but also have a bunch of money leftover to put towards your loans, invest, put towards a nice vacation, etc. The idea is that those small daily expenses tend to add up, and there may be a lot more of them than you realized.
      - joverholt 11y ago
        Also, buy a coffee roaster and roast your own beans. There are lots of ways to get started on the cheap (popcorn air roaster), and unroasted coffee is around $5-$6 a pound. It's a very rewarding hobby. http://sweetmarias.com http://sweetmarias.com is a great place to get started.
      - billmalarky 11y ago
        Reminds me of the old joke: "If you had stopped smoking 10 years ago you could afford to be driving around in a Ferrari right now." "Do you smoke?" "No." "Then where's your Ferrari?" Point is don't sweat the small things. Sure they add up, but you should dedicate a portion of your cash flow towards investments at the start of the pay cycle, not "what's left at the end." Then the rest can be spent on anything arbitrarily with a clear conscious.
bwbmr 11y ago
I'm reminded of http://www.theonion.com/article/man-brings-lunch-from-home-to-cut-down-on-small-jo-37912 http://www.theonion.com/article/man-brings-lunch-from-home-t...
phamilton 11y ago
Or both. The MMM philosophy isn't to deprive yourself. It's to learn to find satisfaction without the high cost. Personally, I hate eating out every day. Packing a tupperware with leftovers is much more my style. I save about a thousand a year because of this, but I don't feel deprived at all.
ohitsdom 11y ago
If you don't have any sort of budget, making more won't solve your problems.
kamaal 11y ago
>>This is the best way to get depressed. It's always significantly easier to negotiate a $1k raise than it is to reduce your spending on basic stuff by $1k. Ideally. But in reality with bad habits you will spend that extra $1K you started earning. >>Focus on earning more, not saving (on useless expenses). Both. Without discipline its all useless. Why else do you think so many athletes or lottery winners lose those millions?
dublidu 11y ago
For an average American with household income $50k, getting a $1k raise (after tax) is probably not trivial. For techies in SF, definitely spend time on building your career, negotiating compensation, and try to save on rent.