5 ms·

You love your day job,a startup offer with 45% equity arrived

4 points by japan9955 17y ago

sorry I'm posting this on a throwaway account. background: I'm in my mid 20,single, located in Japan and working for the-so-called high-tech corp that i don't really proud of, but I like my job. very smart people, agile, warm, and funny. I have huge passion in start-up, have an experience in working at one, and enjoyed the culture very much. on the other hand, i need job security, especially at this economic time. My close friend is trying to build his second start-up company and he needs someone like me... the offer: 1. 45%~ equity, although i haven't talk much with him about the details 2. I'll be paid by salary, albeit a very low one 3. regardless my job title, I'll be managing most of the business and technical stuff. He'll just managing his first company and be the CEO figure for this new one. 4. there're already clients ready to do business with us. 5. I like the technology and business challenges he showed me, and i think i can build a product for him. the problems: 1. by family tradition i "need" to get married fast... like before 30. committing to something like this will take most of my time. I'm sure I can handle the load, but I'm not sure my non-existent-yet SO can... 2. My friends first start-up isn't very successful one. It works, lives, profitable to employing 20~ more in 4 countries, but it is a stagnant/saturated market, the new company also in similar market with different products. I have worked in start-up in similar field which is more successful.Um, what I'm trying to say is that he is not the typical leader who you would idol, he is more likely happen to be there when opportunities come. there're many inefficiencies in how he manages people, resources, how he behave as a leader in general. I suspect this will be a problem when I want to change something the way company works etc. 3. he is my close friend, and I'm afraid doing this business with him will ruin our relationship when everything goes down. 4. I'll likely to loose market-level salary, perks, housing benefits, and going back to ramen life, which is kind of suck but okay... the biggest problem is job security, again my culture(?) and family will stand against my decision okay, I'm not sure why i post this here, but what i see that this community has lots of experience that I know nothing of. Based on your experience and my details above, what can you suggest me?

bensummers 17y ago
Do not underestimate the hard work and utter pain of a startup. Do not underestimate the joy of creating something wonderful. And be wary of recommendations from people living in a completely different culture.
- japan9955 17y ago
  As i wrote above, I have 2 years helping start-up in similar field. It's hard and everything, but somehow i enjoyed more than my current job...
  - bensummers 17y ago
    That wasn't entirely clear: "experience of working in" is a little imprecise. Was it full time work? That's very different from part time with other work supporting your speculative startup work. You sound like you want to escape the corporate world, but have doubts about the startup opportunity you have on offer.
    - japan9955 17y ago
      well, it doesn't mean that i want to escape the corporate world, it is just that by staying here at corp, i feel like i can only make little changes. i am one of those idealists that want to take challenges, even if its simple but it has direct impact to a problem. creating a new solution etc. i happen to have experience in working at start-up, it was just part-time when in university though. but i like that i can try to solve problems that is there, in business or technical stuff. this is way much different when you are in corp, especially for Japanese corp.
gexla 17y ago
"on the other hand, i need job security" This says it all, right? "and he needs someone like me..." But he could find someone else, right? I think you need to figure out why you would really be doing this. Is it to help your friend? Is it because you want to work for a startup? Or is it because you really think you could get stinking rich from this deal? Personally, only that last reason would be good enough for me to give up a stable job.
- japan9955 17y ago
  I think i should rephrase that: It is good to have job security, I don't need it that much, but my parents, friends, families will stand against my decision. Yeah. I sometimes think it as a way of helping my friend and I want so much to start new things, which i hope will give me courage to start my own start-up. I'm not hoping i could get rich fast with this deal, it is just that I have this fear to loose a stable job in this economic situation. Of course he could always find someone else if i decline his offer... but since we're good friend and he gave me good offer like this, I'm in a situation that is hard to decline it...
  - bensummers 17y ago
    "I'm in a situation that is hard to decline it..." -- make sure you say "yes" for the right reasons.
ohashi 17y ago
To me it sounds like you already know you don't want to do it and are looking to be convinced otherwise. I would go with your gut and keep your current job.
brk 17y ago
This does not sound like the makings of a good opportunity. The only really good bit you posted is the 45% equity, and that seems unrealistic to maintain over the long term. The company would most likely remain private, who would you ever sell this 45% stake to if you wanted to cash out?
- japan9955 17y ago
  yeah, i think 45% is crucial. i wont get any offer at this rate, at the same time it sounds unrealistic. it almost sound like my friend desperately need my help or otherwise the company goes down. could you explain more why the company would most likely to remain private ? I mean isn't it possible that if this company moderately take off, maybe some bigger rival will offer a buy out? I mean, this rate, 45% is like when you build a start-up with 2 founders right? for future references, we are not looking for angel investors etc. because we have the minimum capital and clients are there to make the ball rolling. I'm guessing (by looking at his character), at some point my friend will sell this company to bigger rival who is interested in. this is what i get from this 45% offer, it is like he's trying to say "let's build it together with 50-50 sharing revenue, you'll do most of the works, I provide clients and capital, if it works we can sell it and retire young" ....
hga 17y ago
The thing that most struck me was the issue of him being your friend and your wanting to keep that relationship. Given all that you've said, I'd expect at best a moderate success where you keep that friendship, with serious success (maybe) possible only at the cost of the friendship. As for your putative future SO, perhaps finding one during the crucible of a startup will be more likely to work out in the long term than finding one now and then learning she can't deal with the stresses of a startup later (it sure sounds like you like them and want to do them). Final note: In America, there's not much in the way of job security for real. I gather that's really starting to happen in Japan with the advent of this Great Recession. So you might be over-valuing your current position (not much you can do about the perception of your culture and family, that sort of thing lags reality). But everything I follow about Japan suggest that you need to be thinking out of the box for the long term ... if not this startup, perhaps another. Good luck.

4 points by japan9955 17y ago

bensummers 17y ago

Do not underestimate the hard work and utter pain of a startup. Do not underestimate the joy of creating something wonderful. And be wary of recommendations from people living in a completely different culture.

japan9955 17y ago
As i wrote above, I have 2 years helping start-up in similar field. It's hard and everything, but somehow i enjoyed more than my current job...
- bensummers 17y ago
  That wasn't entirely clear: "experience of working in" is a little imprecise. Was it full time work? That's very different from part time with other work supporting your speculative startup work. You sound like you want to escape the corporate world, but have doubts about the startup opportunity you have on offer.
  - japan9955 17y ago
    well, it doesn't mean that i want to escape the corporate world, it is just that by staying here at corp, i feel like i can only make little changes. i am one of those idealists that want to take challenges, even if its simple but it has direct impact to a problem. creating a new solution etc. i happen to have experience in working at start-up, it was just part-time when in university though. but i like that i can try to solve problems that is there, in business or technical stuff. this is way much different when you are in corp, especially for Japanese corp.

gexla 17y ago

"on the other hand, i need job security" This says it all, right? "and he needs someone like me..." But he could find someone else, right? I think you need to figure out why you would really be doing this. Is it to help your friend? Is it because you want to work for a startup? Or is it because you really think you could get stinking rich from this deal? Personally, only that last reason would be good enough for me to give up a stable job.

japan9955 17y ago
I think i should rephrase that: It is good to have job security, I don't need it that much, but my parents, friends, families will stand against my decision. Yeah. I sometimes think it as a way of helping my friend and I want so much to start new things, which i hope will give me courage to start my own start-up. I'm not hoping i could get rich fast with this deal, it is just that I have this fear to loose a stable job in this economic situation. Of course he could always find someone else if i decline his offer... but since we're good friend and he gave me good offer like this, I'm in a situation that is hard to decline it...
- bensummers 17y ago
  "I'm in a situation that is hard to decline it..." -- make sure you say "yes" for the right reasons.

ohashi 17y ago

To me it sounds like you already know you don't want to do it and are looking to be convinced otherwise. I would go with your gut and keep your current job.

brk 17y ago

This does not sound like the makings of a good opportunity. The only really good bit you posted is the 45% equity, and that seems unrealistic to maintain over the long term. The company would most likely remain private, who would you ever sell this 45% stake to if you wanted to cash out?

japan9955 17y ago
yeah, i think 45% is crucial. i wont get any offer at this rate, at the same time it sounds unrealistic. it almost sound like my friend desperately need my help or otherwise the company goes down. could you explain more why the company would most likely to remain private ? I mean isn't it possible that if this company moderately take off, maybe some bigger rival will offer a buy out? I mean, this rate, 45% is like when you build a start-up with 2 founders right? for future references, we are not looking for angel investors etc. because we have the minimum capital and clients are there to make the ball rolling. I'm guessing (by looking at his character), at some point my friend will sell this company to bigger rival who is interested in. this is what i get from this 45% offer, it is like he's trying to say "let's build it together with 50-50 sharing revenue, you'll do most of the works, I provide clients and capital, if it works we can sell it and retire young" ....

hga 17y ago

The thing that most struck me was the issue of him being your friend and your wanting to keep that relationship. Given all that you've said, I'd expect at best a moderate success where you keep that friendship, with serious success (maybe) possible only at the cost of the friendship. As for your putative future SO, perhaps finding one during the crucible of a startup will be more likely to work out in the long term than finding one now and then learning she can't deal with the stresses of a startup later (it sure sounds like you like them and want to do them). Final note: In America, there's not much in the way of job security for real. I gather that's really starting to happen in Japan with the advent of this Great Recession. So you might be over-valuing your current position (not much you can do about the perception of your culture and family, that sort of thing lags reality). But everything I follow about Japan suggest that you need to be thinking out of the box for the long term ... if not this startup, perhaps another. Good luck.