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Thanks for answering. And original question was great too. Are you a lawyer, not trying to dismiss your answer because it seems logical, but asking so that I ca

by ouiyaaa 11y ago

Thanks for answering. And original question was great too. Are you a lawyer, not trying to dismiss your answer because it seems logical, but asking so that I can ask something else

ars 11y ago
I am not a lawyer. There was a time when I spent a lot of time reading verdicts from Judges. (The higher the level of Judge the better the writing, and they are really surprisingly very readable, not full of legalese as you might expect.) Anyway, I used to think that law was mathematical, but after reading lots of verdicts I realized it was not. > but asking so that I can ask something else Ask. If I don't know, I'll tell you that.
- ouiyaaa 11y ago
  I was going to ask what happens if Apple says no! I don't know what the next step of FBI will be. What do you think? Can Apple be sued over this? Can they say okay give us the device and we will give you the data but not the actual 'modified os'? (Or we'll just have to find out?)
  - ars 11y ago
    > what happens if Apple says no. They would be fined, or executives charged with contempt of court and possible jail time. That would also make the Judge mad at them, and not likely to agree to anything they ask. The Judge has a LOT of power - he can impose some really high fines, and that's just to start with. Apple will not mess with him. > I don't know what the next step of FBI will be. Not FBI. If the Judge says to do it (so far he has not), he will be the one making sure they do it. The FBI will just complain to the Judge if necessary, not actually do anything. > Can they say okay give us the device and we will give you the data but not the actual 'modified os'? They can ask the Judge if they can do that. It's up to the Judge to say yes or no. They'll probably have to explain why it's better that way, and that the end result would be the same. The FBI can then argue against it, (or accept it). The Judge will listen to both sides and explain his reasoning in a paper. You might want to try to read all the stuff the Judge writes in this case. Ignore what the lawyers for Apple or FBI write, read just what the Judge writes (he will summarize what the lawyers wrote, so you won't miss anything).
    - ouiyaaa 11y ago
      Thank you for taking the time to reply. That is what I wanted to know.

by ouiyaaa 11y ago

Thanks for answering. And original question was great too. Are you a lawyer, not trying to dismiss your answer because it seems logical, but asking so that I can ask something else

ars 11y ago

I am not a lawyer. There was a time when I spent a lot of time reading verdicts from Judges. (The higher the level of Judge the better the writing, and they are really surprisingly very readable, not full of legalese as you might expect.) Anyway, I used to think that law was mathematical, but after reading lots of verdicts I realized it was not. > but asking so that I can ask something else Ask. If I don't know, I'll tell you that.

ouiyaaa 11y ago
I was going to ask what happens if Apple says no! I don't know what the next step of FBI will be. What do you think? Can Apple be sued over this? Can they say okay give us the device and we will give you the data but not the actual 'modified os'? (Or we'll just have to find out?)
- ars 11y ago
  > what happens if Apple says no. They would be fined, or executives charged with contempt of court and possible jail time. That would also make the Judge mad at them, and not likely to agree to anything they ask. The Judge has a LOT of power - he can impose some really high fines, and that's just to start with. Apple will not mess with him. > I don't know what the next step of FBI will be. Not FBI. If the Judge says to do it (so far he has not), he will be the one making sure they do it. The FBI will just complain to the Judge if necessary, not actually do anything. > Can they say okay give us the device and we will give you the data but not the actual 'modified os'? They can ask the Judge if they can do that. It's up to the Judge to say yes or no. They'll probably have to explain why it's better that way, and that the end result would be the same. The FBI can then argue against it, (or accept it). The Judge will listen to both sides and explain his reasoning in a paper. You might want to try to read all the stuff the Judge writes in this case. Ignore what the lawyers for Apple or FBI write, read just what the Judge writes (he will summarize what the lawyers wrote, so you won't miss anything).
  - ouiyaaa 11y ago
    Thank you for taking the time to reply. That is what I wanted to know.