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Funding Django is not an act of charity, it's an investment
- cbertschy 11y agoI approve this message :-)
- DanieleProcida 11y agoIf you rely on Django or another open-source project, can you afford not to help fund it?
- stefanfoulis 11y agoDeveloping software means you're standing on the shoulders of the opensource giants. Let's feed them from time to time :-)
- collinmanderson 11y agoIt's amazing what the Django Software Foundation was able to accomplish with the recent fundraising. It has greatly increased the project's reliability and stability. Let's keep it up. :)
- iyn 11y agoAn indirect way to support Django is to use products and/or services of its sponsors: https://www.djangoproject.com/foundation/corporate-members/ https://www.djangoproject.com/foundation/corporate-members/
- miiiiiike 11y agoIt's like chipping in $10 for a bag of artisinal coconut chips on Kiskstarter, but instead of getting a bag chips you get a mature web framework. And maybe artisinal coconut chips.. I don't know, I've never been to DjangoCon.
- DanieleProcida 11y agoAlso, the more people who enjoy the bag of chips, the better, unlike with actual chips.
- miiiiiike 11y agoJoin us now and share the software..
- Scarblac 11y agoThere are rumours of stroopwafels.
- quadrangle 11y ago"like" in that $10 is $10. Otherwise, totally unlike in every way. Django is a public good (non-exclusive, non-rivalrous, everyone can share), coconut chips are private goods (exclusive, consumed). Nobody adds expenses to Django by becoming a user. But somehow the costs that are stable regardless still need to get covered.
- jcoffland 11y agoIf you've ever run an Open-Source project then you know that users do often increase the costs. They tend to ask questions which they expect to be answered for free even if it costs you time and time is money.
- quadrangle 11y agoI do run Open Source projects. I do not buy the argument that more users inherently increase costs. Users also answer questions or contribute otherwise. And you can completely discard and ignore their questions if you wish and it still doesn't stop the software from working. You can even put out an Open Source project somewhere anonymously and provide no contact information. Support for users has costs as there are more users. I happen to volunteer my time supporting users because I think it leads to better long-term success for the project. But regardless, each user has capacity to not ask for any support or to ask for it. I'm sure there are some Django users who never ask for support. If someone comes along and uses Django and has no questions, it is totally unlike someone coming along and eating all the coconut.
- travjones 11y ago>> "...a solid, stable, secure and powerful web application framework..." I think this quote sums up Django very well. I would guess that a large chunk of externally facing and internally facing web apps use django (e.g., apps at Mozilla [0]). Anyone have a link to numbers? It would be neat to quantify the prevalence of frameworks on the net. Someone must have done this already. [0]: https://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2015/dec/11/django-awarded-moss-grant/ https://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2015/dec/11/django-awar...
- Everhusk 11y ago669 stacks on stackshare http://stackshare.io/django http://stackshare.io/django and for comparison: 2.2k rails http://stackshare.io/rails http://stackshare.io/rails 2.34k node.js http://stackshare.io/nodejs http://stackshare.io/nodejs
- travjones 11y agoThanks for the data. I guess rails and node are "hotter," but I'm still not convinced because it appears that stackshare relies on self report (which we all know is pretty fallible). Further, selection bias could be at play in these data. For example, individuals more likely to report their stack on stackshare might be the same individuals more likely to use rails or node. Still, at least we've got some numbers.
- cholantesh 11y agoWell, .NET is under 600, and Meteor is over 1k, which I find dubious.
- aprdm 11y agowhat's stack share and how does it compute the numbers? also rails has a much bigger adoption in ruby community and node in javascript community than django in the python community (I would guess). lots of people using flask, tornado or other frameworks now a days
- superuser2 11y ago
- dkyc 11y agoI think this comment by patio11 is very relevant here: "We don't donate to OSS software which we use, because we're legally not allowed to. I routinely send key projects, particularly smaller projects, a request to quote me a commercial license of their project, with the explanation that I would accept a quote of $1,000 and that the commercial license can be their existing OSS license plus an invoice. My books suggest we've spent $3k on this in 2015. My bookkeeper, accountant, and the IRS/NTA are united on this issue: they don't care whether a software license is OSS or not. A $1k invoice is a $1k invoice; as a software company, I have virtually carte blanche to expense any software I think is reasonably required, and I think our OSS is reasonably required. I would do this more often if OSS projects made it easier for me to do so. Getting me to pay $1,000 for software is easy; committing me to doing lots of admin work over the course of a week is less easy. Take a look at what e.g. http://sidekiq.org/ http://sidekiq.org/ , which is an OSS project with a commercial model, does. Two clicks gets me to a credit card form. If I actually used Sidekiq, Mike would have had my credit card on file the day that form went up." (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10863939 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10863939)
- DanieleProcida 11y agoThanks, that is a very interesting insight. We'll see what we can do with it...
- JoeAltmaier 11y agoLegally not allowed? You can donate to anybody you please I would think. Anyway I'm all for using software you pay for, because it has a higher probability of being around next year. One person donating a responsible amount is not going to guarantee that. Its a start I guess.
- DanieleProcida 11y agoUsing software you pay for, or pay for software you use? In the end, the money goes to the same place.
- 11y ago
- kmfrk 11y agoWagtail is one of the most interesting Django projects at the moment (https://wagtail.io https://wagtail.io). A great attempt to make CMSes as useable as humanly possible, which can't be said for WordPress, Drupal, and the usual fare.
- sergiotapia 11y agoWordpress exploded in popularity largely in part because it's easy to use.
- acdha 11y agoI wish the OP had used less sweeping terminology – WordPress is definitely easy to install but keeping it running, customizing it, and staying secure are all areas where reasonable people can have different opinions. It'd be nice if people didn't slag off other projects but instead mentioned what they'd found better/worse about the one they're recommending.
- kmfrk 11y agoCompared to what, though? The alternatives are garbage, but projects like Wagtail (and Jekyll-based CloudCannon) are changing that.
- teh_klev 11y agoCoupled with the fact that anyone who can use an FTP client can just throw up a copy of WordPress onto a shared hoster and get going....PHP+MySQL is ubiquitous in this market. In fact, it's even easier than that, many shared hosters run automatic installers that grab the latest WordPress and unzip it into your shared host website htdocs folder and it's just point, click, bish, bash, bosh...you're good to go. Fancy selling your home made widgets? Just add WooCommerce which supports the most popular payment gateways (PayPal, Stripe, Braintree, WorldPay etc). And provided you stick with plugins and themes that are well known, well maintained, play nice with the official WordPress hooks, get security updates, and keep on top of WordPress updates it's reasonably secure. Sure, WordPress may not be "sexy" but for non-developers you can get a lot of things done in not a lot of time.
- mrfusion 11y agoI'd like to see something like celery built in. But easier to use and doesn't need a separate db. Is it possinlble to fund that like south was?
- passwert 11y agoOut of curiosity: How would you do that - "easier" and without separate DB?
- mrfusion 11y agoNot require everything to go into a tasks.py file. And I don't see why such a system can't use the existing db?
- piquadrat 11y agoDjango Channels, which is slated for inclusion in one of the next Django releases, covers at least some of the use cases you'd traditionally use Celery for, specifically running code after returning a response. It does require Redis for this though. https://channels.readthedocs.org/en/latest/ https://channels.readthedocs.org/en/latest/
- mrfusion 11y agoNeat! I couldn't find an example of doing a background task from a view with channels. Any ideas?
- fleetfox 11y agoIsn't celery plug and play nowadays? If you need a something simpler take a look at django-rq. I don't think a serious job queue is possbile with RDBMS as backend.
- mrfusion 11y agoWhat's so special about a job queue that it can't use an rdbms? I never understood that.
- mixonic 11y agoI've been pondering corporate roles in modern OSS projects for a few months, especially those in projects that have no single owner. Supporting developers or community members of an OSS project your company uses through employee time or financial means is less of an investment, and more of a hedge. You've picked up a product off the shelf, however that product has a future direction decided by a number of people in a community. A company that chooses not (through inaction or action) to participate in the project is relying on the existing powers-that be, and their existing influences, to make decisions that will benefit the company. This is a risk. A company that chooses to participate cannot control a decentralized project, but they can absolutely influence the software and community by choosing what projects to fund, what kind of roles to hire for, what projects to sponsor, and what to publicly talk about. This influence nudges the community in directions beneficial to the company, and ensures the project doesn't head in a different direction. For example in the last year the Ember.js community has seen an influx of larger companies hiring positions that include OSS time for employees. Large companies sponsoring OSS work is becoming more common. This means the parts of Ember that benefit large company needs (lots of devices, big dev teams) are getting more focus. The transition is exciting and fascinating to observe. Support OSS projects important to your company, or accept the risk that comes with allowing foundational parts of your business to be managed by others (without your needs in mind).
- brianwawok 11y agoKind of unrelated to the topic.. but I recently checked out Django for the first time ever recently (I know, 5 years late) - and was impressed. It has a lot of the things I like in web development with mostly sane defaults (most insane thing found so far: Closing database connection after each request, really?). Edit - Yes I know you can change config to keep connection open, but as a default for prod mode it seemed rather weird ;) Still fighting the internal battle that I know I like better compile time checking (ala Scala), but having changes happen so fast in dev is pretty freakin nice...
- wahnfrieden 11y agoNot sure what you saw - look into Django connection pooling.
- neokya 11y agoNo, that's fixed since 1.6 release. You can keep database connection persistent, just change the default setting https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/settings/#conn-max-age https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/settings/#conn-max... By default, it uses historical behavior.
- piquadrat 11y agoJust for reference, Django has had support for persistent connections for quite a while now. It's disabled by default due to backwards compatibility considerations. https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.9/ref/databases/#persistent-connections https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.9/ref/databases/#persist...
- brianwawok 11y agoOh I know, I was talking about sane "defaults".. i.e. if you don't touch the config, the default seems silly. Makes sense to close it in dev, but in default prod? Not sane.
- piquadrat 11y agoI figured you were aware of the feature itself. I just wanted to clarify for people unfamiliar with Django that it does support persistent connections, even if they are disabled by default :)
- booop 11y agoCan we see the Django Software Foundation's latest Form 990?
- ubernostrum 11y agoInformation on how to do that here: https://www.djangoproject.com/foundation/records/ https://www.djangoproject.com/foundation/records/
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- danjoc 11y agoI can't help but wonder if Django wouldn't do better with a multi-licensing strategy like MongoDB uses. Asking for donations typically doesn't work out so well. I see a lot of underfunded open source projects. The whole internet seems to run on them. OpenSSL was one prominent example. I don't think it is coincidence that they are almost always BSD type licenses. To me BSD licensing just seems like the starving artist living on the good will of a few wealthy donors. Donors who frequently end up steering the project. Multi-licensing seems like a healthier approach.
- jsmeaton 11y agoYou're right, and the Django Software Foundation (along with projects like BeeWare) are actively trying to work out how to solve these problems. DSF has hired a part time "director of advancement", Adrienne Lowe, to try to get money back into Django. https://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2015/nov/23/introducing-dsfs-director-advancement/ https://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2015/nov/23/introducing...
- tedmiston 11y agoFood for thought - As a prospective employee, I'd more likely want to work at a company whose name I saw on the corporate sponsors page (of Django, or whatever framework they use).
- pankajdoharey 11y agoI dont see the point, Rails already solves the problems that Dj-ango is trying to solve again. Rails/ruby combo already solves the problem in a very elegant way. There is no need for another half baked solution that tries to solve the same problem.
- DanieleProcida 11y agoDjango's been around for a pretty long time. Projects like Django and Rails need each other. If there were just one dominant web application framework, it would stagnate.