8 ms·

Bosses Harness Big Data to Predict Which Workers Might Get Sick

76 points by uptown 11y ago

falcolas 11y ago
I couldn't get past the paywall, but let me take a rough guess: those working in an open office after an illness hits the schools were most susceptible. First the parents, then a few waves of those who caught it from them. Based on experience from the last few months, two major illnesses (one viral, one bacterial) flowed through the schools and into the parents, who came to work and subsequently took out 3/4 the workforce. Nothing unexpected, sadly.
- DanBC 11y ago
  No, your post has nothing to do with the article, which starts with people getting back surgery (or not) depending on which doctors they see. Walmart spotted that, and decided to see if they can predict other stuff. They now send messages to people "at risk of diabetes" > Employee wellness firms and insurers are working with companies to mine data about the prescription drugs workers use, how they shop and even whether they vote, to predict their individual health needs and recommend treatments. > Trying to stem rising health-care costs, some companies, including retailer Wal-Mart Stores Inc., are paying firms like Castlight Healthcare Inc. to collect and crunch employee data to identify, for example, which workers are at risk for diabetes, and target them with personalized messages nudging them toward a doctor or services such as weight-loss programs. It has some other stuff too: > Welltok Inc., whose clients include Colorado’s state employees, has found that people who vote in midterm elections tend to be healthier than those who skip them, says Chris Coloian, the firm’s chief solutions officer. There are plenty of risks: > “There are enormous potential risks” in these efforts, such as the exposure of personal health data to employers or others,” says Frank Pasquale, a law professor at the University of Maryland, who studies health privacy. I'm reminded of the supermarket loyalty card scheme that was outing pregnant women to their family by sending them vouchers for baby products (nappies etc). Some of these women were young adults living with their parents. (I can only find a link to a US story about Target: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.html?pagewanted=1&_r=3&ref=charlesduhigg http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.h... But I think it's happened in the UK with Boots too.)
  - tomjen3 11y ago
    There is also the risk of ruining the signal. If people who vote are more likely to do that because they are less likely to be depressed and non-depressed individuals are more likely to take care of themselves, then encouraging people to vote will only ruin the value of knowing if they are likely to vote, it won't cause anybody to need less health care.
  - johnward 11y ago
    We get random boxes of baby formula and wipes after having a registry at target. side note: It's pretty hard to have a decent discussion when pay wall links hit the front page. Half of us can't even read them. There is probably a way around it but not worth my time.
    - hyperpape 11y ago
      I looked up workarounds today, and it's as simple as googling the article title, then clicking the link.
      - DanBC 11y ago
        Or, on HN, clicking the "web" link, and then clicking one of the results.
        johnward 11y ago
        Did not know the web link trick.
- ska 11y ago
  I couldn't get past the paywall, but let me take a rough guess Why? It's never likely to add much value, but quite likely to be pointless. (and unsurprisingly, you were completely off base)
- cmsmith 11y ago
  >Nothing unexpected, sadly. It shouldn't be too surprising that the version of the article you made up in your own mind said what you expected it to say.
braythwayt 11y ago
So... Can employers use this to predict which employees might become depressed? How about which employees might get pregnant? (https://twitter.com/mims/status/699964784783990789 https://twitter.com/mims/status/699964784783990789)? It’s a Brave New World of work. At Walmart, of course.
- HillRat 11y ago
  If the wellness program is offered as part of a group health plan, then the wellness-plan provider is a business associate of a covered entity under HIPAA, and PHI protection applies. So in these cases, the employer cannot have access to individual employees' health information and, more to the point, they usually don't want it -- they're trying to cut overall costs, not individual employees. Having said that, I do think that more robust legislative firewalls are needed to prevent companies from trying to push the envelope in accessing individual employees' records (HIPAA controls covered entities' actions, but not employers').
  - braythwayt 11y ago
    Thank you for the elucidation. This is the kind of quality reply that makes HN great.
  - Lawtonfogle 11y ago
    The problem is that you do have employers wanting to target individual employees and that just because something is illegal doesn't mean it won't happen. An employer could use this to identify what employees are about to become pregnant and then find reasons to fire them. And given that being fired is likely to change their chance of choosing to become pregnant, it becomes significantly harder to prove this was an illegal targeted attack instead of a justified firing of an employee who was violating policy (and given how policies are written, workplace policies are treated like laws these days where everyone is violating some policies and they are only selectively enforced). Add in that this is most likely to be deployed against lower income people if it is deployed, and that those it is deployed against will be in a very poor condition to fight back (hiring a lawyer right after losing a job isn't something most can afford), you have a nasty discrimination disaster ready to happen (or in reality, ready to be made worse than it currently is).
uptown 11y ago
"Castlight recently launched a new product that scans insurance claims to find women who have stopped filling birth-control prescriptions, as well as women who have made fertility-related searches on Castlight’s health app."
- kafkaesq 11y ago
  Profoundly creepy.
  - maratd 11y ago
    I think that's an understatement. Unless that data is completely anonymized, isn't it a violation of HIPAA? Isn't this illegal?
    - fuhrysteve 11y ago
      HIPAA is probably a stretch - but certainly sounds like someone's asking for an employment lawsuit.
    - dragonwriter 11y ago
      > Unless that data is completely anonymized, isn't it a violation of HIPAA? It sounds to me from reading various articles that Castlight is used in various ways, including to provide information and recommendations to employees. This use is probably fine under HIPAA. Information that gets sent back to employers that uses PHI from insurance claims, absent specific consent for the use intended, would seem on first glance to be a HIPAA violation on the part of the insurer. And, actually using it in a discriminatory way (which paying to gather it would be prima facie, though not dispositive, evidence of) would violate a whole lot of employment law on the employers part.
      - riahi 11y ago
        Correct. PHI coming from insurance claims absent a signed HIPAA release for uses related beyond "treatment/medical education, payment, and operations" would be a HIPAA violation on the part of the insurance company. Employers themselves are not HIPAA-covered entities. Insurers are however.
minikites 11y ago
"We're not firing you because you're pregnant, we're firing you to cut costs!"
- cmdrfred 11y ago
  PS. We're are going to claim your work was sub-par to also save on unemployment!
- Avshalom 11y ago
  They're trying to kill me," Yossarian told him calmly. No one's trying to kill you," Clevinger cried. Then why are they shooting at me?" Yossarian asked. They're shooting at everyone," Clevinger answered. "They're trying to kill everyone." And what difference does that make?
  - OneOneOneOne 11y ago
    Catch-22
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- Lawtonfogle 11y ago
  That would still give them unemployment benefits. We are firing them because they violated policies A (must be on time), D subsection 12 (no personal internet use), and Q subsection 7 clause 3 (15 minute break per every 4 hour shift). (That most people are allowed to get away with minor violations of the above as long as they are productive, that the fired employee was productive enough that we would've continued to ignore their minor violations, and that they are actually being targeted because we have information to indicate they are trying to become pregnant is going to be near impossible to prove. Especially since the fired employee is now unemployed and not likely able to afford the legal battle.)
danvoell 11y ago
Should we swap out "Big Data" for "Personal Information" or "Spying" in the title of this article?
- sageabilly 11y ago
  How is it spying if it's information that's already available to the company, either publicly or as a result of the person being an employee? It's not like they're sending goons to dig through trash cans.
  - danvoell 11y ago
    Sorry, I agree, spying may be a stretch. But so too is Big Data. It doesn't take a complex algorithm to determine IsBuyingBirthControl vs. IsNotBuyingBirthControl. I would like to think that I have the option to keep this information private from my employer. The employer's best interest is to minimize costs not to improve my health, most of the time these two correspond but not always.
    - bduerst 11y ago
      Whether or not it's called big data is non-sequitur. Employers have had access to claims data before the tools were available to process it en mass.
  - bootload 11y ago
    "How is it spying if it's information that's already available to the company, either publicly or as a result of the person being an employee?" Inference might be a better word.
kelvin0 11y ago
Simple, we also need a : 'Employees Harness big data to predict which employers are most likely to do crummy predictions'
kafkaesq 11y ago
...whilst maintaining the conditions that actually make them sick.
thanatropism 11y ago
Ever heard about the manager who figured that about 40% of sick leaves take place on Mondays or Fridays?
FussyZeus 11y ago
No amount of Economic benefit is worth the invasiveness of these practices. My boss doesn't need to know what medications I'm on, what kind of food I eat, or how many videogames I'm buying. If it's not occurring on company time it's none of his business, end of discussion. This creepy ass practice needs to be stopped now. If my employer ever tries anything like this, I will quit on the spot. No redemption, no change, nothing will bring me back because once it's been done one time, it WILL be done again.
- FussyZeus 11y ago
  Sidebar: This is why I much prefer working at a small business where employees are treated like people, not resources to be extracted and then cast aside when they no longer produce enough.
  - untog 11y ago
    This is why, after years of living in the US, it still staggers me that people think your employer controlling your access to healthcare is normal and not anything to be concerned about.
zodPod 11y ago
So all I have to do is vote in a mid-term election and I'll be healthier?! </s>
adenner 11y ago
This version of the article wasn't paywalled for me: http://www.nasdaq.com/article/bosses-harness-big-data-to-predict-which-workers-might-get-sick-20160216-01321 http://www.nasdaq.com/article/bosses-harness-big-data-to-pre... It is great to think that my employer is paying for this but just got rid of our gym membership reimbursement.
- brazzledazzle 11y ago
  Either good ol' right hand/left hand lack of coordination/direction/information sharing or it wasn't "cost effective". Either way, you have to love corporate bullshit.
the_economist 11y ago
Hint: those workers who regularly stay out all night drinking alcohol will miss many more days of work.
AstralStorm 11y ago
Harness big data, such as typical flu season dates? Or maybe weather forecast? What, do you need precision down to the last day for planning purposes?

76 points by uptown 11y ago

I couldn't get past the paywall, but let me take a rough guess: those working in an open office after an illness hits the schools were most susceptible. First the parents, then a few waves of those who caught it from them. Based on experience from the last few months, two major illnesses (one viral, one bacterial) flowed through the schools and into the parents, who came to work and subsequently took out 3/4 the workforce. Nothing unexpected, sadly.

DanBC 11y ago
No, your post has nothing to do with the article, which starts with people getting back surgery (or not) depending on which doctors they see. Walmart spotted that, and decided to see if they can predict other stuff. They now send messages to people "at risk of diabetes" > Employee wellness firms and insurers are working with companies to mine data about the prescription drugs workers use, how they shop and even whether they vote, to predict their individual health needs and recommend treatments. > Trying to stem rising health-care costs, some companies, including retailer Wal-Mart Stores Inc., are paying firms like Castlight Healthcare Inc. to collect and crunch employee data to identify, for example, which workers are at risk for diabetes, and target them with personalized messages nudging them toward a doctor or services such as weight-loss programs. It has some other stuff too: > Welltok Inc., whose clients include Colorado’s state employees, has found that people who vote in midterm elections tend to be healthier than those who skip them, says Chris Coloian, the firm’s chief solutions officer. There are plenty of risks: > “There are enormous potential risks” in these efforts, such as the exposure of personal health data to employers or others,” says Frank Pasquale, a law professor at the University of Maryland, who studies health privacy. I'm reminded of the supermarket loyalty card scheme that was outing pregnant women to their family by sending them vouchers for baby products (nappies etc). Some of these women were young adults living with their parents. (I can only find a link to a US story about Target: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.html?pagewanted=1&_r=3&ref=charlesduhigg http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/magazine/shopping-habits.h... But I think it's happened in the UK with Boots too.)
- tomjen3 11y ago
  There is also the risk of ruining the signal. If people who vote are more likely to do that because they are less likely to be depressed and non-depressed individuals are more likely to take care of themselves, then encouraging people to vote will only ruin the value of knowing if they are likely to vote, it won't cause anybody to need less health care.
- johnward 11y ago
  We get random boxes of baby formula and wipes after having a registry at target. side note: It's pretty hard to have a decent discussion when pay wall links hit the front page. Half of us can't even read them. There is probably a way around it but not worth my time.
  - hyperpape 11y ago
    I looked up workarounds today, and it's as simple as googling the article title, then clicking the link.
    - DanBC 11y ago
      Or, on HN, clicking the "web" link, and then clicking one of the results.
      - johnward 11y ago
        Did not know the web link trick.
ska 11y ago
I couldn't get past the paywall, but let me take a rough guess Why? It's never likely to add much value, but quite likely to be pointless. (and unsurprisingly, you were completely off base)
cmsmith 11y ago
>Nothing unexpected, sadly. It shouldn't be too surprising that the version of the article you made up in your own mind said what you expected it to say.

braythwayt 11y ago

So... Can employers use this to predict which employees might become depressed? How about which employees might get pregnant? (https://twitter.com/mims/status/699964784783990789 https://twitter.com/mims/status/699964784783990789)? It’s a Brave New World of work. At Walmart, of course.

HillRat 11y ago
If the wellness program is offered as part of a group health plan, then the wellness-plan provider is a business associate of a covered entity under HIPAA, and PHI protection applies. So in these cases, the employer cannot have access to individual employees' health information and, more to the point, they usually don't want it -- they're trying to cut overall costs, not individual employees. Having said that, I do think that more robust legislative firewalls are needed to prevent companies from trying to push the envelope in accessing individual employees' records (HIPAA controls covered entities' actions, but not employers').
- braythwayt 11y ago
  Thank you for the elucidation. This is the kind of quality reply that makes HN great.
- Lawtonfogle 11y ago
  The problem is that you do have employers wanting to target individual employees and that just because something is illegal doesn't mean it won't happen. An employer could use this to identify what employees are about to become pregnant and then find reasons to fire them. And given that being fired is likely to change their chance of choosing to become pregnant, it becomes significantly harder to prove this was an illegal targeted attack instead of a justified firing of an employee who was violating policy (and given how policies are written, workplace policies are treated like laws these days where everyone is violating some policies and they are only selectively enforced). Add in that this is most likely to be deployed against lower income people if it is deployed, and that those it is deployed against will be in a very poor condition to fight back (hiring a lawyer right after losing a job isn't something most can afford), you have a nasty discrimination disaster ready to happen (or in reality, ready to be made worse than it currently is).

uptown 11y ago

"Castlight recently launched a new product that scans insurance claims to find women who have stopped filling birth-control prescriptions, as well as women who have made fertility-related searches on Castlight’s health app."

kafkaesq 11y ago
Profoundly creepy.
- maratd 11y ago
  I think that's an understatement. Unless that data is completely anonymized, isn't it a violation of HIPAA? Isn't this illegal?
  - fuhrysteve 11y ago
    HIPAA is probably a stretch - but certainly sounds like someone's asking for an employment lawsuit.
  - dragonwriter 11y ago
    > Unless that data is completely anonymized, isn't it a violation of HIPAA? It sounds to me from reading various articles that Castlight is used in various ways, including to provide information and recommendations to employees. This use is probably fine under HIPAA. Information that gets sent back to employers that uses PHI from insurance claims, absent specific consent for the use intended, would seem on first glance to be a HIPAA violation on the part of the insurer. And, actually using it in a discriminatory way (which paying to gather it would be prima facie, though not dispositive, evidence of) would violate a whole lot of employment law on the employers part.
    - riahi 11y ago
      Correct. PHI coming from insurance claims absent a signed HIPAA release for uses related beyond "treatment/medical education, payment, and operations" would be a HIPAA violation on the part of the insurance company. Employers themselves are not HIPAA-covered entities. Insurers are however.

minikites 11y ago

"We're not firing you because you're pregnant, we're firing you to cut costs!"

cmdrfred 11y ago
PS. We're are going to claim your work was sub-par to also save on unemployment!
Avshalom 11y ago
They're trying to kill me," Yossarian told him calmly. No one's trying to kill you," Clevinger cried. Then why are they shooting at me?" Yossarian asked. They're shooting at everyone," Clevinger answered. "They're trying to kill everyone." And what difference does that make?
- OneOneOneOne 11y ago
  Catch-22
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
Lawtonfogle 11y ago
That would still give them unemployment benefits. We are firing them because they violated policies A (must be on time), D subsection 12 (no personal internet use), and Q subsection 7 clause 3 (15 minute break per every 4 hour shift). (That most people are allowed to get away with minor violations of the above as long as they are productive, that the fired employee was productive enough that we would've continued to ignore their minor violations, and that they are actually being targeted because we have information to indicate they are trying to become pregnant is going to be near impossible to prove. Especially since the fired employee is now unemployed and not likely able to afford the legal battle.)

danvoell 11y ago

Should we swap out "Big Data" for "Personal Information" or "Spying" in the title of this article?

sageabilly 11y ago
How is it spying if it's information that's already available to the company, either publicly or as a result of the person being an employee? It's not like they're sending goons to dig through trash cans.
- danvoell 11y ago
  Sorry, I agree, spying may be a stretch. But so too is Big Data. It doesn't take a complex algorithm to determine IsBuyingBirthControl vs. IsNotBuyingBirthControl. I would like to think that I have the option to keep this information private from my employer. The employer's best interest is to minimize costs not to improve my health, most of the time these two correspond but not always.
  - bduerst 11y ago
    Whether or not it's called big data is non-sequitur. Employers have had access to claims data before the tools were available to process it en mass.
- bootload 11y ago
  "How is it spying if it's information that's already available to the company, either publicly or as a result of the person being an employee?" Inference might be a better word.

kelvin0 11y ago

Simple, we also need a : 'Employees Harness big data to predict which employers are most likely to do crummy predictions'

kafkaesq 11y ago

...whilst maintaining the conditions that actually make them sick.

thanatropism 11y ago

Ever heard about the manager who figured that about 40% of sick leaves take place on Mondays or Fridays?

FussyZeus 11y ago

No amount of Economic benefit is worth the invasiveness of these practices. My boss doesn't need to know what medications I'm on, what kind of food I eat, or how many videogames I'm buying. If it's not occurring on company time it's none of his business, end of discussion. This creepy ass practice needs to be stopped now. If my employer ever tries anything like this, I will quit on the spot. No redemption, no change, nothing will bring me back because once it's been done one time, it WILL be done again.

FussyZeus 11y ago
Sidebar: This is why I much prefer working at a small business where employees are treated like people, not resources to be extracted and then cast aside when they no longer produce enough.
- untog 11y ago
  This is why, after years of living in the US, it still staggers me that people think your employer controlling your access to healthcare is normal and not anything to be concerned about.

zodPod 11y ago

So all I have to do is vote in a mid-term election and I'll be healthier?! </s>

adenner 11y ago

This version of the article wasn't paywalled for me: http://www.nasdaq.com/article/bosses-harness-big-data-to-predict-which-workers-might-get-sick-20160216-01321 http://www.nasdaq.com/article/bosses-harness-big-data-to-pre... It is great to think that my employer is paying for this but just got rid of our gym membership reimbursement.

brazzledazzle 11y ago
Either good ol' right hand/left hand lack of coordination/direction/information sharing or it wasn't "cost effective". Either way, you have to love corporate bullshit.

the_economist 11y ago

Hint: those workers who regularly stay out all night drinking alcohol will miss many more days of work.

AstralStorm 11y ago

Harness big data, such as typical flu season dates? Or maybe weather forecast? What, do you need precision down to the last day for planning purposes?