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The movie Amadeus is about god-given genius versus mere human skill, and Mozart and Saliere are used in the movie as archtypes representing each. It is not inte

by olavk 11y ago

The movie Amadeus is about god-given genius versus mere human skill, and Mozart and Saliere are used in the movie as archtypes representing each. It is not intended to be historical, and the relationship between the two composers were totally different in real life. It's a great movie, but it is not very historical correct, and does not intend to be.

visarga 11y ago
Poor Salieri. Two hundred years after his death, he is loaded with such fake history. Also, too bad that the movie itself is so captivating that one almost wishes it was true.
ekianjo 11y ago
It's certainly not accurate, but the characters are totally believable and there's nothing that does not make sense as long as you accept the premise of the movie. And the inclusion of Mozart's score is brilliant from beginning to end.
- BogusIKnow 11y ago
  "It's certainly not accurate, but the characters are totally believable" This is the major danger and trap all these films fall into. Our imagination of the past after decades of these films has nothing to do with reality.
- pervycreeper 11y ago
  Tom Hulce's portrayal of a cultured, clever, hardworking man as some kind of ethereal buffoon couldn't have been farther from reality. The false picture that it presents of talent would be harmful to those that it might have influenced. The defense that the characters were meant to be iconic stand-ins is also undermined by the inclusion of so much accurate trivia (in addition to the many inaccuracies)
  - pluteoid 11y ago
    The character of Mozart in Amadeus is more frivolous, more alcoholic and more undisciplined than the real Mozart could have been, given his extraordinary compositional output over such a short lifespan. But the film also shows Mozart taking his art incredibly seriously and with a sense of great dignity. He's determined to make time for working very hard (even as he lays dying in bed), and fights movingly and eloquently for the commission of works he passionately wants to create. And that passion is shown to be driven by a need to express vital things about the human condition, with all its weaknesses and sense of fun and as well as its sublimity. He's not just a buffoon, the character has real depth. The real Mozart on the other hand, as we know him from his letters, did have a penchant for the vulgar, for the irreverent, for scatalogical humor, for good booze, for pretty ladies, and all the rest of it. Of course that's just one side of him. Young musicians aren't so incredibly stupid as to be "harmed" by Amadeus – it's clearly entertainment. One of its messages is that you can dedicate yourself absolutely to the development of your art while retaining a sense of playfulness. Another message is simply that this music is incredibly rich and exciting and profound, music you can explore for a lifetime.
  - zepto 11y ago
    Sounds like a criticism that could be made of the Sorkin Steve Jobs movie.
  - olavk 11y ago
    Almost every movie depicting famous artists have the problem that they rarely show the artist actually working - because this is really boring to look at. Performing artists like musicians, dancers etc. are more entertaining to look at, but writers, painters, mathematicians, scientists etc. are not cinematic. Composing is not very cinematic either, unless you use narrative tricks like intercutting with performance of the finished piece. So in order to be watchable, the movies instead focus on the artists personality and private life, and the actual work part is reduced to the cliche of a flash-of-inspiration followed by a short montage of frenzied all-night work, resulting in finished masterpiece. This is of course an unrealistic depiction of the artistic process. The movie Amadeus makes a point out of how effortless Mozart creates as opposed to Salieri who has to struggle and only gets mediocre results. This is really the romantic myth of the inspired genius, and by playing up the silliness of Mozart, the movie shows genius as a divine gift wholly separate from the persons daily life. Showing Mozart practicing, struggle, making false starts, iteratively improving, having to scrap work etc. would undermine the message of the movie. This is the absolute opposite of the modern 10K hours myth which states that anyone can be a genius through hard work and dedication.
fiatjaf 11y ago
What do you mean? I'm interested. Do you hace a link to a longer essay on the topic?
shiro 11y ago
To be precise, the film is based on a stage play and character portrayal came from it, too. The theme of genius vs mere human can be traced back further, to Pushkin's short play "Mozart and Salieri" in 1830 [1]. But I agree that the movie is so good that many people would take it as "based on true story". [1] https://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/p/pushkin/aleksandr/p98mo/ https://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/p/pushkin/aleksandr/p98mo/

by olavk 11y ago

visarga 11y ago

Poor Salieri. Two hundred years after his death, he is loaded with such fake history. Also, too bad that the movie itself is so captivating that one almost wishes it was true.

ekianjo 11y ago

It's certainly not accurate, but the characters are totally believable and there's nothing that does not make sense as long as you accept the premise of the movie. And the inclusion of Mozart's score is brilliant from beginning to end.

BogusIKnow 11y ago
"It's certainly not accurate, but the characters are totally believable" This is the major danger and trap all these films fall into. Our imagination of the past after decades of these films has nothing to do with reality.
pervycreeper 11y ago
Tom Hulce's portrayal of a cultured, clever, hardworking man as some kind of ethereal buffoon couldn't have been farther from reality. The false picture that it presents of talent would be harmful to those that it might have influenced. The defense that the characters were meant to be iconic stand-ins is also undermined by the inclusion of so much accurate trivia (in addition to the many inaccuracies)
- pluteoid 11y ago
  The character of Mozart in Amadeus is more frivolous, more alcoholic and more undisciplined than the real Mozart could have been, given his extraordinary compositional output over such a short lifespan. But the film also shows Mozart taking his art incredibly seriously and with a sense of great dignity. He's determined to make time for working very hard (even as he lays dying in bed), and fights movingly and eloquently for the commission of works he passionately wants to create. And that passion is shown to be driven by a need to express vital things about the human condition, with all its weaknesses and sense of fun and as well as its sublimity. He's not just a buffoon, the character has real depth. The real Mozart on the other hand, as we know him from his letters, did have a penchant for the vulgar, for the irreverent, for scatalogical humor, for good booze, for pretty ladies, and all the rest of it. Of course that's just one side of him. Young musicians aren't so incredibly stupid as to be "harmed" by Amadeus – it's clearly entertainment. One of its messages is that you can dedicate yourself absolutely to the development of your art while retaining a sense of playfulness. Another message is simply that this music is incredibly rich and exciting and profound, music you can explore for a lifetime.
- zepto 11y ago
  Sounds like a criticism that could be made of the Sorkin Steve Jobs movie.
- olavk 11y ago
  Almost every movie depicting famous artists have the problem that they rarely show the artist actually working - because this is really boring to look at. Performing artists like musicians, dancers etc. are more entertaining to look at, but writers, painters, mathematicians, scientists etc. are not cinematic. Composing is not very cinematic either, unless you use narrative tricks like intercutting with performance of the finished piece. So in order to be watchable, the movies instead focus on the artists personality and private life, and the actual work part is reduced to the cliche of a flash-of-inspiration followed by a short montage of frenzied all-night work, resulting in finished masterpiece. This is of course an unrealistic depiction of the artistic process. The movie Amadeus makes a point out of how effortless Mozart creates as opposed to Salieri who has to struggle and only gets mediocre results. This is really the romantic myth of the inspired genius, and by playing up the silliness of Mozart, the movie shows genius as a divine gift wholly separate from the persons daily life. Showing Mozart practicing, struggle, making false starts, iteratively improving, having to scrap work etc. would undermine the message of the movie. This is the absolute opposite of the modern 10K hours myth which states that anyone can be a genius through hard work and dedication.

fiatjaf 11y ago

What do you mean? I'm interested. Do you hace a link to a longer essay on the topic?

shiro 11y ago

To be precise, the film is based on a stage play and character portrayal came from it, too. The theme of genius vs mere human can be traced back further, to Pushkin's short play "Mozart and Salieri" in 1830 [1]. But I agree that the movie is so good that many people would take it as "based on true story". [1] https://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/p/pushkin/aleksandr/p98mo/ https://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/p/pushkin/aleksandr/p98mo/