4 ms·

Not too sure about this. Keep in mind that in most commercially sold Android phones, closed source, self updating, Google Play Services is installed by the manu

by firloop 11y ago

Not too sure about this. Keep in mind that in most commercially sold Android phones, closed source, self updating, Google Play Services is installed by the manufacturer with system level privileges. That alone is enough to create a non insignificant back door.

rms_returns 11y ago
But you can always root your phone and install Cyanogenmod from scratch, right? Agreed that this is not too trivial right now because of standardization issues, but it could be done if you really care about privacy.
- cyphar 11y ago
  Not all of CyanogenMod is free software (you still have a bunch of binary blobs, and everyone has to use Google Play Services anyway because every app seems to implicitly require it). Replicant would be a much better alternative if it actually supported anything newer than 2G.
  - ionised 11y ago
    > and everyone has to use Google Play Services anyway This isn't true. You can stick to app repositories like F-Droid and use Raccoon to download Play Store apps via your desktop without using a Google account on your phone.
    - noarchy 11y ago
      It is true that you can get Play Store apps without a Google Account, but the Place Services framework does a lot more than this. Many apps rely upon the framework for certain pieces of functionality from Google's libraries.
      - ionised 11y ago
        You mean Google Apps specifically? I don't use them personally but I imagine Goole Now, GMail and Google Maps would need Play Services. The apps I do use (non-google) tend to function well enough without Play Services though.
        thelibrarian 11y ago
        Many Android apps include the Google Play Services framework in themselves, as they provide extra functionality that is not in the baseline Android API, e.g. a JSON parser.
    - 5ilv3r 11y ago
      Fdroid is wonderful. They even strip ads from otherwise foss projects since the licenses are usually not compatible.
  - chei0aiV 11y ago
    Replicant supports 3G devices: https://www.replicant.us/supported-devices.php https://www.replicant.us/supported-devices.php
tomaskafka 11y ago
Or, said differently, Play Services are already a backdoor. They can (and do) install updates or other software pushed by server automatically, without you being able to do anything about it. And they have access to anything on the phone.
- em3rgent0rdr 11y ago
  F-DROID
- curt15 11y ago
  And it can reportedly grant itself new permissions without the user's knowledge, bypassing a fundamental security mechanism of Android (any Android devs know how this is done?). http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/09/balky-carriers-and-slow-oems-step-aside-google-is-defragging-android/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/09/balky-carriers-and-sl...
  - kennydude 11y ago
    Google Play Store manages the permission dialog for apps installed via Play Store (Play Services is one). It just doesn't show it for Play Services and just auto-accepts installation.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]

by firloop 11y ago

rms_returns 11y ago

But you can always root your phone and install Cyanogenmod from scratch, right? Agreed that this is not too trivial right now because of standardization issues, but it could be done if you really care about privacy.

cyphar 11y ago
Not all of CyanogenMod is free software (you still have a bunch of binary blobs, and everyone has to use Google Play Services anyway because every app seems to implicitly require it). Replicant would be a much better alternative if it actually supported anything newer than 2G.
- ionised 11y ago
  > and everyone has to use Google Play Services anyway This isn't true. You can stick to app repositories like F-Droid and use Raccoon to download Play Store apps via your desktop without using a Google account on your phone.
  - noarchy 11y ago
    It is true that you can get Play Store apps without a Google Account, but the Place Services framework does a lot more than this. Many apps rely upon the framework for certain pieces of functionality from Google's libraries.
    - ionised 11y ago
      You mean Google Apps specifically? I don't use them personally but I imagine Goole Now, GMail and Google Maps would need Play Services. The apps I do use (non-google) tend to function well enough without Play Services though.
      - thelibrarian 11y ago
        Many Android apps include the Google Play Services framework in themselves, as they provide extra functionality that is not in the baseline Android API, e.g. a JSON parser.
  - 5ilv3r 11y ago
    Fdroid is wonderful. They even strip ads from otherwise foss projects since the licenses are usually not compatible.
- chei0aiV 11y ago
  Replicant supports 3G devices: https://www.replicant.us/supported-devices.php https://www.replicant.us/supported-devices.php

tomaskafka 11y ago

Or, said differently, Play Services are already a backdoor. They can (and do) install updates or other software pushed by server automatically, without you being able to do anything about it. And they have access to anything on the phone.

em3rgent0rdr 11y ago
F-DROID
curt15 11y ago
And it can reportedly grant itself new permissions without the user's knowledge, bypassing a fundamental security mechanism of Android (any Android devs know how this is done?). http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/09/balky-carriers-and-slow-oems-step-aside-google-is-defragging-android/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/09/balky-carriers-and-sl...
- kennydude 11y ago
  Google Play Store manages the permission dialog for apps installed via Play Store (Play Services is one). It just doesn't show it for Play Services and just auto-accepts installation.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]